Baptism

[larryt]

There are a few examples of people receiving the "gifts of the Spirit" before they were regenerated.

The first Gentile converts to Christianity are the most prominant.

God had never granted repentance/salvation to anybody who was a non-Jew unless they converted to Judaism before this situation.

They were able to speak in tongues, yet the context never says that they were "saved."

I don't believe that this happens today, though. But I am not God, so I can't say for sure.

How can you say that they were unregenerate?

Ac 10:47  Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?

Peter is acknowledging their membership in the body of Christ, and therefore the need to be baptized in water. I knew nothing about baptizm for almost a year after I believed, no one told me. I was born again though, and knew it.

LT

[Khristeeanos]

How can you say that they were unregenerate?

Ac 10:47

[Guest shiloh357]

How can you say that they were unregenerate? 

Ac 10:47

[larryt]

You are REALLY reaching on this one. It was the demonstration of the Holy Spirit present at Pentecost that showed the apostles that they were regenerate. It is really not that hard to figure out. It does not say they were "saved" in so many words, but it is obvious to anyone that they were.

Q: When the Holy Spirit enteed them and they spoke with tongues were they "new creatures in Christ?"

2Co 5:17  Therefore if any man [be] in Christ, [he is] a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

Ga 6:15  For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.

[Guest shiloh357]

The fact that these Gentiles were demonstrating the same gifts as were demonstrated on Pentecost proved to Peter that they believed the gospel, and were therefore saved. Had that not been the case, he would not recommended that they be immersed in water.

[larryt]

The fact that these Gentiles were demonstrating the same gifts as were demonstrated on Pentecost proved to Peter that they believed the gospel, and were therefore saved. Had that not been the case, he would not recommended that they be immersed in water.

Glad you clarified yourself.

LT

[senerhu]

The reason I asked was because of my own experience. I had surrendered to the Lordship of Jesus Christ, before water immersion baptism. I "thought" all was well, and it very well may have been, but, after I was baptized, there was a specific difference. I do not think the Holy Spirit indwelt me until then? I do not know, but can only say that after baptism, there was SO MUCH MORE revealed to me by His Holy Spirit. I knew, and had understanding of things that I did not know, before baptism. Things became much clearer! There was a distinct difference.

I brought this topic up, because of a common experience relayed to me by an elderly lady friend of mine. She had the same experience. I just wondered if anyone else has?

(DE, your article helped to inspire this question as well. )

In His Love,

Suzanne

This is very much how I felt about it also...

Being water baptized brought a kind of 'finality' to being saved, but it really didn't effect the quanity or quality of my faith or salvation....

[Khristeeanos]

You are REALLY reaching on this one. It was the demonstration of the Holy Spirit present at Pentecost that showed the apostles that they were regenerate. It is really not that hard to figure out. It does not say they were "saved" in so many words, but it is obvious to anyone that they were.

Repentance was never given to a Gentile unless they converted to Judiasm. I already pointed that out.

This was a sign to both the Jews (the Apostles) and Gentiles that the new covenant was for "anybody who calls upon the name of the Lord."

To say that these people were saved is to say that one can be saved without (as you put it all too often) "confessing with the mouth and believing in the heart."

[JesusisGod2]

To say that these people were saved is to say that one can be saved without (as you put it all too often) "confessing with the mouth and believing in the heart."

Good point, however, in your opinion, do you believe that the Holy Spirit is given to one who is unregenerate?

Consider the following:

Romans 8:9

However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God ls in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him.

Now these did recieve the Spirit, so they belonged to Him according to this scripture.

1 Corinthians 12:13

For by one Spirit we were all baptized into one body, whether Jews or Greeks, whether slaves or free, and we were all made to drink of one Spirit.

It says that we are all baptized by the Spirit into one body irregardless of religous (Jew or Greek) or social status (Slave or Free).

Romans 8:15

For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, but you have received a spirit of adoption as sons by which we cry out, "Abba! Father!"

Paul here is saying that we recive the Spirit as an affirmation that we have been adopted as sons and we now call God Daddy, Father. this is a very intimate relationship that we now have with God, that we could not have unless we have been born again.

Also in response as to whetehr God had granted repentance to these gentiles, we see the answer in Acts 11:

17  "Therefore if God gave to them the same gift as He gave to us also after believing in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God's way?"

18  When they heard this, they quieted down and glorified God, saying, "Well then, God has granted to the Gentiles also the repentance that leads to life."

Altough I think the point you brought up of no mention of confession, I believe that the scriptures indicate that they were saved in that meeting. What are your thoughts.

In Jesus

Kevin

[Guest shiloh357]

You are REALLY reaching on this one.  It was the demonstration of the Holy Spirit present at Pentecost that showed the apostles that they were regenerate.  It is really not that hard to figure out.  It does not say they were "saved" in so many words, but it is obvious to anyone that they were.

Repentance was never given to a Gentile unless they converted to Judiasm. I already pointed that out.

This was a sign to both the Jews (the Apostles) and Gentiles that the new covenant was for "anybody who calls upon the name of the Lord."

To say that these people were saved is to say that one can be saved without (as you put it all too often) "confessing with the mouth and believing in the heart."

First of all unless you failed to notice, we are not talking about conversion to Judaism, so you can drop that. Converion to Judaism is IRRELAVENT to this issue.

It is grace through faith that saves a person. In fact, a person is saved the moment they believe. The confession is for their sake, not God's. "For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness..." Paul says in Romans 10:10.

Righteousness (rightstanding with God) is granted the moment one believes the gospel. That is also the moment that you baptised into Christ, and that is also the moment you are indwelt by the Holy Spirit, as evidenced in the story in Acts.