Are you saved by grace alone?

[George]

Eph...This is a post that I Posted on: 5:24 pm on Mar. 3, 2002, on the Grace VS. Torah Thread!

Galatians 5:1

[Guest Xan]

Don't assume to think for me.  You obviously know nothing about me. If you did, you would not insist that I believe in salvation by works, because nothing could be farther from the truth.  Once again, I like Galations; but you were far too limiting in keeping it to one verse.  Remember, the original letter to the Church of Galations was one solid letter with no chapter and verse breaks, so to get the full flavor of verse one of chapter 5, I will start in chapter 4:

"And you brethren, like Isaac, are children of promise.  But as at that time he who was born according to the flesh persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, so it is now also.  But what does the Scripture say?

'Cast out the bondwoman and her son, for the son of the bondwoman shall not be an heir with the son of the free woman.'

So then, brethren, we are not children of a bondwoman, but of the free woman.  It was for freedom that Christ set us free; therefore keep standing firm and do not be subject again to a yoke of slavery.  Behold I, Paul, say to you that if you receive circumcision, Christ will be of no benefit to you.  And I testify again to every man who receives circumcision, that he is under obligation to keep the whole Law.  You have been severed from Christ, you who are seeking to be JUSTIFIED BY LAW; you have fallen from grace."

I am not justified by the law in any way, I am free to delight in His statutes.  I feel more liberated than I ever did growing up.

My rabbi recently spoke on Acts 15, particularly the passage you just mentioned to show when the council took place and the discussion that went on in regards to preaching the gospel to the gentiles.  Very good passage, if not for the council, how would you and I ever have gotten to know our L-rd?  

[Guest EPHRIAM777]

Quote: from George on 10:17 pm on Mar. 31, 2002

Eph...This is a post that I Posted on: 5:24 pm on Mar. 3, 2002, on the

Eph writes...

So you see George...even you read that chapter..but wasn't that 3:1 you just quoted and not 5:1..??

If you get a chance read GAL 5:1..Ok..?

I'll comment on what you did quote GAL 3:1..and on down..!

Now here's the big question..What do you think the "schoolmaster" is George..? If you say the Law you'll be right..WHICH means the feasts are gone also..and the KOSHER Laws..ect ect ect..

NOW here's where I bring that altogether for you..

"IF" you claim you have a "better" "deeper"..ect ect ect anything with Jesus Christ..because of or by keeping something HE came to REMOVE away from ""BETWEEN"" you and Him that was a BARRIER between you and him...That was something that kept HIM from being able to FELLOWSHIP with you..(( I'll bet/hope you see where I've led you now with all this ))..

That person would be DEAD wrong..and that person would be leading others ""knowingly or UNknowingly"" into the ditch..IF they claimed to recieve anything extra from God for doing it..THAT would be getting something from God..for NON Faith in what HIS son came to do for you...that only he fulfilled and did perfectly..

Which again not to beat a dead horse over and over..Prefection was the standard in keeping the feasts and OT Law...YOU and the other messianic's fail miserably sorry to say at doing it up to God's standard..! (maybe of course you do it up to your OWN standard or idea of "doing" )

I know it's hard for "messianic's" to fathom this but by saying THEY keep the feasts they make Christ and HIS finished work of no effect..! Because their claims are in direct opposition to what God said..Only HIS son kept the Law..and the Feasts..!

Whew..! so hard to understand for some...!

George lets review something now...!

The Basis of the Christian Faith is The facts surrounding the Resurrection of Jesus Christ...Not keeping feasts or anything else..You either are moving on in FAITH in CHRIST JESUS which by doing so you will gain a ""deeper and greater and fuller""..relationship with him..

OR your going "backwards" in your relationship with him..and thas not good..!

( In the Greek there is no neutral gear..for PISTEUO..you either are going forward..in PISTEUO..or your going backward  in APISTEUO..)

BTW PISTEUO is "FAITH"...

[Guest EPHRIAM777]

Quote: from Xan on 10:24 pm on Mar. 31, 2002

Don't assume to think for me.

[George]

Eph...

Jesus + Nothing = Salvation.

Jesus + Something = NOTHING!

Galatians 5:1

[Guest Xan]

I made a statement of fact, Eph.  I can make another one.  I canot think for you.  You do not have the power to make me mad at you.  Which is another statement of fact.  I like Galations, I posted a passage from Galations that you ignored.  It was on your own volition, but the fact is you ignored the fact that I posted a good passage from Galations.  Why do you insist Messianics believe some things even though we tell you that that is not true?  Isn't this a statement of fact:  I know more of what Messianics believe than one who is not.  Catholics know more of what Catholics believe than I.  Why is that?  Because I am not a Catholic.  That is why I ask Munari questions- to find out what I don't know about them.  I have never assumed to think for them. And I don't argue with Munari. Just another statement of fact.  Why do you appear to delight at the thought of people who don't believe just as you do going to ####?  I didn't say you do delight in the thought of people going to ####; it appears that way.  If you want to take a breather and come back to the Messianic forum and just ask questions (which is the point of the forum, I didn't start it to debate) then you are free to come back.  If I threw you off by quoting Galations and it concerns you that you were wrong about me, then maybe we need to talk more rather than avoid each other.

Shalom.

[Guest Griffin]

Ok here we go

Saved by faith.  So what.  Faith without work is DEAD, and works with out faith is (just as) DEAD.  So we are saved by faith, but should there not be some out workings of that "saved" or should we sit around and anounce our self saved?  All produce "fruit", weeds do not give wheat, but wheat should not become a weed.  Saying that there should be some kind of "fruit" to show that salvation is real.  In closing character counts, and those that claim salvation yet sit around and declare their self saved yet act like the world make me wonder.  I am not judging there salvation as I do not want mine questioned/judged, but I am still a human ans ask, really saved huh? Hmmmm,OK.

[jesusson]

I am saved by only GRACE unto good works through the Holy sprit.

Praise the lord for that wonderful Gift called GRACE.

:thumb:

[Adstar]

Hi everyone

The Messiah has freed us from the penalty of sin, so we do not need to worry about the bad things we have done, but we must still try our best to avoid doing wrong. We are covered for all sins we have done and will do if we repent them and try not to do them again, but we are not covered for the Good things the Messiah told us to do that we fail to do.

Matthew 25:31-46

[Guest harvester]

GRACE ALONE, nothing else, PRAISE the LORD

If by works then pride sets in deep, and we all know pride goeth before a fall ,  

XAN, you mentioned that drinking isn't a sin:

Proverbs 20:1 Wine is a mocker, and strong drink is raging:

and whosoever is decieved thereby is not wise.

Proverbs 31:4 It is not for kings, O Lemuel it is not for kings to drink wine, nor for princes strong drink. Lest they drink, and forget the law, and pervert the judgement of any of the afflicted.

Revelation 1:6 And hath made us kings and priest unto God and his Father, to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.

Galatians 6:7 Be not decieved; God is not mocked, for whatsoever a man soweth that shall he also reap.

:8  For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting.

It has been noted that when a person has one drink even of wine, or a spritzer, or beer, any alcoholic beverage, that it changes their ability to think clearly.

So we being preachers of God's holy word what does that do to us when we have a beer in one hand and God's word in the other???

Jesus would not make an alcoholic wine, so as to turn the ability of a person from being able to tell the truth from a lie!

Especially when we know he knew proverbs 20:1

The more of the world we get rid of from our lives, the narrower our road becomes, for God himself leads us on the path of his righteousness, and may He alone be glorified.