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Preterism versus Futurism


JohnD

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What exactly are you attributing to Preterism that would require the world to be getting better? I need a little more meat on your answer to be able to reply to it.

I see you also failed to want to touch Matthew 10:23. It seems all the futurists in here just ask questions, but fail to be able to answer them.

What is so difficult about Matthew 10:23? It is a telescoping prophesy. The Bible is filled with them. When Jesus talks about fleeing to another city and them not running out of cities before He returns, He is speaking of the Great Tribulation, something that has not happened yet. Not hard to deal with at all. But since you brought up this supposed scripture that no futurist can explain, how about the things that Preterists never explain?

First off, as shiloh mentioned, during Christ's ascension, the angels told the disciples that Jesus would return, just as He had left. Revelation tells us that every eye will see Him when He returns. So how exactly did He return in 70 AD without anyone actually seeing Him? And where exactly is He and where is He ruling from because He rules from the earth during the Millennium. Is the "every eye will see Him" passage one that we are supposed to explain away as simply something spiritual?

Acts 1:11 "Men of Galilee," they said, "why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen him go into heaven."

Just more "spiritualized" stuff here? When Jesus returns, it is not going to be in secret. He isn't going to sneak back. And He will split the Mount of Olives in two, Zechariah says so, and it is literal.

Zechariah 14:2-11 2 I will gather all the nations to Jerusalem to fight against it; the city will be captured, the houses ransacked, and the women raped. Half of the city will go into exile, but the rest of the people will not be taken from the city. 3 Then the LORD will go out and fight against those nations, as he fights in the day of battle. 4 On that day his feet will stand on the Mount of Olives, east of Jerusalem, and the Mount of Olives will be split in two from east to west, forming a great valley, with half of the mountain moving north and half moving south. 5 You will flee by my mountain valley, for it will extend to Azel. You will flee as you fled from the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah. Then the LORD my God will come, and all the holy ones with him. 6 On that day there will be no light, no cold or frost. 7 It will be a unique day, without daytime or nighttime-- a day known to the LORD. When evening comes, there will be light. 8 On that day living water will flow out from Jerusalem, half to the eastern sea and half to the western sea, in summer and in winter. 9 The LORD will be king over the whole earth. On that day there will be one LORD, and his name the only name. 10 The whole land, from Geba to Rimmon, south of Jerusalem, will become like the Arabah. But Jerusalem will be raised up and remain in its place, from the Benjamin Gate to the site of the First Gate, to the Corner Gate, and from the Tower of Hananel to the royal winepresses. 11 It will be inhabited; never again will it be destroyed. Jerusalem will be secure.

When has the living water flowed out of Jerusalem to the sea in summer and winter? When did the Euphrates dry up? When did the two witnesses appear? On and on. Preterism does solve a great deal of pesky biblical interpetation problems, because you can make the passages mean just about anything you want instead of taking them as they were meant to be taken. You don't have to wait on God to do things in His timing either. Everything is already done, no pesky waiting. You don't have to wait expectantly for Jesus to return, as He admonishes us to, because He is secretly already here hiding out somewhere. Although why the Son of God would need to keep His presence a secret and hide out is beyond me. He didn't hide out the last time, and He will not hide out the next time either.

I'll ask again, just as I asked Bold Believer: When did God change the method He fulfills prophecy from literally to spiritually, or figuratively? Where and when did He tell us He would do this? Because all fulfilled prophecy has always been fulfilled literally, as it was written. But Preterism claims these rules suddenly changed somewhere. Where?

Prophecy is fulfilled in different ways. I give you the return of Elijah the prophet. DID he ever return? No. Not literally. But Jesus said that he returned in John the Baptizer. The problem lies not in the rules, but in the way they are understood.

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Shabbat shalom, Logos1.

I would add also a query concerning when the Euphrates dried up! I'd like to know!

Revelation 16:12

Then the sixth angel poured out his bowl on the great Euphrates River, and it dried up so that the kings from the east could march their armies toward the west without hindrance.

Remember one of your most renowned futurists teachers tells how the Euphrates was dried up 500 years before so the Persians could enter Babylon and take the city by diverting the river’s flow.

Another interpretation explained by Stuart is that this references the Euphrates being crossed swiftly and with ease by the Roman Legions that were drawn from that region as well as the historical documentation of auxiliary kings such as Antiochus of Commagene and Sohemus of Sopbene who assisted in the invasion of Judea.

Not a big issue to see this easily resolved historically.

I noticed you also failed to be able to explain away Matthew 10:23. It is a great stumbling block for futurists. At best they need to torture the words to mean something that is impossible and laughable.

