End times prophecy is confusing

[OakWood]

Really there are three wars.

 

The first being the war of Ezk 38 and 39; most likely pre-trib  (Gog and Magog, Persia , Cush, Gomer, Beth Togarmah, and many other nations.  Here the nation of Israel buries the bodies of the dead for seven months and burns the weapons of war for seven years.

 

Secondly Armageddon (Valley of Meggido), this is where the kings of the whole world come to meet (Rev 16:14), including the 200,000,000 from the East.  This is just prior to the Second Coming.

 

Thirdly, the war which is post Mill which includes Gog and Magog, and the whole earth who follow Satan.

 

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

Yes, that makes sense. Thanks also for explaining what Megiddo is. Do you also believe that there is a 4th war which comes before Ezekiel 38? I mean the Psalm 83 war.

[Montana Marv]

 

Really there are three wars.

 

The first being the war of Ezk 38 and 39; most likely pre-trib  (Gog and Magog, Persia , Cush, Gomer, Beth Togarmah, and many other nations.  Here the nation of Israel buries the bodies of the dead for seven months and burns the weapons of war for seven years.

 

Secondly Armageddon (Valley of Meggido), this is where the kings of the whole world come to meet (Rev 16:14), including the 200,000,000 from the East.  This is just prior to the Second Coming.

 

Thirdly, the war which is post Mill which includes Gog and Magog, and the whole earth who follow Satan.

 

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

Yes, that makes sense. Thanks also for explaining what Megiddo is. Do you also believe that there is a 4th war which comes before Ezekiel 38? I mean the Psalm 83 war.

 

Could be the war of Ezk 38 and 39, for they have wanted to destroy Israel becoming a nation (1948)

 

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Don Dobbin]

The church since the first century AD, has been under man made doctrine not Biblical Doctrine. So the churches actions do not coincide with the Bible. The book of conviction Matthew 18; 3,4, "become like little children". He did not say children but little children, and we know little children are always wanting to learn, older children know everything (like I did, LOL). If you truly study Proverbs 1-4,8&9, (surly Jesus written)it is about understanding, knowledge and Wisdom. In the New Testament reference is made to loving each other approximately 117 times, the Lord your God 40 times and your enemy 7 times. Church today is depicted in Matthew 23; 15 & 25 especially, (15) "You travel over land and sea to make one conversion, and leave them a biggewr product of hell than what you already are.", (25) "You clean the outside of the cup and saucer but leave the inside corupt and dirty", exactly what takes place today. If we do not take care of our own people, what good are we to other's. The most important of the Jewish deciples stayed in Jerusalem until they were forced out. The Book of Matthew convicts you while the Book of John instructs you in how to live in Christ. John 15 "The Vine and the Branches" and we are the branches which are suppose to produce fruit. Churches think going to a foriegn country for two weeks is producing fruit, fruit is only good if it produces seeds and that takes more than two weeks.

God Bless

[GlidingWings]

I'm using the NKJV where scripture pasrts are. When I mentioned Megiddo that equals the name Armageddon. Some Bible scholars use the name Megiddo in replacement of Armageddon cause many believe Armageddon will happen in the valley of Megiddo. To not make it confusing I will call this Armageddon.

Armageddon and Gog and Magog are 2 different end time wars. They are mistaken to be as one because of its so parallel circumstances, both wars leads armies to fight, both include Israel and both has God’s intervention and great judgment. So what is the difference?

Turn to Rev. 20:7 read from this point. See Satan is released one more time. This happens after the 1000 years. Keep reading. What do we see? Gog and Magog. Yes only mentioned after this 1000 years. So this war is not the great Trib. Armageddon is the war of the great Trib entirely a different war in a different time line. Yet Gog and Magog in Rev chapter 20 says the armies will number as the sand of the sea. This is telling us a world wide war with many nations.

Now look in verse 9 fire will come down and consume them.

