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Was Jesus God?


GoldenEagle

Jesus is/was God?  

15 members have voted

  1. 1. Was Jesus God?

    • Yes, Jesus was and is God.
    • No, Jesus was a man.


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I think the problem is an assumption's being made that, if Jesus was/is God, He wouldn't be able to do things that Scripture states God doesn't do. I have seen no basis for this assumption.

Jesus was fully man and fully God, having a dualistic nature. This is why He could be tempted(human nature) but resist all temptation every time(divine nature). This is why He could forgive sin(divine nature) and He also slept(human nature). This is also why He was omniscient(divine nature) but also needed to eat and drink(human nature).

Neither nature interfered with nor impeded the other.

This is why the gnostics error was revealed- what God/Christ created in the beginning was not

flawed but the sin within that creation was... Not only has Christ so shown us in example but will return

and show us in millennial rule as He brings back the world from utter destruction, due to sin, to garden like status!

Then people will still follow after satan... wow He, The Lord Christ, our only stay! Love, Steven

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The answer that I have come up with, is based primarily (though not exclusively) on Philippians 2:5-11

Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ Jesus, who, being in the form of God, did not consider it robbery to be equal with God, but made Himself of no reputation, taking the form of a bondservant, and coming in the likeness of men. And being found in appearance as a man, He humbled Himself and became obedient to the point of death, even the death of the cross. Therefore God also has highly exalted Him and given Him the name which is above every name, that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of those in heaven, and of those on earth, and of those under the earth, 11 and that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

Is this: Jesus never "gave up" or "surrendered" any attributes of God (for then He would not be God), but rather that Jesus willingly chose to operate within the constraints or limitations inherent in living as a human being...

He got hungry, tired, and thirsty...felt pain, wept, was tempted...all the things we as people experience.

We have I think a tendency to look at His transfiguration on the mount as a miracle...I think the real miracle is that He kept all that glory hidden within Him the rest of the time!

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Guest shiloh357
Lol!!! I will take this as a rare compliment. My name is Mike, and I agree with all of Allofgrace's Message!!

Golden Eagle, you are dodging scriptures brother. Jesus was tempted, God can't be tempted. Can you sort that out?

Jesus's humanity was tempted and Jesus responded in His humanity with the Word of God and the power of the Holy Spirit. He did it that way in order to model for us how to resist temptation.

question.

Did Jesus operate on Earth as a God, or a man filled with the Holy Spirit being an example to us. Even we are told things ahead of time by the Holy Spirit, that don't make us God All knowing.

Both. Jesus was fully man and fully God with all His attributes of deity fully intact. Jesus was just as all-knowing on earth as He was in heaven.

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Gary:

Jesus was tempted means he was put in situations that proved him, they proved that he could not be tempted by sin as if he might chose to do so. We are admonished not to tempt the Lord our God who is the same God that can't be tempted. God has no desire to do that which is sinful and therefore cannot be tempted to sin.

I get to pick on Gary!!! Praise God!!!

Gary the scripture says he "WAS" Tempted in all ways. So these temptations actually did pull on him. He was in temptation many times. God can not be tempted, won't even give it a thought. So you and Golden Eagle need to read it again.

So His help to us was to actually feel the pressure of doing wrong, constantly nagging at him, constantly going through his mind to do Wrong. He went through that without committing the sin. So, He is able to help us with the same thing, when committing the sin becomes almost unbearable pressure. He knows exactly how we feel, He has a way out, He knows what to do.

Heb 12:4 Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.

Jesus did though. He was under pressure far past what any of us have experienced.

Jesus Is Lord.

Once again, Mike, you and I do not see it the same. You believe that to be tested is the same as an inner desire to do that which is evil. You accuse Jesus of wanting to sin but showing restraint. No way. But think what you will. He was made in the likeness of sinful flesh but there was no sin in him to entice him. The devil had to work from without and he could not penetrate because Jesus could not be tempted to sin though he could be tested all day long.

Due to our interaction here, I have gone over all the uses of the word in Greek and have learned some very interesting insights that have solidified my position. You can pick at/on me all day if you like but your still not going to do anything other than help me to understand that Jesus could not or can not be tempted to do evil. Never has, never will. As I am conformed into his image, I am finding that when I am tempted (proved) I am not drawn away by desire as I once was. Some sin that was once very desirable no longer has any appeal. My hope is one day none of it will, by the Grace of God working in me mightily. I suppose if a man has as much trouble with desiring evil things today as he did when he first came to Christ and is only hanging on by a thread, it might seem completely out of reach to think that one could ever stop desiring that which is evil.

