Hypocrisy

[Guest AFlameOfFire]

Integrity, that's a good one too.

You can see a common theme when you study integrity in the scriptures. Most notably in Job who responds in various places according to the same. God points out so much in Job (to Satan) in respects to holding fast to his integrity. That seems to mirror holding fast to the faith and with a good conscience. Or at least not to have your own conscience reproach you. Paul himself exercised himself therein also. "For herein I exercise myself, to always have a good conscience void of offense toward God and man. Toward both.

Pharisees leaven was hypocricy, that's the leaven we are told to beware of, and the Pharisees "say but do not" they don't seem to be much of a danger in word (as long as you don't do after the works (or follow after the examples). Jesus said do as they say not what they do so much because they don't do as they say it seems.

[Hall7]

I think some possess the ability to help others but for some reason don't know how to help themselves. If you were able to fix someone's broken arm but couldn't fix your own would it be wrong to point out how they can fix their arm? I think it all depends on how we say things to others too, we shouldn't judge them but point out their faults to them if in doing so will help them.

[Guest AFlameOfFire]

I think some possess the ability to help others but for some reason don't know how to help themselves. If you were able to fix someone's broken arm but couldn't fix your own would it be wrong to point out how they can fix their arm? I think it all depends on how we say things to others too, we shouldn't judge them but point out their faults to them if in doing so will help them.

There is that "Physician heal thyself verse" that being Christ Jesus

But maybe its more like whats shown in 2 Sam 12:5 found in Davids own doing (and words). Or maybe better shown in Nathan's.

For example when Nathan comes to tell him a story about a particular injustice (put a little differently) but concerning "some other man". By the same it says David's anger was greatly kindled against the man; and he issues this judgment saying to Nathan, As the LORD liveth, the man that hath done this thing shall surely die: And he shall restore the lamb fourfold, because he did this thing, and because he had no pity.

Then basically Nathan responds, And Nathan said to David, "Thou art the man"

Seems more like Nathan didn't have a plank and David did, and Nathan helped David see more clearly, and not for pointing out Davids sin but telling a story where David could see his own more clearly on the second pass.

David judged the man who did this should die, so he was was judging the man (who was actually himself). He had done similar but didn't approve of it (in another) but he wasnt trying to fix any broken arms. If he could find that man he might have fixed him a gallow and hung him on it lol.

Still hadn't escaped God's judgment for that doing.

[kwikphilly]

Blessings Everyone,

     The old saying,"If the shoe fits" comes to my mind.......I have received many a good Word as a blessing from God for my own benefit from those unaware(& cannot help themselves)but I thought we were talking mainly about addressing hypocrisy to another.......Flame has hit the nail on the head and Jesus warning to us about the leaven,I think

                                                                                                                With love,in Christ-Kwik

[Hall7]

@ FlameOfFire. That's a good example and I agree with you. I used the example of a broken arm as a metaphor. Let's say I had a problem with pride and knew about it (which I do uhm), I'm not going to try to help someone else with their pride before I'm able to fix mine, because that would be hypocrisy. Although even though pride might be my problem, I can still help others with other things. That's kind of what I meant.

[Guest P_W]

"I am seeing this theme reoccur in topics of late.  How should we deal hypocrisy, both within ourselves and when we see it in others?  How should we respond whilst maintaining our integrity?"

 

As for me, I fall down on my knees, humble myself, weep, repent, receive the forgiveness, get back up again until the next time I fall down.  So far, the cycle continues.  I do my best to be as much like Jesus as I can.  People will tell me often that I am doing a good job, but they do not see me at home, nor do they know my private thoughts, which I usually do not share.  I'm so grateful for the Scriptures which tell us how to live.  I know the battle ground is first in the mind.  Daily I apply the armor of God, but by the afternoon it seems I have found a way to forget.  I am content to know that I am not what I once was, but still not all that I will be and that God will not abandon the good work He started in me.  Amen and Praise God!

 

I love the way Kwik states things and I know that through Christ alone I have victory.  It is not about what I am or what I do, it is all about Him.  I am His righteousness and His integrity.  I have been hypocritical, and I'm sure others may judge me as such, but I know we all walk our own walk and I trust that we all do the absolute best we can.  I do not take the work done on the Cross lightly, and I thank God each day for the precious Blood of Jesus, His mercy and grace, "That saved a wretch like me."

 

When others do judge me, especially those without the Lord, I am pleased to tell them that Jesus saved me, and if He can save me, then surely He can save you, too!  Yes, there is hope for the world!  Just look at what the Lord has done for me!  PTL

 

I love you all and thank you for your encouragement.  I leave you with the words to a song my mother played and on the piano and sang to us.  I continue to keep you all in my prayers.  God bless you much!

 

Always in His care, 

PrairWarur

 

It Is No Secret What God Can Do

 

The chimes of time ring out the news, another day is through

 

Someone slipped and fell, was that someone you?