Satanic Rebellion Crushed

⁷ Now when the thousand years have expired, Satan will be released from his prison ⁸ and will go out to deceive the nations which are in the four corners of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle, whose number is as the sand of the sea. ⁹ They went up on the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city. And fire came down from God out of heaven and devoured them. ¹⁰ The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where^[b] the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.

 

So what? How is this Ezekiel 38? Well the name Gog and Magog should be enough clue. But now look at Ezekiel 38:22.

²² And I will bring him to judgment with pestilence and bloodshed; I will rain down on him, on his troops, and on the many peoples who are with him, flooding rain, great hailstones, fire, and brimstone.

 

See this is Gods judgments. Look at the part where it says that hail and fire will rain down from Heaven. This is the war of Gog and Magog in Rev chapter 20 after the millennium when Satan is released to deceive the nations once more. This is the final war of all wars. .

Armageddon ends the great trib and the return of Christ first judgment, First resurrection. Now the second End time war. Gog and Magog. This war brings Gods’ final and last judgment. This is the second resurrection, Second judgments. In which these the books were open to find whose names were written or noon the book of Life.

This then makes sense why it starts in Rev chapter 21. I looked and a saw a New Heaven and New Earth. Armageddon was the brightness of Jesus appearance.. That’s not the description of Ezekiel 38 that is”not” the judgment spoken in Ezekiel 38. So Armageddon is not Ezekiel 38. Rather it is Gog and Magog is Ezekiel 38, Rev 20:7-10.

Why does Rev chapter 20 use more elaboration? I don’t know. But Gog and Magog tells us what war to read about. So Armageddon happens at the end of the trib. Gog and Magog happens after the millennium Armageddon chapter 19. Gog and Magog chapter 20. Armageddon armies are killed and God's first judgments. Gog and Magog great armies killed God second judgment final war. As for now we don’t need to worry about Gog and Magog. Only now to focus on the Armageddon great trib war which is most near to us.

Is anyone confused? Does this not make sense? Perhaps it may or may not. But it is much about studying the last 4 chapters study slowly. If this is read to quickly this will not be well understood or even considered. These are last 4 moving chapters in the Bible..So many changes in so few verses.

Armageddon is the almost the end of the world war. But Gog and Magog is the End of the World war.

Armageddon is first judgments and first resurrection while as Magog is the “second” judgment and second resurrection.

Is this confusing? Does it seem like we are seeing doubles? Armageddon is not Ezekiel 38. No, but Gog and Magog after the millennium 1000 years Rev chapter 20:7-10 is the Ezekiel 38 war. Armageddon is not the final war. It is the final war at the end of the great trib. . But Gog and Magog is the final war of all flesh and blood. But it makes sense now only the war of Gog and Magog leads to the second judgments of God. Compare Ezekiel 38:22 fire and hail and Rev 20:9 fire from Heaven. If a Christian thinks this is too double too much in appearance as being the same don’t worry. Its not mandatory to know this. As of now Armageddon is much closer and does involve Middle East nations and Europe. Sure enough the Americas will get involved too.

If some Christians can't make differences between Armageddon and the second different war Gog and Magog nothing to be frustrated about. . Focus on the Bible should be a relationship with Jesus leading others to know Christ personally. Our witnessing is much greater than Prophecy debates. Prophecy is extra credential understanding. Salvation is mandatory teaching to share to others. If we share only prophecy alone it is not enough. The Bible teaches we prophecy in “Part. Not in whole.

So if any Christian reading at this forum does not understand much Prophecy let it not frustrate or hinder your Faith. Keep doing the talents and producing good fruits. Some have the gift of Prophecy, some in giving to the needy, some teaching Gods love and forgiveness, and some in doing projects to help friends or family.

Armageddon is just a war. Gog and Magog is just a war. It does not change the who is saved and not factors. We can agree or disagree but in the end it won't really matter. Only that God will reveal all this in His time. You believe its one and I believe its 2 but this is nothing of a great challenge. For each war after all will be devastating at most. These are wars people will not be happy about. Let us not lose hindsight of our basic foundation.