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Gary:

Once again, Mike, you and I do not see it the same. You believe that to be tested is the same as an inner desire to do that which is evil. You accuse Jesus of wanting to sin but showing restraint. No way. But think what you will. He was made in the likeness of sinful flesh but there was no sin in him to entice him.

He took on sin when he went to the cross BTW..................

Gary, it's not a temptation if it does not entice you. Not enticement, no temptation.

If I say, Gary, lets go rob us a bank. We need the money. You drive, I'll go in and get the cash. You look at me as if I stepped off a space ship saying. No way. you crazy? Now get out of here Mike and don't come back unless you get some sense about you.

That is not a temptation to rob a bank. You did not give robbing a bank even a second thought.

You don't have to have sin in you to be tempted, you have to have a flesh body, and you have to have your own desire.

Just as God told Satan. You keep trying to entice me to put my hand on Job without cause. There is no reason to hurt Job.

God was not moved a bit by Satan and his nonsense. Satan lies through his teeth, why listen to him anyway?

Now a man at the store accidentally drops 20.00 on the ground and walks away. I spot it, look around, and pick it up. I really could use that 20.00 I think. No, it's not right, I better chase the man down and give it back. I run the man down and hand him his 20.00 he dropped.

I was tempted. I don't have theft in me, because I don't steal, yet at that moment the idea came to keep that money. I still did not sin though, I made the right choice and gave the money back.

Jesus was tempted at all points. He had to make the right choice, though there was some pull on him to do different. There is a difference in the desire of the flesh and strong spirit. Which one wins? Jesus had to deal with being a man, and showed us how that is done, because he went through the same things.

Jesus Is Lord.

Your understanding of temptation is different than what I believe the scriptures teach. When one is tempted to sin and does as you suggest concerning the suggestion of robbing a bank, when the person said no, I resist that temptation and will have no part of it, that is not sin but it is the way saints are to respond every time when tempted to sin, neither give place to the Devil. And you said yourself one has to have their own desire to sin, and Jesus did not have the desire to sin and your reasoning does not equal scripture as proof that He did just because He walked in the flesh. Your illustration about the $20 is the difference in your thinking and the difference in what Jesus would have thought in the first place. And neither of us know His exact thoughts but He is the spotless Lamb of God and when one grows in their sanctification when they see the person drop the $20 dollar bill they will automatically say to him, you dropped your money. One does not have to think, I will keep it.

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Gary:

Jesus was tempted means he was put in situations that proved him, they proved that he could not be tempted by sin as if he might chose to do so. We are admonished not to tempt the Lord our God who is the same God that can't be tempted. God has no desire to do that which is sinful and therefore cannot be tempted to sin.

I get to pick on Gary!!! Praise God!!!

Gary the scripture says he "WAS" Tempted in all ways. So these temptations actually did pull on him. He was in temptation many times. God can not be tempted, won't even give it a thought. So you and Golden Eagle need to read it again.

So His help to us was to actually feel the pressure of doing wrong, constantly nagging at him, constantly going through his mind to do Wrong. He went through that without committing the sin. So, He is able to help us with the same thing, when committing the sin becomes almost unbearable pressure. He knows exactly how we feel, He has a way out, He knows what to do.

Heb 12:4 Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.

Jesus did though. He was under pressure far past what any of us have experienced.

Jesus Is Lord.

Fearless, I jump into the fray!

There is nothing wrong with temptation...I think NOT giving into temptation MEANS you cannot be tempted.

tempt

(tebreve.gifmpt)

v. tempt·ed, tempt·ing, tempts

v.tr.

1.
To try to get (someone) to do wrong, especially by a promise of reward.

2.
To be inviting or attractive to:
A second helping tempted me. We refused the offer even though it tempted us.
See Synonyms at
.

3.
To provoke or to risk provoking:
Don't tempt fate.

4.
To cause to be strongly disposed:
He was tempted to walk out.

v.intr.

To be attractive or inviting:
a meal that tempts.

tempt[tɛmpt]

vb (tr)

1.
to attempt to persuade or entice to do something, esp something morally wrong or unwise

2.
to allure, invite, or attract

3.
to give rise to a desire in (someone) to do something; dispose
their unfriendliness tempted me to leave the party

4.
to risk provoking (esp in the phrase
tempt fate
)

[from Old French
tempter,
from Latin
temptāre
to test]

temptable
adj

tempter
n

To tempt simply means to try...try does not mean succeed.

