Where does "Grace" end

[mizzdy]

There are "two" laws that apostle Paul addresses in Romans chapter 7 instead of just "one" after Paul went through a hard struggle he came to the conclusion that there were two laws that was warring on the inside of him that was opposed to one another keeping him from doing what he wanted to do for he says in..................

Romans 7:19-22 For the good that I would I do not; but the evil which I would not, that I do. vs. 20) Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. vs. 21) "I FIND THEN A LAW," that, when I would do good, evil is present with me. vs. 22) "For I delight in the LAW of God" after the INWARD MAN:

Romans 7:23-25 But I see another "LAW" in my members, "warring" against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. vs. 24) O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? vs. 25) I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. SO THEN" with the mind I myself SERVE THE LAW OF GOD; (this is law # 1) but with the flesh the LAW OF SIN. (this is law # 2)

the caps are for emphasis only

I am not able to finish what I've started here as I thought I had time to finish but couldn't got to catch a plane but will finish Lord willing when I return home sorry. Hope I be able to work rest of scripture in.

2 Corinthians 5

Galatians 5

Romans 8

I don't think Paul struggles with grace at all but finds that even though he knows that he is free in the Spirit to walk out his faith in the Spirit of the Torah his flesh fights with him always and Paul understands that he no longer needs to live by the letters of the Torah. Paul strives to put off the old man of flesh and walk in the new man who can walk in the Spirit of the Torah/law.

[pearly163]

Thank you for posting this question. Although I can't give a clear cut answer the post gave me food for thought.

For many years now I know that I have been taking God's grace for granted. I have almost come to a point where I have stopped growing spiritually, not because I think I don't need to grow any more (no one will ever reach that state) but because I have become blas

[CD2]

Thank you for posting this question. Although I can't give a clear cut answer the post gave me food for thought.

For many years now I know that I have been taking God's grace for granted. I have almost come to a point where I have stopped growing spiritually, not because I think I don't need to grow any more (no one will ever reach that state) but because I have become blas

[Openly Curious]

name='mizzdy' timestamp='1295634951' post='1641911[/quote']

name='Openly Curious' timestamp='1295611688' post='1641789

There are "two" laws that apostle Paul addresses in Romans chapter 7 instead of just "one" after Paul went through a hard struggle he came to the conclusion that there were two laws that was warring on the inside of him that was opposed to one another keeping him from doing what he wanted to do for he says in..................

Romans 7:19-22 For the good that I would I do not; but the evil which I would not, that I do. vs. 20) Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me. vs. 21) "I FIND THEN A LAW," that, when I would do good, evil is present with me. vs. 22) "For I delight in the LAW of God" after the INWARD MAN:

Romans 7:23-25 But I see another "LAW" in my members, "warring" against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members. vs. 24) O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death? vs. 25) I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. SO THEN" with the mind I myself SERVE THE LAW OF GOD; (this is law # 1) but with the flesh the LAW OF SIN. (this is law # 2)

the caps are for emphasis only

2 Corinthians 5

Galatians 5

I don't think Paul struggles with grace at all but finds that even though he knows that he is free in the Spirit to walk out his faith in the Spirit of the Torah his flesh fights with him always and Paul understands that he no longer needs to live by the letters of the Torah. Paul strives to put off the old man of flesh and walk in the new man who can walk in the Spirit of the Torah/law.

hi mizzdy, I do not think that Paul struggled with grace either but there was a struggle that was taking place within his life being the law of the flesh and Spirit for it was the grace of God who set him free from his body of death. The two natures that are within Paul's life are contrary warring against each other to get him to yield his fleshly will over to the temptations of Satan's kingdom being his servant in the kingdom of darkess and contrary to that the law of the Spirit within his life is trying to get him to lay down his will over to the things of the Spirit as the grace of God had translated him into the kindom of light this the divine nature of God is trying to get him to yield his members of his body to being a servanr in the kingdom of light. It was the grace of God that gave him a choice to whom he wanted to serve for he had not that freedom before liberation came into his life. Satan is the one who made slaves out of us all holding us in bondage against our will but God does not do that the grace of God will not hold us in bondage a slave to Christ for it is a choice for us to make on our own whom we will serve willingly. Grace is a free gift of God and because we all have a struggle within our own lives does not mean that we struggle with grace because of it for it only means we've been given a choice. Romans 6 talks about yielding our members of our body to righteousness unto holiness.