I'll take your challenge of Matthew 10:23. You see, even though I've been called a partial Preterist and may consider myself to be one because of my interpretation of Yeshua`s prophecy on Har HaZeitiym, I am still confidently a Futurist.

Let's start with the WHOLE context of Matthew 10:23:

Matt 10:1-11:1

10 1 Yeshua called his twelve talmidim and gave them authority to drive out unclean spirits and to heal every kind of disease and weakness. 2 These are the names of the twelve emissaries:

First, Shim‘on, called Kefa,

and Andrew his brother,

Ya‘akov Ben-Zavdai

and Yochanan his brother,

3 Philip

and Bar-Talmai,

T’oma

and Mattityahu the tax-collector,

Ya‘akov Bar-Halfai

and Taddai,

4 Shim‘on the Zealot,

and Y’hudah from K’riot, who betrayed him.

5 These twelve Yeshua sent out with the following instructions: “Don’t go into the territory of the Goyim, and don’t enter any town in Shomron, 6 but go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Isra’el. 7 As you go, proclaim, ‘The Kingdom of Heaven is near,’ 8 heal the sick, raise the dead, cleanse those afflicted with tzara’at, expel demons. You have received without paying, so give without asking payment. 9 Don’t take money in your belts, no gold, no silver, no copper; 10 and for the trip don’t take a pack, an extra shirt, shoes or a walking stick — a worker should be given what he needs.

11 “When you come to a town or village, look for someone trustworthy and stay with him until you leave. 12 When you enter someone’s household, say, ‘Shalom aleikhem!’ 13 If the home deserves it, let your shalom rest on it; if not, let your shalom return to you. 14 But if the people of a house or town will not welcome you or listen to you, leave it and shake its dust from your feet! 15 Yes, I tell you, it will be more tolerable on the Day of Judgment for the people of S’dom and ‘Amora than for that town!

16 “Pay attention! I am sending you out like sheep among wolves, so be as prudent as snakes and as harmless as doves. 17 Be on guard, for there will be people who will hand you over to the local Sanhedrins and flog you in their synagogues. 18 On my account you will be brought before governors and kings as a testimony to them and to the Goyim. 19 But when they bring you to trial, do not worry about what to say or how to say it; when the time comes, you will be given what you should say. 20 For it will not be just you speaking, but the Spirit of your heavenly Father speaking through you.

21 “A brother will betray his brother to death, and a father his child; children will turn against their parents and have them put to death. 22 Everyone will hate you because of me, but whoever holds out till the end will be preserved from harm. 23 When you are persecuted in one town, run away to another. Yes indeed; I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Isra’el before the Son of Man comes.

24 “A talmid is not greater than his rabbi, a slave is not greater than his master. 25 It is enough for a talmid that he become like his rabbi, and a slave like his master. Now if people have called the head of the house Ba‘al-Zibbul, how much more will they malign the members of his household! 26 So do not fear them; for there is nothing covered that will not be uncovered, or hidden that will not be known. 27 What I tell you in the dark, speak in the light; what is whispered in your ear, proclaim on the housetops.

28 “Do not fear those who kill the body but are powerless to kill the soul. Rather, fear him who can destroy both soul and body in Gei-Hinnom. 29 Aren’t sparrows sold for next to nothing, two for an assarion? Yet not one of them will fall to the ground without your Father’s consent. 30 As for you, every hair on your head has been counted. 31 So do not be afraid, you are worth more than many sparrows.

32 “Whoever acknowledges me in the presence of others I will also acknowledge in the presence of my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before others I will disown before my Father in heaven.

34 “Don’t suppose that I have come to bring peace to the Land. It is not peace I have come to bring, but a sword! 35 For I have come to set...

36 a man against his father,

a daughter against her mother,

a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law,

so that a man’s enemies will be the members of his own household.

37 Whoever loves his father or mother more than he loves me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than he loves me is not worthy of me. 38 And anyone who does not take up his execution-stake and follow me is not worthy of me. 39 Whoever finds his own life will lose it, but the person who loses his life for my sake will find it.

40 “Whoever receives you is receiving me, and whoever receives me is receiving the One who sent me. 41 Anyone who receives a prophet because he is a prophet will receive the reward a prophet gets, and anyone who receives a tzaddik because he is a tzaddik will receive the reward a tzaddik gets. 42 Indeed, if someone gives just a cup of cold water to one of these little ones because he is my talmid — yes! — I tell you, he will certainly not lose his reward!”

11 1 After Yeshua had finished instructing the twelve talmidim, he went on from there to teach and preach in the towns nearby.