Take at look at the temptation of Jesus as
recorded
in Luke 4:

Jesus, full of the Holy Spirit, returned from the Jordan and was led by the Spirit in the desert,
where for forty days he was tempted by the devil. He ate nothing during those days, and at the end of them he was hungry.

The devil said to him, “If you are the Son of God, tell this stone to become bread.”

Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Man does not live on bread alone.’

The devil led him up to a high place and showed him in an instant all the kingdoms of the world.
And he said to him, “I will give you all their authority and splendor, for it has been given to me, and I can give it to anyone I want to.
So if you worship me, it will all be yours.”

Jesus answered, “It is written: ‘Worship the Lord your God and serve him only.’

The devil led him to Jerusalem and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. “If you are the Son of God,” he said, “throw yourself down from here.
For it is written:

“‘He will command his angels concerning you

5]to guard you carefully;

they will lift you up in their hands,

5]so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.’

12Jesus answered, “It says: ‘Do not put the Lord your God to the test.’d

13When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time.

The little d there, refers to this, from Deut. 6:

Fear the Lord your God, serve him only and take your oaths in his name. 14Do not follow other gods, the gods of the peoples around you; 15for the Lord your God, who is among you, is a jealous God and his anger will burn against you, and he will destroy you from the face of the land. 16Do not test the Lord your God as you did at Massah. 17Be sure to keep the commands of the Lord your God and the stipulations and decrees he has given you. 18Do what is right and good in the Lord’s sight, so that it may go well with you and you may go in and take over the good land that the Lord promised on oath to your forefathers,

There are more, but since Jesus refers to Deuteronomy, we see that people do tempt God...they tempt Him to react. Because of sin or to prove He is God. Either way, He does not react and neither did Jesus.

I don't think you can state otherwise now, as scripture plainly states DON'T TEMPT GOD. It really does

It would not say that if it agree with your statement. Saying that God cannot be tempted is only one side of the equation.

He cannot be tempted NOT because nothing tempts Him, BUT because He is God. and above it all

IT IS WRITTEN: thou shalt not tempt the Lord your God....in other words, don't put Him on trial; don't try to 'prove' Him by 'testing' Him.

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Seavenseas:

There is nothing wrong with temptation...I think NOT giving into temptation MEANS you cannot be tempted.

Tempted means to pull on, try. If there is no pulling or trying then there is no temptation.

So, Not giving into being pulled by some flesh desire, means you can be tempted, but without sin.

That is what the scripture says. Do we have a hard time admitting that Jesus might not be the Super God we always envisioned while on earth? I think that might be the case.

Jesus Is Lord.

Mike....address the verses I provided regarding tempting God.

BTW? you are getting close to what I would consider kind of blasphemous in your ardor to prove yourself right. In bold above

The OT refers to tempting God. I did not write the OT and you need to address that. It does not agree with your very strange doctrine.

I think we may be dealing with super Mike who thinks he has it right while everyone else is wrong.

I am not going to get caught up in hit and run answers that do nothing but TRY to make it SEEM you know more than what

is actually known. And neither should anyone else

What do you have to say about the scripture that is saying DO NOT TEMPT GOD? It exists, it's there, you can't avoid it

and you certainly are not going to sidetrack me. No I don't look like a pitbull

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allofgrace

And neither of us know His exact thoughts but He is the spotless Lamb of God and when one grows in their sanctification when they see the person drop the $20 dollar bill they will automatically say to him, you dropped your money. One does not have to think, I will keep it.

I have had temptations similar to this. The only problem is that temptation means to entice. Jesus was tempted at all points. As much as we don't want to say the Lord was moved at all, to do that we would have to change the Word the Holy Spirit used to something else.

I don't believe his walk down here as a man was just a cakewalk. I actually believe he had to fight his flesh, and overcome. He had to use the Word against Satan. There is no defense if you don't feel tempted or threatened.

I have a hard time diminishing what he had to endure and go through. Not saying anyone here is, but He was not operating as God, He was operating as man with the Holy Spirit. The same way we have to operate. Being the Son of God, did not mean he had access to all his Glory and power. I fully believe he had to do this as a man, under the Law for it to be valid. I don't believe it was that easy on him.

Jesus Is Lord.

