Why no unity?

[GoldenEagle]

 

One very big reason is that we each have unique needs the Lord ministers the Word of God to us to meet those unique needs.   The Lord can minister a verse or passage of Scripture to you to meet a need in your life and then minister the same passage to me to meet a completely different need in my life.  Our difference in perspective is based on the different needs we had that were met in that passage.  Therefore, we come away with unique and different ways of approaching that passage.

 

There are cultural differences as well.   If you live in Southern California, you are going to have a different take on Scripture than someone living in rural, East Tennessee.

 

Denominations are, by and large divided more over traditions than essential doctrine.  Many of the theolgical differences are over secondary issues, not primary issues.

 

Let me ask you this.  If being "unified" means that we all have the same doctrinal views, wouldn't that stymie personal study of the Word of God?  I mean, think of it like this.  Whose views win out if we all have to believe the same things in order for there to be "unity?"   It requires a willingness on the part of everyone to forego the ability to think and study for themselves and simply believe what they are told they must believe in order preserve unity.   So whose doctrinal views become the views of the collective?  Who gets to decide what everyone must agree upon (whether they like it or not)?

 

We have to be careful that we are not confusing "unity" with comformity of thought and manipulation/control.  I always have a problem when people start defining unity in doctrinal terms because it means that we must leave our own convictions at the door and simply follow what we are told to believe.

 

 

Amen to this whole post.

 

I think the priesthood of the Believer is essential to understanding unity of the Body - each Believer can approach God directly through Jesus Christ.

 

I agree that most denominational differences are over the traditions of men than essential doctrines.

 

Two or three people will view a passage in defferent ways depending on their culture, experience, and perspective. Yet on the essentials of the faith I'm sure we could all agree.

 

I think this question in bold is important - who gets to decide what everyone should think? "Unity" underlined abovehas been used on many occasions to exert control and comformity of thought on others.

God bless,

GE

[firestormx]

 

Why is there no unity in the body of Christ?

 

There are disputes on every single point of doctrine there is. Very few agree on a lot of things. Even fewer agree on most things. I've never come across 2 believers that agreed on everything. The bible states in the book of Acts that the Apostles were of 1 accord. The first believers were in unity. With each other and Christ.

 

Why aren't we?

 

People often say it's ok, because we are never going to agree on everything. But, the bible says Christ is not divided. Where is the unity? Is it we understand the scripture differently? Well, if we are all being led to the truth by the same Holy Spirit, then shouldn't it be the same truth we arrive at?  Is it because we are at different places in our walk with Christ? But even then, the same core truth should be there, should be the same. Just built upon. Line upon line. An unfolding living revelation coming from the living Word.

 

How can every believer be hearing and being led by the same Holy Spirit and all of us come to different answers to the exact same questions? Why is it seen as such a bad thing to say " I don't know " or " I was wrong ". If Christ is love, then shouldn't unity start there to? Isn't forgiveness apart of love?

 

Where is the Unity?

 

May the living Lord Jesus Bless you all

 

Firestormx

Joseph

1. One very big reason is that we each have unique needs the Lord ministers the Word of God to us to meet those unique needs.   The Lord can minister a verse or passage of Scripture to you to meet a need in your life and then minister the same passage to me to meet a completely different need in my life.  Our difference in perspective is based on the different needs we had that were met in that passage.  Therefore, we come away with unique and different ways of approaching that passage.

 

2. There are cultural differences as well.   If you live in Southern California, you are going to have a different take on Scripture than someone living in rural, East Tennessee.

 

3. Denominations are, by and large divided more over traditions than essential doctrine.  Many of the theolgical differences are over secondary issues, not primary issues.

 

4. Let me ask you this.  If being "unified" means that we all have the same doctrinal views, wouldn't that stymie personal study of the Word of God?  I mean, think of it like this.  Whose views win out if we all have to believe the same things in order for there to be "unity?"   It requires a willingness on the part of everyone to forego the ability to think and study for themselves and simply believe what they are told they must believe in order preserve unity.   So whose doctrinal views become the views of the collective?  Who gets to decide what everyone must agree upon (whether they like it or not)?

