What the new earth tells us about earth pre fall

[Guest shiloh357]

Revealtion is rich in symbolism, but Revelation 21 and 22 speak in concrete terminology when descibing the New Earth. It is not the same ambiguous imagery of the four horsemen, or the muli-headed dragon and so forth, so the argument of symbolism doesn't wash.

Secondly, the question of canonnicity of Revelation goes as far back to before midieval times and is not an issue today. There are no major ongoing debates over the canonnicity of Revelation.

The over-arching theme of the Scriptgure is God's redemption of man and the restoration of all things. He is the one who makes all things new (Rev. 21:5).

So what we see in Revelation is a restoration of what was lost due to Adam's fall in the Garden. It is a reconciliation of creaetion and a return to life pre-fall. In fact, it will in some ways be even better. But the point is that is the fact that when sin is eradicated, there will be NO more death, disease, or decay. That indicates that the restored earth is a revelation of what life was like prior to the entrance of sin.

[PeterH]

The New Jerusalem will not be a sphere, but it is sitting on sphere (the new earth). My reading of the text indicates to me that God is renewing this earth. I do not think this earth is destroyed and a new one created in its place; rather, I believe that what we see in Revelation is a renovation of this planet and the heavens. I could be wrong on that point, but that is what I see at this time.

Just a couple of points / questions.

• what your thoughts were on Rev 21:1 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. To me it's clear that this earth is destroyed in some manner and a new heaven and earth are formed.
• When we are giving the measurements of the new Jerusalem it could be a cube or a pyramid. And honestly I don't know if we could call it a city by our standards today heh . 1400 miles that's roughly the distance from Atlanta, GA to Albuquerque, NM. That's huge, bigger than most countries.
• In eternity we are going to be rulers and governors. That could mean a whole range of things really and in the vastness of creation there are enumerable solar systems. I've always wondered if we might be put in charge of different ones

Just wanted to add one more thing .. the height of the new Jerusalem will be higher than where our space shuttles now orbit.

Edited June 1, 2011 by PeterH

[OneLight]

The New Jerusalem will not be a sphere, but it is sitting on sphere (the new earth). My reading of the text indicates to me that God is renewing this earth. I do not think this earth is destroyed and a new one created in its place; rather, I believe that what we see in Revelation is a renovation of this planet and the heavens. I could be wrong on that point, but that is what I see at this time.

Just a couple of points / questions.

• what your thoughts were on Rev 21:1 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. To me it's clear that this earth is destroyed in some manner and a new heaven and earth are formed.
• When we are giving the measurements of the new Jerusalem it could be a cube or a pyramid. And honestly I don't know if we could call it a city by our standards today heh . 1400 miles that's roughly the distance from Atlanta, GA to Albuquerque, NM. That's huge, bigger than most countries.
• In eternity we are going to be rulers and governors. That could mean a whole range of things really and in the vastness of creation there are enumerable solar systems. I've always wondered if we might be put in charge of different ones

Just wanted to add one more thing .. the height of the new Jerusalem will be higher than where our space shuttles now orbit.

1400 miles cubit, to be more accurate. Makes one wonder how large the new earth has to be in order to have a city that large without throwing it off its axis.

[PeterH]

The New Jerusalem will not be a sphere, but it is sitting on sphere (the new earth). My reading of the text indicates to me that God is renewing this earth. I do not think this earth is destroyed and a new one created in its place; rather, I believe that what we see in Revelation is a renovation of this planet and the heavens. I could be wrong on that point, but that is what I see at this time.

Just a couple of points / questions.

• what your thoughts were on Rev 21:1 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. To me it's clear that this earth is destroyed in some manner and a new heaven and earth are formed.
• When we are giving the measurements of the new Jerusalem it could be a cube or a pyramid. And honestly I don't know if we could call it a city by our standards today heh . 1400 miles that's roughly the distance from Atlanta, GA to Albuquerque, NM. That's huge, bigger than most countries.
• In eternity we are going to be rulers and governors. That could mean a whole range of things really and in the vastness of creation there are enumerable solar systems. I've always wondered if we might be put in charge of different ones

Just wanted to add one more thing .. the height of the new Jerusalem will be higher than where our space shuttles now orbit.

1400 miles cubit, to be more accurate. Makes one wonder how large the new earth has to be in order to have a city that large without throwing it off its axis.

No kidding especially considering what materials are used in structure and the amounts of that material. Just taking the measurements of a standard two lane road today of roughly 32 feet wide and taking a 10ft long section and just saying the roads in heaven are 6 inch deep then a 10ft section of road of solid gold would weigh 192,640 lbs. or 96.32 tons.

This is going to be an amazing place! I can't wait to get there

[~candice~]

The New Jerusalem will not be a sphere, but it is sitting on sphere (the new earth). My reading of the text indicates to me that God is renewing this earth. I do not think this earth is destroyed and a new one created in its place; rather, I believe that what we see in Revelation is a renovation of this planet and the heavens. I could be wrong on that point, but that is what I see at this time.

Just a couple of points / questions.

• what your thoughts were on Rev 21:1 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. To me it's clear that this earth is destroyed in some manner and a new heaven and earth are formed.
• When we are giving the measurements of the new Jerusalem it could be a cube or a pyramid. And honestly I don't know if we could call it a city by our standards today heh . 1400 miles that's roughly the distance from Atlanta, GA to Albuquerque, NM. That's huge, bigger than most countries.
• In eternity we are going to be rulers and governors. That could mean a whole range of things really and in the vastness of creation there are enumerable solar systems. I've always wondered if we might be put in charge of different ones

Just wanted to add one more thing .. the height of the new Jerusalem will be higher than where our space shuttles now orbit.

