The divorce and remarriage question

[Smalcald]

Butero i respect your even handed and reasonable approach in your posts previous, but i think you err in your advice to ElizabethT in that adultery an exception to divorce.

why does Jesus command forgiveness 70 X 7 and say unforgiveness will bar us from heaven, call all divorce "hardness of heart" and point us back to Genesis stating "what God has joined together, let no man cut in two" and then contradict himself by opening up a way for divorce as opposed to a miracle of faith. Many today have believed in the face of seeming extreme odds for the return and or salvation of a wayward spouse, not to be disappointed.

At the risk of seeming overbearing and some sort of authority which im not, i urge you to consider that the only exception is for those marriages that were unlawful due to Porneia/fornication, such as incest or deceit before the actual consumation of marriage, where the woman was found not to be a virgin if infact that was her claim.

There is no law about marrying a non virgin(former fornicator,prostitute or or such), and it is better that they marry if they indeed they have repented and never stray or divorce.

How does a couple know what is lawful, who do they go to for advice and who will grant this marriage or divorce? Really this is very complex, most Christian couples are not going to understand what to do. These really look like case by case situations from what I can tell.

[JCISGD]

Butero i respect your even handed and reasonable approach in your posts previous, but i think you err in your advice to ElizabethT in that adultery an exception to divorce.

why does Jesus command forgiveness 70 X 7 and say unforgiveness will bar us from heaven, call all divorce "hardness of heart" and point us back to Genesis stating "what God has joined together, let no man cut in two" and then contradict himself by opening up a way for divorce as opposed to a miracle of faith. Many today have believed in the face of seeming extreme odds for the return and or salvation of a wayward spouse, not to be disappointed.

At the risk of seeming overbearing and some sort of authority which im not, i urge you to consider that the only exception is for those marriages that were unlawful due to Porneia/fornication, such as incest or deceit before the actual consumation of marriage, where the woman was found not to be a virgin if infact that was her claim.

There is no law about marrying a non virgin(former fornicator,prostitute or or such), and it is better that they marry if they indeed they have repented and never stray or divorce.

How does a couple know what is lawful, who do they go to for advice and who will grant this marriage or divorce? Really this is very complex, most Christian couples are not going to understand what to do. These really look like case by case situations from what I can tell.

Im open to correction but thats relativeism isnt it? Where there is an express command in scripture we are libel to find out its intention and application. While it appears it is so muddied that the untrained person cannot sort it out for themselves, it is only by listening to comentators that we are decieved.

When i was first saved the commands against adultery in the gospels by Jesus seemed very clear, it was only by listening to the twisters that the voice of the Holy Spirit in me was silenced.

If we go to a foreign country ignorance of their laws can still lead to stiff penalties, and the adverse consequences for divorce and adultery are not set aside by God. In Isaiah I think? it says adultery brings a curse upon the land, something my fathers land definatley has despite his ignorance and denial of God. Proverbs has plenty to say about its consequences also.

Pain is designed to tell us something is wrong, and todays liberal society is definatly experiencing the pain of broken families and social breakdown.

The bible often puts the obligation on us to seek and sort out right from wrong and accepting every pastors word is also warned against.

[BigBert]

Butero i respect your even handed and reasonable approach in your posts previous, but i think you err in your advice to ElizabethT in that adultery an exception to divorce.

why does Jesus command forgiveness 70 X 7 and say unforgiveness will bar us from heaven, call all divorce "hardness of heart" and point us back to Genesis stating "what God has joined together, let no man cut in two" and then contradict himself by opening up a way for divorce as opposed to a miracle of faith. Many today have believed in the face of seeming extreme odds for the return and or salvation of a wayward spouse, not to be disappointed.

At the risk of seeming overbearing and some sort of authority which im not, i urge you to consider that the only exception is for those marriages that were unlawful due to Porneia/fornication, such as incest or deceit before the actual consumation of marriage, where the woman was found not to be a virgin if infact that was her claim.

There is no law about marrying a non virgin(former fornicator,prostitute or or such), and it is better that they marry if they indeed they have repented and never stray or divorce.