 

We have to be careful that we are not confusing "unity" with comformity of thought and manipulation/control.  I always have a problem when people start defining unity in doctrinal terms because it means that we must leave our own convictions at the door and simply follow what we are told to believe.

 

I have numbered your response and will take them in order.

 

1. If you don't understand that there are different levels of revelation on a biblical subject, and there being different levels of revelation has nothing to do with the heart of the core beliefs or unity then there is nothing for us to discuss.

 

2. Christ is 1. Not 500 but . I don't care about cultural differences. It should all be nothing in Christ. At least in regards to the Word of God. One Spirit and one baptism.

 

3.  I will quote the word on this one. By your traditions you have made the Word of God of no effect.

 

4. first, reread my first response. then I say this. True unity will never come as long as people insist on doing things out of there own heads. It comes from being one in Christ. Just as Christ and the Father are one, so we should be one in Christ. That was Christ's prayer in the book of John. So let me ask you this. Would Jesus pray and ask for something that was not possible for us? Were there any division's between Jesus and the Father? No of course not. We are suppose to be one, unified just like them. You want an example of proper unity since you accuse me of " thought and manipulation/control ". Then look to Jesus and the book of John. I don't remember telling you to believe what your told. you have falsely accused me as far as I am concerned. You have also lied about me in your post. Claiming I said and implied things I have not, which makes them lies. Jesus does not tell lies on people. So it is clear what spirit is leading you as far as I am concerned. I will not respond to you again.

Edited August 19, 2013 by firestormx

[firestormx]

For all the posts that say " we the believers can't be of the same mind ". I simple say this.

 

1 Corinthians 1:10

Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

 

1 Corinthians 12:25

25 That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.

 

Ephesians 4:3-4

3 Endeavoring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. 4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; 5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism.

 

2 Corinthians 13:11

Finally, brethren, farewell. Be perfect, be of good comfort, be of one mind, live in peace; and the God of love and peace shall be with you.

 

Acts 4:32

And the multitude of them that believed were of one heart and of one soul: neither said any of them that aught of the things which he possessed was his own; but they had all things common.

 

Philippians 1:27

Only let your conversation be as it becometh the gospel of Christ: that whether I come and see you, or else be absent, I may hear of your affairs, that ye stand fast in one spirit, with one mind striving together for the faith of the gospel;

 

Acts 1:14

These all continued with one accord in prayer and supplication, with the women, and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brethren.

 

1 Peter 3:8

Finally, be ye all of one mind, having compassion one of another, love as brethren, be pitiful, be courteous:

 

 

I think the bible is pretty clear about whether or not we can and should be in unity. The question remains, How is this accomplished? 

[rebbell]

If thine eye (the heart) be single, thy whole body is filled with light. One person with a single eye (heart) being sold out to GOD, doesn't fix the entire body, the body being made up of many believers.

What can you do, to be a light to them, that they see something in you and want to have it to? You have to be willing to suffer for HIS names sake, because you will. However, you will grow in an abundance of faith and Spirit. Are you willing to allow the Spirit to work through you? GOD is in control.

There will be many that will not like what comes forth from you. Are you willing to pick up your cross and follow JESUS? They will judge you, condemn you, persecute you. GOD is able to make you stand. PRAY about it, asking GOD to use you, and then hang on because GOD will not be put in a little box.

Why no unity? ummm, too many carnal, fleshly, mortal christians in the house?

[firestormx]

If thine eye (the heart) be single, thy whole body is filled with light. One person with a single eye (heart) being sold out to GOD, doesn't fix the entire body, the body being made up of many believers.

What can you do, to be a light to them, that they see something in you and want to have it to? You have to be willing to suffer for HIS names sake, because you will. However, you will grow in an abundance of faith and Spirit. Are you willing to allow the Spirit to work through you? GOD is in control.

There will be many that will not like what comes forth from you. Are you willing to pick up your cross and follow JESUS? They will judge you, condemn you, persecute you. GOD is able to make you stand. PRAY about it, asking GOD to use you, and then hang on because GOD will not be put in a little box.

Why no unity? ummm, too many carnal, fleshly, mortal christians in the house?

You have given me much to pray about. Thank you for your post.

[GoldenEagle]

For all the posts that say " we the believers can't be of the same mind ". I simple say this.