CJB

These were SPECIFIC instructions that He was giving His twelve emissaries. They were to be His heralds in all the towns and villages of Isra'el! Yeshua` was making His rounds to each one of the towns and villages of Isra'el and Y'hudah, declaring to them the good news about the Kingdom from the sky and demonstrating the truth by the miracles He performed to validate and substantiate His claim! They, too, were given power over sicknesses and weaknesses and daemons and tsara'at (leprosy) and even death itself to demonstrate and validate THEIR words, as well! They were giving God's message; so, to prove their words came from God, they were given God's power!

So, what Yeshua` was telling them in verse 23 is that He would catch up to them before they had covered all the towns and villages, every burg and hamlet, on His route!

23 When you are persecuted in one town, run away to another. Yes indeed; I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Isra’el before the Son of Man comes.

It was for that particular mission! It is only for the 3.5 years in which Yeshua` offered Himself to be Isra'el's King because He was God's Messiah, God's ANOINTED TO BE KING! This verse has NOTHING to do with ANY future past that time period, not after Yeshua` was resurrected and not when Yeshua` physically returns!

The GREATEST hurdle for a Preterist, IMO, is the promise in Acts 1:9-11 and the prophecy of Rev. 1:7:

Acts 1:9-11

9 And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.

10 And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel;

11 Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

KJV

Revelation 1:7

7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.

KJV

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Fresno Joe,

How are you my brother. Hope you are having a wonderful Christmas season.

Let me begin by simply saying…holy moly and mother of nothing special…that post as they say some places defends itself against being read by its mere length alone.

LOL, when I asked for meat on the bones I meant relevant to the point argument not unbridled cut and pasting of everything that would fit in your PCs RAM.

If you think you have anything germane to the post there please find it and post in a somewhat more concise manner and I will be happy respond in kind. I don’t think my PC has enough RAM to load all of it let alone my having time to tackle such an epistle any time soon.

I will say though if you are (and I honestly can’t tell) suggesting there might be a millennial period that I would not agree to such a notion. And, there are plenty of Christians who are futurists who don’t believe in a millennial reign of Christ on earth either.

God Bless,

Logos1

Beloved

You Are Most Welcomed

And As You Can See The End Times Is All About Israel

And I See This As The Possible Core Reason So Many Still Deny The Thousand Years Of Her Earthly Restoration

And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, Revelation 20:7

And Most Any Reference To The Coming Return Of Jesus The KING OF THE JEW To Zion Town

Pray for the peace of Jerusalem: they shall prosper that love thee. Psalms 122:6

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Merry Christmas Beloved Of The KING

The LORD bless thee, and keep thee:

The LORD make his face shine upon thee, and be gracious unto thee:

The LORD lift up his countenance upon thee, and give thee peace.

And they shall put my name upon the children of Israel; and I will bless them. Numbers 6:24-27

Love, Your Brother Joe

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And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.

Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. Revelation 20:1-6

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Acts 1:11

“Men of Galilee,” they said, “why are you standing here staring into heaven? Jesus has been taken from you into heaven, but someday he will return from heaven in the same way you saw him go!”

1 John 3:2

Dear friends, we are already God’s children, but he has not yet shown us what we will be like when Christ appears. But we do know that we will be like him, for we will see him as he really is.

1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, the Christians who have died will rise from their graves. Then, together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. Then we will be with the Lord forever.

Can't wait! Jesus tells me, as He tells all of His kids who hear and know His voice---"I am coming soon!"

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Guest shiloh357
Man you sound like you are packing some serious scriptural heat—is that 357 a scriptural magnum? This is sort of like meeting in the Old West at Sundown to make your play at 30 paces in a blaze of spitting lead or spitting scripture in this case.

Some people understandably mistake the cross at the point where Christ reconciled us back to God and although you could prove this many ways—I’ll just make it simple. The bible tells us no one has gone to heaven except the one who came from heaven The Son of Man (John 3:13). Therefore we know people at that time have not yet been reconciled back into the presence of God since they weren’t yet going to heaven when they died.

Jesus said (John 14:3) he was going to prepare a place for you. As we can see he was still telling us he was about his atoning work. It is at the end of the age (Old Covenant age) in 70 AD when the temple is destroyed that the age ends that the New Covenant comes into its own and we can then start to go to heaven when we die.

You know the New Testament doesn’t actually say Jesus will come back in bodily form—the opposite is actually what is said. It actually says my Kingdom is not of this world John 18:36 and Luke 17:20 the Kingdom of God does not come with observation.

You haven’t stated any scriptural facts merely futurist commentary that is as cheap and plentiful as a dime store novel.