[enoob57]

Anyone care to discuss "living under grace?"

There seems in some churches, the practicing of hyper grace. In that we can do anything in that Jesus told us we would, like drink poison,"lay hands and heal, and more than He Himself did.

Someone gave a simple example to me the other day. Don't concern yourself with anything of the world; you are a dead man walking. For instance, if you walk into a supermarket to buy a bag of apples, don't even bother looking at the apples for bruises, they will be perfect if you live under perfect grace.

Anything is possible.

Where does grace start, and more importantly, where does it end? (In worldly terms?).

Somewhere between the Pharisees drum set and the hyper grace electric guitar, there has to be a place that grace rests.

Grace has only One Seat and it is in The heart of Our Lord Jesus Christ... The whole of our lives are given us to become seated there... All of God's Word to us has shown that not by our abilities shall we ever get to that Prize of The High Calling That is In Christ... Paul our brother in Christ under stood this mark and pressed toward it knowing its distance was greater than He could achieve on all, as in total corporeal, that was experienced as well... "not by works of righteousness" why--- it is a defined price tag On God's Son and the bidders are the ones working their way toward Him! Only to find, when in death they arrive, He will have not know them... Love Steven

[mizzdy]

hi mizzdy, I do not think that Paul struggled with grace either but there was a struggle that was taking place within his life being the law of the flesh and Spirit for it was the grace of God who set him free from his body of death. The two natures that are within Paul's life are contrary warring against each other to get him to yield his fleshly will over to the temptations of Satan's kingdom being his servant in the kingdom of darkess and contrary to that the law of the Spirit within his life is trying to get him to lay down his will over to the things of the Spirit as the grace of God had translated him into the kindom of light this the divine nature of God is trying to get him to yield his members of his body to being a servanr in the kingdom of light. It was the grace of God that gave him a choice to whom he wanted to serve for he had not that freedom before liberation came into his life. Satan is the one who made slaves out of us all holding us in bondage against our will but God does not do that the grace of God will not hold us in bondage a slave to Christ for it is a choice for us to make on our own whom we will serve willingly. Grace is a free gift of God and because we all have a struggle within our own lives does not mean that we struggle with grace because of it for it only means we've been given a choice. Romans 6 talks about yielding our members of our body to righteousness unto holiness.

Paul warred with the law of sin in his member which is contrary to the law of God, sin held no dominion over him any longer with Messiah's death none of us are yet Paul still waged that very same war as we do daily. The law of the Spirit is Gods law God would not come and divide His children we are either walking in the light of His instructions or we are walking in the destructive darkness of sin and death. And I do not believe satan makes everyone sin we have choice if satan still can make us sin then we are not living in His grace, satan can put those oppurtunities in our way but he cannot make us do anything unless we want to do it. God calls His Torah righteous, David called it a delight and couldn't live without it, Paul and all the apostles walked in it also, if they had not if we do not then we are living under the penalties of sin. And how do we yield our bodies unless we have been given instructions on how to do that? Grace has always been given by God, always throughout from the beginning to the end His grace has always been given.

Here's a few articles on on grace and the Spirit.

