Question from Book of Hebrews

[Rascus]

Hebrews 6:4-9....This is for anyone willing to help me out with this particular verse.....as its bothered me and I really believe affected my walk forward with the Lord. I have posted on it before in other forums and I guess that the general opinion was I didn't have any understanding or knowledge of the Word as I guess you might say the answer I got was for someone to chastise me. I'm not looking for an argument or debate I really am looking for an answer. Ive been told that it don't apply to me but only to the Hebrews and then Ive been told it only concerns those in OT times who were living under the Law. I am inclined to sort of accept that however it still always lingers in my heart .....obvious or I would have long ago left it go. Anyway as you can see I'm still searching for its true meaning as it relates to Salvation and other issues. Anyway I welcome anyone else who has an opinion or wants to share what they may see it as saying and who it was addressed to.

May the love and blessings of the Lord be upon you always.....Rascus

[Guest]

Looking

Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. Hebrews 6:1-2

To

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. Hebrews 6:4-6

Jesus

Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law. Romans 3:24-28

Alone

That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. Ephesians 2:7-10

[Jayyycuuup]

Glad you brought it up There are some things that we don't get but it takes time and prayer to God....for wisdom is granted thorough prayer ! Sometimes God places the right person before you, that being said God grant me wisdom, and all others whom attempt to shed some Light in your Name King and Lord

Lets continue !

Hebrews 6:4-6

4.For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted the heavenly gift, and have become partakers of the Holy Spirit, 5.and have tasted the good word of God and the powers of the age to come, 6. if they fall away, to renew them again to repentance, since they crucify again for themselves the Son of God, and put Him to an open shame.

Okay, so take satan for example...he was in heaven with God but He lost his grace and cast from Heaven. He will never be able to regain that because He knew God but turned against Him. The same thing goes for us ! Those who have a relationship with God should not fall away from Him, because in doing so you turn your back on Him. They have tasted the Glory of the Mighty father but turn to the world, and doing so is an abomination to the Lord.(1 John 2:15-17) By the grace of God we are saved ! Salvation is not lost, you either keep it or you never had it to begin with, for this reason you will not crucify Christ a second time.

Romans 6:5-6 "For if we have been united together in the likeness of His death, certainly we also shall be in the likeness of His resurrection, knowing this, that our old man was crucified with Him, that the body of sin might be done away with, that we should no longer be slaves of sin."

If we apply this to Hebrews 6:4-6 then once you turn away from knowing God, your slaved to sin, and have returned to your past life. At which that life died, as will your next coming.

Hebrews 6:7-8

7 "For the earth which drinks in the rain that often comes upon it, and bears herbs useful for those by whom it is cultivated, receives blessings from God 8. but if it bears thorns and briers, it is rejected and near to being cursed, whose end is to be burned."

This is a simple parable Read Isaiah 5: 1-6. It is describing the good and the bad fruit. The good fruit is blessed through God, the bad fruit is thrown to be burned.

Hebrews 6:9

"But beloved, we are confident of better things concerning you, yes things that accompany salvation, though we speak of these things."

Do not fret, we have hope in the Lord, although the bible speaks of this God is saying do not worry because through Him we are confident....this is rather a warning of what will happen if you choose to turn from God once you are certain and know him, seen him, tasted of His wonderful Glory etc.'

Hope what little I say helped a bit. God bless you

Lord we ask that you open Rascus heart and mind to this understanding, leave him in darkness no longer...allow him to understand and continue in you Grace, Power and Love. In Jesus Name amen.

[franciskelsey]

I have did quite a bit of research on this study myself. The above post has some good points. I have debated ex-Christians for a long time but not with great results. Many believe once you have accepted Christ you will never fall away, and if you do, you were never saved in the first place. How sad. If so, the sinners prayer is a fake because when we tell all who pray it that they will go to heaven, when we know some will not (not really saved) than we make the bible to be untrue.

However, to be breif, this is not about making a mistake, or backsliding a little bit. This is about a continues rebelling of the call from the Holy Spirit once you have accepted Him in your life. Over time your heart will become hard and you will never come back to Christ Jesus. What it does not mean is that someone who has gone astray can never be brought back.

When I was a kid I got saved. Through the expetation of trying to be perfect I gave up. It was not until 12 years later when I accepted Jesus in my life again, but taking it one baby step at a time. Many have their own reaons why they give up on God, rather they feel God let them down, or they could not make God happy, or false doctrins that God would not comply with, such as ask in His name and it will be done for you, and taking it to mean if it is not you did not have enough faith. God knows our thoughts and hearts. That is GREAT news. He will bring us back to Himself if our reasoning was not out of rebellion. I believe this.

I want to share a couple of verses for better understanding of what I believe is being talked about.