Now this is my favorite part of your post when you say Jesus in Matthew 10:23 is looking over the heads of the apostles and into the future—and futurists have the nerve to accuse Preterists of spiritualizing scripture and not taking it literally. LOL, LOL, (your killing me man) I love it so help me, I love it so when I read this kind of twisting scripture to support a futurist preconceived notion.

Perhaps a little more actual reading of the Good book will guide you to truth in our Lord and Savior and his marvelous work and away from these dime store commentaries you toss around without scriptural support.

Looks like you were firing blanks today my friend.

If there was anything of intellectual value in your post, I would respond to it. The thing is, I don't dialogue with people who are bent upon mocking my views. When you are capable of holding an adult conversation, let me know. Otherwise, you have nothing to say to me that is meaningful, substantive or important. As such, I will simply ignore you from here on out, as should everyone else. Your mocking tone with me and Fresno Joe is unacceptable and this issue is not crucial enough to the Christians faith for me to spend hours on end debating it, especially with someone who just wants to make fun of me.

Oh and one other thing: Don't ever refer to me as your "friend." You devalue the very meaning of the term.

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Acts 1:11

“Men of Galilee,” they said, “why are you standing here staring into heaven? Jesus has been taken from you into heaven, but someday he will return from heaven in the same way you saw him go!”

1 John 3:2

Dear friends, we are already God’s children, but he has not yet shown us what we will be like when Christ appears. But we do know that we will be like him, for we will see him as he really is.

1 Thessalonians 4:16-17

For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, the Christians who have died will rise from their graves. Then, together with them, we who are still alive and remain on the earth will be caught up in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. Then we will be with the Lord forever.

Can't wait! Jesus tells me, as He tells all of His kids who hear and know His voice--- "I am coming soon!"

Amen Beloved Sister

And it shall come to pass, that every one that is left of all the nations which came against Jerusalem shall even go up from year to year to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, and to keep the feast of tabernacles.

And it shall be, that whoso will not come up of all the families of the earth unto Jerusalem to worship the King, the LORD of hosts, even upon them shall be no rain.

And if the family of Egypt go not up, and come not, that have no rain; there shall be the plague, wherewith the LORD will smite the heathen that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles.

This shall be the punishment of Egypt, and the punishment of all nations that come not up to keep the feast of tabernacles. Zechariah 14:16-19

Oh So Amen

In that day shall there be upon the bells of the horses, HOLINESS UNTO THE LORD; and the pots in the LORD's house shall be like the bowl's before the altar.

Yea, every pot in Jerusalem and in Judah shall be holiness unto the LORD of hosts: and all they that sacrifice shall come and take of them, and seethe therein: and in that day there shall be no more the Canaanite in the house of the LORD of hosts. Zechariah 14:20-21

Even So Come Quickly LORD Jesus

For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:

And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. Revelation 22:18-19

Come Quickly

He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus. Revelation 22:20

Maranatha~!

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.... We see this further in Galatians 3:28 that Jews and Gentiles are now equal before God hence Jews have no special relationship with God any more by virtue of their Old Covenant relationship.

Since the Old Covenant came to its final end with the destruction of the temple in 70 AD we know that anything that pertains to the Jews, the temple, sacrifices, Jerusalem, Israel, etc had to have been fulfilled by 70 AD at the latest....

Dear One

Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.

And to her was granted that she should be arrayed in fine linen, clean and white: for the fine linen is the righteousness of saints.

And he saith unto me, Write, Blessed are they which are called unto the marriage supper of the Lamb. And he saith unto me, These are the true sayings of God. Revelation 19:7-9

What? Did You Really Think The LORD's Table Would Be Empty Of Meat?

Thus saith the Lord GOD; The gate of the inner court that looketh toward the east shall be shut the six working days; but on the sabbath it shall be opened, and in the day of the new moon it shall be opened.

And the prince shall enter by the way of the porch of that gate without, and shall stand by the post of the gate, and the priests shall prepare his burnt offering and his peace offerings, and he shall worship at the threshold of the gate: then he shall go forth; but the gate shall not be shut until the evening.

Likewise the people of the land shall worship at the door of this gate before the LORD in the sabbaths and in the new moons.

And the burnt offering that the prince shall offer unto the LORD in the sabbath day shall be six lambs without blemish, and a ram without blemish.

And the meat offering shall be an ephah for a ram, and the meat offering for the lambs as he shall be able to give, and an hin of oil to an ephah.

And in the day of the new moon it shall be a young bullock without blemish, and six lambs, and a ram: they shall be without blemish.

And he shall prepare a meat offering, an ephah for a bullock, and an ephah for a ram, and for the lambs according as his hand shall attain unto, and an hin of oil to an ephah.

