Just Curious

[Openly Curious]

Andy,

I see now where my confusion came from (the "they" being SDA between you and man) please accept my apologies, but I sincerly thought you were addressing me. Everything makes sense now.

[Massorite]

Jude 1:9

CWB - "In contrast to these ungodly men is the Lord Jesus Christ, also called Michael, the archangel in charge of the entire angelic host. When He was challenged by Satan about His intentions to resurrect Moses, He didn't come against Satan with a blistering attack nor did he belittle him. He simply said, 'God rejects your claim to his body.'"

I would like to hear your thoughts.

Your reading an altered bible. Nowhere in any other bible does it say that Jesus and Michael the archangel are the same. Throw it in the trash.

[~candice~]

Who is "they"?

SDA

Andy,

I see now where my confusion came from (the "they" being SDA between you and man) please accept my apologies, but I sincerly thought you were addressing me. Everything makes sense now.

God bless you sis

[Guest lovinghim4ever]

I have no idea where they got the notion that Jesus was Michael.

There's a couple of very well known denominations that teach that.

What are your thoughts on that teaching?

I have never heard this teaching, but now that I have . . .

[Guest man]

Numbers 23

19

[Guest man]

Who is "they"?

SDA

Man are you sure about this, it sounds more like a teaching of the Jehovah Witness. I didn't think that the Seven Day Adventist taught this.

You are correct, the Jehovah Witness also teach this.

Do a search on SDA false teachings.

[~candice~]

Numbers 23

19

[~candice~]

I'm not demanding that people be "fixed" before they come to the "fixer", but that passage up there should serve as a reminder to those who believe that only certain "essentials" are required for salvation.

Yes you are. You are saying that no one who doubt, or believes a lie, can be saved. I can quote you in big bold red font. You must understand that this renewing of the mind occurs constantly throughout the Christian walk and cannot be a precondition to salvation.

It is my belief that the Word of God should never be questioned. If there is something between Genesis 1:1 and Revelation 22:21 that I refuse to believe and reject, I could very well be one of those people in the above passage.

I don't claim to have full understanding of His Word. There are many things that are confusing to me, but there is one thing I am absolutely sure of, and that's that everything in that book is the truth. If it states that God created man from the dust of the earth, I believe that.

I wish it were never questioned either. But look at the OSAS v's OSNAS debates here. Look at the threads on tongues. On Calvinism. On creation. The Word is not fully understood by anyone. Demanding a full and complete understanding of scripture (which is required to not believe any lie) for salvation is not found in the Word and is an addition by you. You place a yoke on people that the Lord does not.

If it states that I can be condemned eventhough I believe in the "essentials", I believe that.

Where does it say that???

I don't take the issue of salvation for granted. I will never say I'm going to heaven because I believe in the "essentials". That would be arrogant on my part. That's what I believe. If you choose not to believe that, that's your business.

Actually, you are making it everyone's business by declaring people unsaved for not believing as you do.

You have thus far avoided refuting my arguments based on the passages from Romans and John. The bible tells us what we must believe and do to be saved. And those essentials do not list a full complete error free doubt free view on the bible. While I wish everyone did believe it, it is not a precondition on salvation but rather something the Holy Spirit can do in a person. Some people have this heart and mind change prior to salvation and it is something that draws them to salvation. Others have this specific heart / mind change constantly after salvation.

You also make it sound as if I am advocating the dismissal of non essential doctrinal beliefs in scripture. I am not doing that at all. I am only pointing out what is required for salvation by the Word itself. Not by the opinion of man.

It is also my belief that there is no such thing as "non essential doctrine" within the Word. If it's non essential, it's not in there.

If there's something you feel I haven't covered, feel free to ask.

See above.

God bless,

Andy

[Guest man]

Wrong again. It isn't their beliefs that condemned them. It was their unbelief and their disobedience.

Exactly my point.

As for the rest.....I'll let you have it. You can be the winner.

It's not worth bickering over.

[~candice~]

It's not worth bickering over.

God bless, man.