 

<snip>

 

I think the bible is pretty clear about whether or not we can and should be in unity. The question remains, How is this accomplished? 

 

 

Good question... What do you suggest?

 

I suppose how unity looks is a varying of opinion. Unity of purpose is possible I believe.

 

Disagreements will always occur in the body of Christ this side of Christ's 2nd return. Hopefully, those disagreements are on minor issues of the faith and non-salvation issues.

 

I believe we're called to the same purpose - glorify/honor/obey God, tell others the Good News found in Jesus Christ alone, and make disciples.

 

God bless,

GE

[GoldenEagle]

 

 

1. One very big reason is that we each have unique needs the Lord ministers the Word of God to us to meet those unique needs.   The Lord can minister a verse or passage of Scripture to you to meet a need in your life and then minister the same passage to me to meet a completely different need in my life.  Our difference in perspective is based on the different needs we had that were met in that passage.  Therefore, we come away with unique and different ways of approaching that passage.

 

2. There are cultural differences as well.   If you live in Southern California, you are going to have a different take on Scripture than someone living in rural, East Tennessee.

 

3. Denominations are, by and large divided more over traditions than essential doctrine.  Many of the theolgical differences are over secondary issues, not primary issues.

 

4. Let me ask you this.  If being "unified" means that we all have the same doctrinal views, wouldn't that stymie personal study of the Word of God?  I mean, think of it like this.  Whose views win out if we all have to believe the same things in order for there to be "unity?"   It requires a willingness on the part of everyone to forego the ability to think and study for themselves and simply believe what they are told they must believe in order preserve unity.   So whose doctrinal views become the views of the collective?  Who gets to decide what everyone must agree upon (whether they like it or not)?

 

We have to be careful that we are not confusing "unity" with comformity of thought and manipulation/control.  I always have a problem when people start defining unity in doctrinal terms because it means that we must leave our own convictions at the door and simply follow what we are told to believe.

 

I have numbered your response and will take them in order.

 

1. If you don't understand that there are different levels of revelation on a biblical subject, and there being different levels of revelation has nothing to do with the heart of the core beliefs or unity then there is nothing for us to discuss.

 

2. Christ is 1. Not 500 but . I don't care about cultural differences. It should all be nothing in Christ. At least in regards to the Word of God. One Spirit and one baptism.

 

3.  I will quote the word on this one. By your traditions you have made the Word of God of no effect.

 

4. first, reread my first response. then I say this. True unity will never come as long as people insist on doing things out of there own heads. It comes from being one in Christ. Just as Christ and the Father are one, so we should be one in Christ. That was Christ's prayer in the book of John. So let me ask you this. Would Jesus pray and ask for something that was not possible for us? Were there any division's between Jesus and the Father? No of course not. We are suppose to be one, unified just like them. You want an example of proper unity since you accuse me of " thought and manipulation/control ". Then look to Jesus and the book of John. I don't remember telling you to believe what your told. you have falsely accused me as far as I am concerned. You have also lied about me in your post. Claiming I said and implied things I have not, which makes them lies. Jesus does not tell lies on people. So it is clear what spirit is leading you as far as I am concerned. I will not respond to you again.

 

 

Firestorm, I'm not sure Shiloh was accusing you brother. From what I read he was speaking in general terms and just happened to be responding to the OP.

 

Remember, just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they're attacking you as a person?

 

God bless,

GE

[firestormx]

 

 

 

1. One very big reason is that we each have unique needs the Lord ministers the Word of God to us to meet those unique needs.   The Lord can minister a verse or passage of Scripture to you to meet a need in your life and then minister the same passage to me to meet a completely different need in my life.  Our difference in perspective is based on the different needs we had that were met in that passage.  Therefore, we come away with unique and different ways of approaching that passage.

 

2. There are cultural differences as well.   If you live in Southern California, you are going to have a different take on Scripture than someone living in rural, East Tennessee.

 

3. Denominations are, by and large divided more over traditions than essential doctrine.  Many of the theolgical differences are over secondary issues, not primary issues.