[Openly Curious]

name='mizzdy' timestamp='1296319529' post='164459

name='Openly Curious' timestamp='1296223611' post='1644203

hi mizzdy, I do not think that Paul struggled with grace either but there was a struggle that was taking place within his life being the law of the flesh and Spirit for it was the grace of God who set him free from his body of death. The two natures that are within Paul's life are contrary warring against each other to get him to yield his fleshly will over to the temptations of Satan's kingdom being his servant in the kingdom of darkess and contrary to that the law of the Spirit within his life is trying to get him to lay down his will over to the things of the Spirit as the grace of God had translated him into the kindom of light this the divine nature of God is trying to get him to yield his members of his body to being a servanr in the kingdom of light. It was the grace of God that gave him a choice to whom he wanted to serve for he had not that freedom before liberation came into his life. Satan is the one who made slaves out of us all holding us in bondage against our will but God does not do that the grace of God will not hold us in bondage a slave to Christ for it is a choice for us to make on our own whom we will serve willingly. Grace is a free gift of God and because we all have a struggle within our own lives does not mean that we struggle with grace because of it for it only means we've been given a choice. Romans 6 talks about yielding our members of our body to righteousness unto holiness.

Paul warred with the law of sin in his members which is contrary to the law of God,

Apostle Paul fought the good fight of faith as we also have to do in our lives. The law of sin is the fight with his flesh as Satan tempted him flesh as he does us today to give into the lusts of the old man. The law of God is the law of the Spirit and if we walk in the Spirit we want fulfill the lust of the flesh but we have to say no to the sins of our flesh. Galatians 5:22-26---But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, meekness, temperance: "against such there is no law" {note---there is so much in each of the fruit of the Spirit and a one on one study sheds light into how we are to walk in the Spirit} vs. 24) And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts. {note---If we have been made a new creature in Christ then we must walk in the Spirit keeping the sins of the flesh dead or supressed so that sin shall not have dominion over you which is having dominion over our flesh by walking in the Spirit.} vs. 25) If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

sin held no dominion over him any longer with Messiah's death none of us are yet Paul still waged that very same war as we do daily. The law of the Spirit is Gods law God would not come and divide His children we are either walking in the light of His instructions or we are walking in the destructive darkness of sin and death. And I do not believe satan makes everyone sin we have choice if satan still can make us sin then we are not living in His grace, satan can put those oppurtunities in our way but he cannot make us do anything unless we want to do it. God calls His Torah righteous, David called it a delight and couldn't live without it, Paul and all the apostles walked in it also, if they had not if we do not then we are living under the penalties of sin. And how do we yield our bodies unless we have been given instructions on how to do that? Grace has always been given by God, always throughout from the beginning to the end His grace has always been given

I am not sure what your meaning is when you said, "God would not come and divide His children" I don't want to comment not knowing. I do not believe Satan can make born again Christians to sin as we do have a choice being to walk in the temptations of Satan or walk in the Spirit where there is no law. Satan cannot make us sin we choose to fulfill the lusts of our flesh. James 1:2-4---My brethren, count it all joy when ye fall into divers temptations; Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience. But let patience have her perfect, work that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

Apostle Paul struggled contrary to belief in his Christian walk with the sins of his flesh and walking in the Spirit that was mentioned in (Romans 7). But not only in Rome could you see his struggle but the Galatian church stood with him during his fight between his flesh and Spirit. Galatians 4:12-15---Brethren, I beseech you, be as I am; for I am as ye are: ye have not injured me at all. "Ye know through infirmities of the flesh" I preached the gospel unto you at the first. "And temptations which was in my flesh ye "despised" not, nor "rejected;" but "received" me as an angel of God, even as Christ Jesus. Where is then the blessedness ye spake of? for I bear ye record, that, if it had been possible, ye would have plucked out your own eyes, and have giving them to me.

Paul said, that "His grace is sufficent" For we must thank the Lord for his "unspeakable gift" There is no end to the grace of God no end in sight..

[TXDisciple]

We are told that for willful sin after salvation 'there remaineth no sacrifice, but a certain dread, looking for judgment........'

That is a misrepresentation of the passage.

Shiloh,

Would you provide your interpretation of the above?.....don't take this as an aggressive question....I value your input and would like to read of your knowledge on this matter.

Regards,

Jay

[dan p]

Anyone care to discuss

[MorningGlory]

It is grace that enables us to obey the Lord. (Titus 2:11-14). We do not abide in Christ by virtue of our own efforts. It is our efforts that are the outworking of our abiding in Him.