How does a couple know what is lawful, who do they go to for advice and who will grant this marriage or divorce? Really this is very complex, most Christian couples are not going to understand what to do. These really look like case by case situations from what I can tell.

Actually, as our discussion the other marriage-divorce thread indicated, this is indeed a more complex issue than one may prefer it to be, if we're fully willing to consider all aspects of it--without falling into the trap of rationale for our selfish purposes, which JC naturally is concerned about.

[~Shalhevet~]

It's funny that everyone here has beliefs, opinions and thoughts but no scriptures. Where in the Bible does it say remarriage is okay in cases other than death of a spouse? Show me the scripture.

[sheya joie]

It's funny that everyone here has beliefs, opinions and thoughts but no scriptures. Where in the Bible does it say remarriage is okay in cases other than death of a spouse? Show me the scripture.

1Co 7:27 Art thou bound unto a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife.

1Co 7:28

But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned

; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. Nevertheless such shall have trouble in the flesh: but I spare you.

[~Shalhevet~]

1Co 7:27 Art thou bound unto a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife.

1Co 7:28

But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned

; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. Nevertheless such shall have trouble in the flesh: but I spare you.

Prime example of taking scripture out of context. I would be very careful with that. ahem...false teaching. If you were to read the entire chapter, these particular verses are directed only towards the Unmarried and Widows.

Anyone else have any scriptures on remarriage?

[sheya joie]

1Co 7:27 Art thou bound unto a wife? seek not to be loosed. Art thou loosed from a wife? seek not a wife.

1Co 7:28

But and if thou marry, thou hast not sinned

; and if a virgin marry, she hath not sinned. Nevertheless such shall have trouble in the flesh: but I spare you.

Prime example of taking scripture out of context. I would be very careful with that. ahem...false teaching. If you were to read the entire chapter, these particular verses are directed only towards the Unmarried and Widows.

Anyone else have any scriptures on remarriage?

? These are consecutive verses; how is the 'thou' in verse 28 not the same person as the 'thou' in verse 27?

[~Shalhevet~]

You need to reread the chapter. It does not apply to this topic.

[JCISGD]

It's funny that everyone here has beliefs, opinions and thoughts but no scriptures. Where in the Bible does it say remarriage is okay in cases other than death of a spouse? Show me the scripture.

Thats it exactly ASC, it is not there other than by supposed implication and that being very subjective and therefore doubtful. While some may think those against remmarriage want to be legal and sentence divorced people to a life of misery, for myself i just want to hold to Gods standard for us and society. If this has an adverse consequence for anyone, we are called to wear it for the greater good of all knowing that God will reward faithfulness and fill up any lack we incur if and only if we go His way.

The only supposed implicated allowance for remmarriage are the allowance for divorce by Moses to a rebellious and stubborn people, the supposed allowance if our spouse is sexually immoral in Math 5:32 + 19:9, and the supposed allowance in 1 Cor 7:15 where Paul says to let an unbelieving spouse depart.

But can any of these sanction divorce and be safely used to ok remmarriage, in the light of the clear commands that marriage is untill death, with seperation as the only clear allowance, and that for reasons of sanity and safety.

IMO A believer is to wait and believe for God to work and bring a change of heart to the wayward or abusive spouse 1 Cor 7:16 and Rom 7:2+3.

I myself could wish this was not so as it is not easy, but let us honestly search the scriptures and obey. It is the long list of adverse consequences from divorce and remmarriage that we see in todays society and in my own family and life, that has forced me to face it square on.

[BigBert]

sorry, but the thread on marriage and divorce delved into many scriptures pertaining to this subject. The problem came about more due to interpretation than a total dearth of any possible reasons for divorce allowance.

Like with many such subjects, it's actually far more complex (in terms of understanding the culture, the precise Greek and Hebrew, etc) than either the hard line or the overly permissive would prefer to believe.

I'm actually with you two in terms of battling against easy-way-out divorce. What I have a problem with as well, though, is the lack of grace on the subject in some quarters when actual study of the spirit of the law as well as particularly passages within said may well lead to less circulation-killing criteria.

Edited August 31, 2009 by BigBert