 

4. Let me ask you this.  If being "unified" means that we all have the same doctrinal views, wouldn't that stymie personal study of the Word of God?  I mean, think of it like this.  Whose views win out if we all have to believe the same things in order for there to be "unity?"   It requires a willingness on the part of everyone to forego the ability to think and study for themselves and simply believe what they are told they must believe in order preserve unity.   So whose doctrinal views become the views of the collective?  Who gets to decide what everyone must agree upon (whether they like it or not)?

 

We have to be careful that we are not confusing "unity" with comformity of thought and manipulation/control.  I always have a problem when people start defining unity in doctrinal terms because it means that we must leave our own convictions at the door and simply follow what we are told to believe.

 

I have numbered your response and will take them in order.

 

1. If you don't understand that there are different levels of revelation on a biblical subject, and there being different levels of revelation has nothing to do with the heart of the core beliefs or unity then there is nothing for us to discuss.

 

2. Christ is 1. Not 500 but . I don't care about cultural differences. It should all be nothing in Christ. At least in regards to the Word of God. One Spirit and one baptism.

 

3.  I will quote the word on this one. By your traditions you have made the Word of God of no effect.

 

4. first, reread my first response. then I say this. True unity will never come as long as people insist on doing things out of there own heads. It comes from being one in Christ. Just as Christ and the Father are one, so we should be one in Christ. That was Christ's prayer in the book of John. So let me ask you this. Would Jesus pray and ask for something that was not possible for us? Were there any division's between Jesus and the Father? No of course not. We are suppose to be one, unified just like them. You want an example of proper unity since you accuse me of " thought and manipulation/control ". Then look to Jesus and the book of John. I don't remember telling you to believe what your told. you have falsely accused me as far as I am concerned. You have also lied about me in your post. Claiming I said and implied things I have not, which makes them lies. Jesus does not tell lies on people. So it is clear what spirit is leading you as far as I am concerned. I will not respond to you again.

 

 

Firestorm, I'm not sure Shiloh was accusing you brother. From what I read he was speaking in general terms and just happened to be responding to the OP.

 

Remember, just because someone disagrees with you doesn't mean they're attacking you as a person?

 

God bless,

GE

 

Post was addressing me, so how can I see it but as an attack on me?

[firestormx]

 

For all the posts that say " we the believers can't be of the same mind ". I simple say this.

 

<snip>

 

I think the bible is pretty clear about whether or not we can and should be in unity. The question remains, How is this accomplished? 

 

 

Good question... What do you suggest?

 

I suppose how unity looks is a varying of opinion. Unity of purpose is possible I believe.

 

Disagreements will always occur in the body of Christ this side of Christ's 2nd return. Hopefully, those disagreements are on minor issues of the faith and non-salvation issues.

 

I believe we're called to the same purpose - glorify/honor/obey God, tell others the Good News found in Jesus Christ alone, and make disciples.

 

God bless,

GE

 

Don't know, that's why I asked. The bible says we can be of one mind. Paul clearly had a deeper level of revelation than most, even in his own time. But, he said himself we can still be of one mind in Christ. If that's what the bible says, then that's what I want.

[Qnts2]

I have been on outreach's and at these outreach's to share the gospel, has been a group of people from varying denominations, in agreement on one thing, that Jesus is Lord and Savior and the only way to God is Jesus, and that all people need Jesus. We were in unity, working together.  I totally enjoyed our services and prayer time before going out each day. Some were Baptist and others were Charismatic. One person asked for prayer and the charismatics were right there laying on hands while the Baptists were praying for the person with their heads bowed, all in agreement in Jesus name.  

 

One day, I was assigned to go door to door with a Calvinist pastor. In between houses, we discussed Calvinism. He was trying to understand why I was not a Calvinist. When we got to the next door, we were in unity, sharing the gospel. At the end of the time, we were very good friends, and both of us really enjoyed going door to door sharing about Jesus, and we both enjoyed our theological discussion even though we saw things differently it was a good and fun time of discussion.  

 

In the first century, many of the biblical stories are around sharing the gospel, and sharing the gospel, especially with the Jewish community is often very similar to the book of Acts in many ways.

 

I used to read scripture and desire to experience what they experienced in the first century. I found it on the streets with other Christians of differing denominations, sharing the gospel.