Go back to Matt. 5 the Beatitudes. Remind ourselves why are we here? Prophecy helps us but does not lead them to Christ. Matt. 5 is more of a chapter that leads those to Christ. Sure this is the prophecy section. We speak of prophetic issues. But never let this to be our entire goal of sharing. Hal Lindsay only leads people to begin a News caster end times bible prophecy messenger. He lacks leading anyone to God for hope. Billy Graham is a preacher who leads people straight to the Cross. Hal Lindsay can be just distracting. Graham approach brings us to the heart. Think Grahams approach and not Lindsay approach to Bible study even Prophecy. . Salvation must always lead us and be first on our tongues. So whoever understands prophecy or not let it be so. But may all who believe also all be saved.

2Peter 3:9 NKJV

9 The Lord is not slack concerning His promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us,[b] not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

Edited December 23, 2013 by GlidingWings

[Guest DRS81]

This thread was not started because..

 

I apologize for upsetting you good sir. Peace be with you.

[Guest]

 

This thread was not started because..

 

I apologize for upsetting you good sir. Peace be with you.

 

Merry Christmas!

[other one]

End times prophecy is confusing

 

86 posts and it's still confusing .......     carry on.

[Retrobyter]

Shalom, WillowWood.

 

 

Really there are three wars.

 

The first being the war of Ezk 38 and 39; most likely pre-trib  (Gog and Magog, Persia , Cush, Gomer, Beth Togarmah, and many other nations.  Here the nation of Israel buries the bodies of the dead for seven months and burns the weapons of war for seven years.

 

Secondly Armageddon (Valley of Meggido), this is where the kings of the whole world come to meet (Rev 16:14), including the 200,000,000 from the East.  This is just prior to the Second Coming.

 

Thirdly, the war which is post Mill which includes Gog and Magog, and the whole earth who follow Satan.

 

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

Yes, that makes sense. Thanks also for explaining what Megiddo is. Do you also believe that there is a 4th war which comes before Ezekiel 38? I mean the Psalm 83 war.

 

 

I really appreciate the discussions I have with Montana Marv; so, please don't take this as a criticism of him, but "Armageddon" is an English transliteration of a Greek transliteration of the Hebrew words "Har Megiddown." (Oy veh! So many languages!) These words mean "MOUNTAIN of Megiddow." It's talking about Tel Megiddo in Isra'el. You can Google it and see actual pictures of the place. The valley that is associated with that Tel is Gei-Yizr`e'l, or the valley of Jezreel, north of the Tel and southeast of Haifa, Isra'el. The Tel is an ancient "guard post" (although today, it's a prison) that guards the pass through the mountains FROM the valley on a southward trek.

 

With the exception of the war after the Millennium, it might be better to see these as battles within a single war than as separate wars, btw. 

[Spock]

Why is that? Why does God have christians pulling their hair out trying to figure it all out?

Simply put, I think God loves it when we diligently search to know the truth. He seems to like us to learn how to persevere and wait. It also develops character that he is looking for. I think.....

[Spock]

Really there are three wars.

 

The first being the war of Ezk 38 and 39; most likely pre-trib  (Gog and Magog, Persia , Cush, Gomer, Beth Togarmah, and many other nations.  Here the nation of Israel buries the bodies of the dead for seven months and burns the weapons of war for seven years.

 

Secondly Armageddon (Valley of Meggido), this is where the kings of the whole world come to meet (Rev 16:14), including the 200,000,000 from the East.  This is just prior to the Second Coming.

 

Thirdly, the war which is post Mill which includes Gog and Magog, and the whole earth who follow Satan.

 

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

Yes, that makes sense. Thanks also for explaining what Megiddo is. Do you also believe that there is a 4th war which comes before Ezekiel 38? I mean the Psalm 83 war.

Yes, I think Psalm 83 will be the next war where Damascus is leveled.

I also seem to think Ezekiel 38 and 39 are two separate wars, not the same.