But you are forgetting He did not come with a sinful nature as everyone has that is born of Adam. He came as the 2nd Adam and never consented to sinful desires, He resisted them. You are entitled to your opinion and the only reason I even respond on it is because you make it seem like your view is scriptural without a doubt and it is surely not the accepted view which has been taught for hundreds of years. How many others writers of NT commentaries share your point of view? The majority is not always right, but it says something when ones views are not shared by many over the years.

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True, I am super Mike. One thing I don't do is use spiritualism or religion to interpret the Word. I see the Word as God speaking to man (and women with fox pictures) So any speaking to man, would have to make the word comprehensible on a simple level with the Help of the Holy Spirit.

There are times when religious foundations help support understanding. There are times we keep it simple.

Spiritualism to interpret the Word? I don't even know what that means....... :hmmm: How simple is it to actually state in the OT that God shall not

be tempted? I'm growing old on that one Mike....no gray hairs yet, but I might have to change my face cream

Simple is sometimes the friend of overlooked which, super Mike, (kindly notice the lower case s as you have not as yet earned your "S")

you are currently invoking as the word du jour but it does not have the super powers you think it does

Fear the Lord your God, serve him only and take your oaths in his name. 14Do not follow other gods, the gods of the peoples around you; 15for the Lordyour God, who is among you, is a jealous God and his anger will burn against you, and he will destroy you from the face of the land. 16Do not test the Lord your God as you did at Massah. 17Be sure to keep the commands of the Lord your God and the stipulations and decrees he has given you. 18Do what is right and good in the Lord’s sight, so that it may go well with you and you may go in and take over the good land that the Lordpromised on oath to your forefathers,

Why does it say in the verse in bold type above from Deut. 6 that we (well the Israelites in this case) should not TEST God? and why does Jesus

in the Luke narrative tell the serpent that scripture states we should not tempt God?

The Majority is mostly always wrong, but when it comes to scripture It seems a landslide of one side is right and one side is wrong, both having about the same amount.

Really? Scripture is not interpreted and doctrines are not formed by majority. Scripture plainly states that the Holy Spirit is our teacher.

There are some people on these boards who seem to think that they are the only pupil...please do not be one of them

1Ti_2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

So it is written: "The first man Adam became a living being"; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit. I Cor 15:45.....Mike, how would you reconcile the verse

you quoted from I Tim and the one I posted from I Cor? They are both scripture...are they in conflict?

You are satisfying your argument with your use of the term sides in order to make it seem that it is one or the other when in fact it is neither.

You are inserting your own peculiar form of logic and cannot fathom why it makes no sense to anyone else. This is about the worst exegetical

argument I have seen from you. Understanding the Bible is not some kind of maze that only a few selected persons ever find their way out of

Now kindly address the scriptures that state we should not tempt God because you have stated that God cannot be tempted and therefore

Jesus was not God as half the populace thinks of Him, but rather something else that Mike has a grasp on...yet Jesus Himself states to the devil

it is written "DON'T TEMPT GOD"...as in God in heaven...ESPECIALLY as you do not believe Jesus was exactly God on earth,

how do you explain Him telling the devil not to tempt GOD who was/is in heaven?

AND HERE: For just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son gives life to whom he is pleased to give it. John 5:21...why is Jesus putting Himself on par with God here? That would be blasphemy and deserving of the death penalty which is exactly why the religious leaders sought to kill him

They understood what Jesus was saying and Who He compared Himself to; you don't?

​It is from this and many other verses that we derive the doctrine of the Trinity.

(So this is not about Jesus being tempted, it goes to a sub level lower and a discussion about who Jesus was when He was with us on the Earth)

That's gobbledy- gook. It might seem that way to someone who believes Jesus was not conceived by the Holy Spirit, but not

to those who do believe He was as much God as man.

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(So this is not about Jesus being tempted, it goes to a sub level lower and a discussion about who Jesus was when He was with us on the Earth)

That's gobbledy- gook. It might seem that way to someone who believes Jesus was not conceived by the Holy Spirit, but not

to those who do believe He was as much God as man.

:thumbsup:

The Living God Of Jacob Is Worthy So Worthy

Thou art worthy, O Lord, to receive glory and honour and power: for thou hast created all things, and for thy pleasure they are and were created. Revelation 4:11

Of Our Total Love And Worship

Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem, Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him. Matthew 2:1-2

And Worshiped

When they saw the star, they rejoiced with exceeding great joy. And when they were come into the house, they saw the young child with Mary his mother, and fell down, and worshipped him: and when they had opened their treasures, they presented unto him gifts; gold, and frankincense, and myrrh. Matthew 2:10-11

He Was

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