1400 miles cubit, to be more accurate. Makes one wonder how large the new earth has to be in order to have a city that large without throwing it off its axis.

Alan this was my second point. It appears as though God is going to miraculously (well, in violation with some physical properties we know today) uphold the new earth. Christians rarely question that and attempt to explain away properties of the new earth just because they violate what science says today is possible. So why do it in creation? We serve a supernatural God, who does miracles, creates from nothing, comes to earth in the form of a man, defeats death and sin. I have no issue concluding that He used supernatural means that violate physical properties in both the new earth AND creation.

[OneLight]

The New Jerusalem will not be a sphere, but it is sitting on sphere (the new earth). My reading of the text indicates to me that God is renewing this earth. I do not think this earth is destroyed and a new one created in its place; rather, I believe that what we see in Revelation is a renovation of this planet and the heavens. I could be wrong on that point, but that is what I see at this time.

Just a couple of points / questions.

• what your thoughts were on Rev 21:1 Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. To me it's clear that this earth is destroyed in some manner and a new heaven and earth are formed.
• When we are giving the measurements of the new Jerusalem it could be a cube or a pyramid. And honestly I don't know if we could call it a city by our standards today heh . 1400 miles that's roughly the distance from Atlanta, GA to Albuquerque, NM. That's huge, bigger than most countries.
• In eternity we are going to be rulers and governors. That could mean a whole range of things really and in the vastness of creation there are enumerable solar systems. I've always wondered if we might be put in charge of different ones

Just wanted to add one more thing .. the height of the new Jerusalem will be higher than where our space shuttles now orbit.

1400 miles cubit, to be more accurate. Makes one wonder how large the new earth has to be in order to have a city that large without throwing it off its axis.

Alan this was my second point. It appears as though God is going to miraculously (well, in violation with some physical properties we know today) uphold the new earth. Christians rarely question that and attempt to explain away properties of the new earth just because they violate what science says today is possible. So why do it in creation? We serve a supernatural God, who does miracles, creates from nothing, comes to earth in the form of a man, defeats death and sin. I have no issue concluding that He used supernatural means that violate physical properties in both the new earth AND creation.

Yes, Sis, God can do anything He so desires, but why not make the world larger then it is? If we are overpopulated already, how much more do you think it will be overpopulated when all those who believe in Him are together all at once? I'd rather believe that He is going to actually create a new heaven and a new earth ... why not, He can do anything?

[~candice~]

One of those things we will understand the other side of the pearly gates! I don't know *why* He doesn't make the earth bigger. As for reconstruction v's new creation, you'll have to debate Shiloh on the issue, I really don't know greek well enough to do justice to the topic.

God bless Bro

[OneLight]

Nah, I'd rather wait and be pleasantly surprised. There arre more worthy things to discuss then something we can't prove.

[methinkshe]

An interesting topic.

I understand the New Jerusalem to be a spiritual city synonymous with the Bride - i.e. the redeemed.

"9Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls filled with the seven final plagues (afflictions, calamities) came and spoke to me. He said, Come with me! I will show you the bride, the Lamb's wife.

10Then in the Spirit He conveyed me away to a vast and lofty mountain and exhibited to me the holy (hallowed, consecrated) city of Jerusalem descending out of heaven from God,(G)" Revelation 21

On inviting John to come with him to be shown the bride, the angel shows him the New Jerusalem descending from heaven indicating that the bride IS the New Jerusalem.

This is also consistent with the city of Babylon being a spiritual authority, as well as being a physical city. Just as spiritual Babylon is the authority that governs the spirits of unregenerate men, spiritual Jerusalem is the authority that governs the spirits of regenerate men. And Jesus is her cornerstone. The redeemed are living stones built on Jesus the cornerstone and the foundations laid by the Apostles.

1 Peter 2:5

[Come] and, like living stones, be yourselves built [into] a spiritual house, for a holy (dedicated, consecrated) priesthood, to offer up [those] spiritual sacrifices [that are] acceptable and pleasing to God through Jesus Christ.

[~candice~]

An interesting topic.

I understand the New Jerusalem to be a spiritual city synonymous with the Bride - i.e. the redeemed.

"9Then one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls filled with the seven final plagues (afflictions, calamities) came and spoke to me. He said, Come with me! I will show you the bride, the Lamb's wife.

10Then in the Spirit He conveyed me away to a vast and lofty mountain and exhibited to me the holy (hallowed, consecrated) city of Jerusalem descending out of heaven from God,(G)" Revelation 21

On inviting John to come with him to be shown the bride, the angel shows him the New Jerusalem descending from heaven indicating that the bride IS the New Jerusalem.

This is also consistent with the city of Babylon being a spiritual authority, as well as being a physical city. Just as spiritual Babylon is the authority that governs the spirits of unregenerate men, spiritual Jerusalem is the authority that governs the spirits of regenerate men. And Jesus is her cornerstone. The redeemed are living stones built on Jesus the cornerstone and the foundations laid by the Apostles.

1 Peter 2:5

[Come] and, like living stones, be yourselves built [into] a spiritual house, for a holy (dedicated, consecrated) priesthood, to offer up [those] spiritual sacrifices [that are] acceptable and pleasing to God through Jesus Christ.

Do you believe other promises of the bible are 'spiritually' fulfilled to?