And when the prince shall enter, he shall go in by the way of the porch of that gate, and he shall go forth by the way thereof.

But when the people of the land shall come before the LORD in the solemn feasts, he that entereth in by the way of the north gate to worship shall go out by the way of the south gate; and he that entereth by the way of the south gate shall go forth by the way of the north gate: he shall not return by the way of the gate whereby he came in, but shall go forth over against it.

And the prince in the midst of them, when they go in, shall go in; and when they go forth, shall go forth.

And in the feast and in the solemnities the meat offering shall be an ephah to a bullock, and ephah to a ram, and to the lambs as he is able to give, and an hin of oil to an ephah.

Now when the prince shall prepare a voluntary burnt offering or peace offerings voluntarily unto the LORD, one shall then open him the gate that looketh toward the east, and he shall prepare his burnt offering and his peace offerings, as he did on the sabbath day: then he shall go forth; and after his going forth one shall shut the gate.

Thou shalt daily prepare a burnt offering unto the LORD of a lamb of the first year without blemish: thou shalt prepare it every morning.

And thou shalt prepare a meat offering for it every morning, the sixth part of an ephah, and the third part of an hin of oil, to temper with the fine flour; a meat offering continually by a perpetual ordinance unto the LORD.

Thus shall they prepare the lamb, and the meat offering, and the oil, every morning for a continual burnt offering.

Thus saith the Lord GOD; If the prince give a gift unto any of his sons, the inheritance thereof shall be his sons'; it shall be their possession by inheritance.

But if he give a gift of his inheritance to one of his servants, then it shall be his to the year of liberty; after it shall return to the prince: but his inheritance shall be his sons' for them.

Moreover the prince shall not take of the people's inheritance by oppression, to thrust them out of their possession; but he shall give his sons inheritance out of his own possession: that my people be not scattered every man from his possession.

After he brought me through the entry, which was at the side of the gate, into the holy chambers of the priests, which looked toward the north: and, behold, there was a place on the two sides westward.

Then said he unto me, This is the place where the priests shall boil the trespass offering and the sin offering, where they shall bake the meat offering; that they bear them not out into the utter court, to sanctify the people.

Then he brought me forth into the utter court, and caused me to pass by the four corners of the court; and, behold, in every corner of the court there was a court.

In the four corners of the court there were courts joined of forty cubits long and thirty broad: these four corners were of one measure.

And there was a row of building round about in them, round about them four, and it was made with boiling places under the rows round about.

Then said he unto me, These are the places of them that boil, where the ministers of the house shall boil the sacrifice of the people. Ezekiel 46

And We Know Israel Is Indeed Loved With An Eternal Love

For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away. Hebrews 8:8-13

For Jesus Is Faithful

And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. Romans 11:26-27

And True

At the same time, saith the LORD, will I be the God of all the families of Israel, and they shall be my people.

Thus saith the LORD, The people which were left of the sword found grace in the wilderness; even Israel, when I went to cause him to rest.

The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee. Jeremiah 31:1-3

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Eschatology Is Jesus In Action

I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. Revelation 1:8

Yesterday

Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:

Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

And he is before all things, and by him all things consist. Colossians 1:12-17

Today

Wherefore he is able also to save them to the uttermost that come unto God by him, seeing he ever liveth to make intercession for them. Hebrews 7:25

And Tomorrow

And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: Romans 11:26

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Keep The Faith

Thy word is true from the beginning: and every one of thy righteous judgments endureth for ever. Psalms 119:160

And Be Blessed Beloved Of The KING

Love, Your Brother Joe

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It takes a real man to be a Preterist.

It takes humility to be a man.

Proverbs 12:23

The wise don’t make a show of their knowledge, but fools broadcast their foolishness.

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For those of the preterist view:

I am amazed at how far from the child like view of God's Word you have taken yourselves!

What concerns me more is that you see this world as moving into perfection! Blindness is all that can be understood by this!

Love, Steven

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No I can't say I have ever read in Scripture Christ the Lord making fun of people... matter of fact Peter who knew Him well when He walked here said this of Him:

1 Pe 2:23-25

23 who, when He was reviled, did not revile in return; when He suffered, He did not threaten, but committed Himself to Him who judges righteously; 24 who Himself bore our sins in His own body on the tree, that we, having died to sins, might live for righteousness — by whose stripes you were healed. 25 For you were like sheep going astray, but have now returned to the Shepherd and Overseer of your souls.

NKJV

Do you see this to be different from your responses and replies? This is the way we determine the spirits of a thing... the fruit!

Love, Steven

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