1 John 5:16-17

16If you see another believer committing a sin that doesn't lead to death, you should pray that God would give that person life. This is true for those who commit sins that don't lead to death. There is a sin that leads to death. I'm not telling you to pray about that. 17Every kind of wrongdoing is sin, yet there are sins that don't lead to death.

Different opions about this verse but I tend to believe it is not "a" sin but a sinful life brought on by a hardening and rebellion of the heart over a period of time, which if continued, will lead to death. I believe this is the sin that leads to death.

James 1:14-15

14Everyone is tempted by his own desires as they lure him away and trap him. 15Then desire becomes pregnant and gives birth to sin. When sin grows up, it gives birth to death. 16My dear brothers and sisters, don't be fooled.

I believe this is how the downslide begains. I have had many times in my life where God said, "Here you are, at the cross roads. It is your call, Me or your lusts." I chose God, but sometimes it wasa hard choice, surprisingly.

Ezekiel 18:26 also goes along with this. We must never harden our hearts toward Christ because those that do may never come back to safety.

Anyhow brother, I hope that helps. It is not about our sruggles, but about our heart. As Christians, we love Jesus because He first loved us. When we took the offered gift of salvation we also took on our cross. To be a follower of Jesus, we must be willing to give up all, though this is a life long learning process and I have yet to reach that goal. God HATES to see the wicked die, but rather that they would turn and live. God wants to see us all come to Himself.

We were made to fellowship with God (Acts 17:26-27; Gen. 3:8-9)

He has put eternity into our hearts. (Ecclesiastes 3:11)

He knows all of our days before we were formed. (Psalm 139:1-16)

One last verse I will leave you with is this. Hebrews 7:25 Jesus always lives to make intercession for us believers.

Hebrews 6:9 shows that we do not need to fear going the way of death provided we do not harden our hearts and always fear and look up to God. The last thing God wants to do is not let someone in heaven. His last prayer in the garden shows this as He asked God if there was any other way let this cup not fall on Him to bear, but there was no other way. That is why Jesus is the only way. Those of us that have recieved this great love and the Holy Spirit to guide us, then turn our backs on it all (again, not a struggle or slip up but a prelonged hardening of the heart) we are putting to shame the blood of Jesus. We will be worse off than a sinner that never believed.

Anyone that repents, changes their mind about Christ Jesus, and calls on Him to be saved will be saved. Only those who turn their back on the one Who gave them life will have to worry. Thus, stay humble and obedient to the Holy Spirit, and let us never harden our hearts against God, and live in sin as we once did. This is a harsh matter, as God cannot allow those who rebell against Him in the gates of heaven, for if He did, He would have no justice, and for that matter, no love for those with eternal life because heaven would become like hell.

God bless brother. Stay true

[Zemke]

Also remember the point being made from ch 5 on thru to 7 is moving forward, getting on with our walk, growing into maturity, not laying again a foundation but building on it. These things will assure us of not just falling back but increase our understanding of the more difficult things like the order of Melchizedek. Which by the way increases our faith. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God.

The writer of Hebrews rebukes them for being in need of milk when they should by this time be able to teach others. After all we are called to make disciples. We will not all be teachers but we should on some level and ability be able to teach. Same as the few will be called as evangelists but we are all called to evangelize.

And the posts above are correct, there is much written about this section of scripture but read 5,6 and 7 in prayer as a devotional for a while. You'll most likely read the whole of Hebrews and I'm sure the Lord will be faithful and teach you well.

[gdemoss]

There is a summary statement later in the book as well dealing with this very issue.

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)

But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

When I think of this, I think of the son of perdition, as he is one who is apostate. He began right but did not hold to the God of his fathers, he began to worship an idol instead. His number is said to be a number of a man 666, and by seeming coincidence we know that the verse divisions are not inspired but are the numbers of a man. John 6:66 is a verse about apostate Christians who left because they were offended in the truth about Christ hidden in spiritual words. The carnal mind is enmity against God and doesn't understand. The true mark of the beast is the mind of Sin and those who have it will readily accept any physical mark that is presented by the man of Sin. Whether or not this is actually the way it was intended to be received is of no real consequence but thought provoking to say the least.

Apostasy is simply apostasy and it is up to God to grant repentance or not. If one can come back to God, then God has granted repentance. If one cannot, then they join the ranks of those who have hearts hardened beyond repair. May the Lord be merciful in his judgments.

In Jesus Name,

Gary

[Matthitjah]

Looking

Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God, Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment. Hebrews 6:1-2

To

For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,

And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,

If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame. Hebrews 6:4-6

Jesus

Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

To declare, I say, at this time his righteousness: that he might be just, and the justifier of him which believeth in Jesus.

Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith. Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law. Romans 3:24-28

Alone

That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.

For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast.

For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. Ephesians 2:7-10

BINGO! Joe is correct.

The Hebrews were looking to their ceremony and rite rather than Christ.