You may have longed for added strength your courage to renew

Do not be disheartened, I have news for you

 

(chorus )

 

It is no secret, what God can do

What He's done for others, He'll do for you

With arms wide open, He'll pardon you

It is no secret, what God can do

 

 

There is no night for in His light, you'll never walk alone

You'll always feel at home, wherever you may roam

There is no power can conquer you while God is on your side
 

Take him at his promise, do not run and hide

 

(chorus)

 

It is no secret, what God can do
 

What He's done for others, He'll do for you
 

With arms wide open, He'll pardon you
 

It is no secret, what God can do

 

 

[Guest AFlameOfFire]

@ FlameOfFire. That's a good example and I agree with you. I used the example of a broken arm as a metaphor. Let's say I had a problem with pride and knew about it (which I do uhm), I'm not going to try to help someone else with their pride before I'm able to fix mine, because that would be hypocrisy. Although even though pride might be my problem, I can still help others with other things. That's kind of what I meant.

I wasn't disagreeing with you either Hall, I should have said that too. I hear what your saying, because there are various temptations (each one knows where his might be). And it speaks of restoring another in a Spirit of gentleness lest we be tempted is spoken of. Almost as if the temptation (ye who are spiritual) have is the opportunity to exalt yourself over the other (verses being restorative).

And your right, because since there are various temptations (as each man knows his own) pride seems one that is more hid from a man.

I agree, where you are stronger you can help where another might be weaker, and the weaker (in one thing) could help someone else where they might be stronger. Thus praying for one another that we'd each be healed and made whole in our areas of weakness. That the proud would learn from the meek (even as the Lord said, learn of me I am meek) and likewise instructing others in the meekness of Christ.

Thus being ensamples to the flock in the Spirit of Christ (the fruit of whom) is meekness

And I am also drawn to others according to their various strengths as well, and because I receive a benefit through the same as such things are dispersed through the body for the benefit withal (not self alone).

I watch people and how they speak, and communicate and some will teach me more by their way of communicating (in being an example) then others (in their extensive teaching) if you catch my drift.

I am appreciating that more now because I have always been very much drawn to knowledge (in a kind of addicting sense of being so to it). However, since knowledge tends to puff up I have often found its rarely accompanied by charity and is often bathed in this air of pride (or arrogance). So to the same (and for only that much) have I been drawn to such. And in the larger sense according to knowledge alone, which will (as experience has taught me again and again) will often kick me to the curb soon enough. Its always been just a matter of time (but I can almost count on it) and sort of do lol But I have learned to be accepting of this. Because I do appreciate "the good book" knowledge (in one) who might be strong in that (even though sometimes you want to smack em' atop the head). Now I know better then want to mimic their way (in speaking down to the other) which you really need to remind yourself of if you company often with the same, and mostly because there isn't that fervently loving one another exchanging going on in that either). And in all honesty I have learned (even as I would far rather learn my way) which needs correcting through another who has far less knowledge but has humility and charity. Because the former without that latter is still nothing. But I can divide between two folks that way. Reccognizing their strengths, even knowledge I would guess (accompanied by their weakness which might be pride).

My strength is not being so much bothered by that way in the same. I can take a lot of abuse in that particular area for a very long time before it will start to grate on me though. Whereas I have found that is often not something others will give much time to. That "tude" is cut off (and rather quickly) because its own intolerance is hard to take (or so it seems).

And I try to key into wherever folks strengths are and excuse that other part myself, but heres the thing (even in that very thing), I am also imperfect in what I can tolerate or overlook. Something that might drive others insane don't drive me so insane and visa versa I would think.

One thing I need also is to condescend to men of much lower estate though, this I know, and I am now ripe to, thanks to some experiences which keep ending up as train wrecks after investing so much time and coming out with nothing more for it.

And only because I seem to be drawn to folks who can put out an air of I am more spiritual then you for some reason. Which I believe I tolerate well for knowledge sake. And I can find them somewhat amusing the same. But its probably the harshness that will get me at some point if I cant agree with something (and must say so much) because typically they cannot be disagreed with cordially.

But yeah, I know the feeling but sometimes I just want break their arm (lol)

(Okay, just kidding!)

...Well, no, not really

I like what Kwik says too,

"If the shoe fits..."

...then

"smack em' wit it"

(or something to that effect)

LOL (I'm just kidding wit chu Kwik)

We all got faults though, me too, as PrairWarur says about God knowing our hearts, because I'd be in trouble if God is counting how many times I rolled my eyes (inwardly) at things. Or how many times I posted what I needed to majorly edit first (and simply because the first time wouldn't have been acceptable)LOL

Do you know how many times, I have typed (editing out the ying yang to be able to post it) and took a couple hours on a post, and just couldnt post it, although I liked it so I saved it. I have all of them in a file I would like to call, "Just couldn't do it" lol. I got my own stuff here.

[Hall7]

Amen Flame of Fire... Just couldn't do it files?  You're too much...

[missmuffet]

 

I am seeing this theme reoccur in topics of late.  How should we deal hypocrisy, both within ourselves and when we see it in others?  How should we respond whilst maintaining our integrity?

 

 

Because of the "plank in the eye" passage, I tend to ignore it, or try to. 

 

When we point out hypocrisy, we're making a judgment of an individuals character. Passing judgment is a serious matter, because whenever we judge someone we are basically judging ourselves. The emotions and motives we use to make those judgments toward another individual are the same ones used in the judgment toward ourselves. Because we are either justified or condemned by our words, I try not to point out another individuals hypocrisy. God's keeping track. He doesn't need me down here pointing fingers.

 

What we say in these forums should not be taken lightly because there are spiritual consequences to our words and actions. When we react to what we see on a computer screen, it's the same as if we were interacting face to face in the real world. There are real people attached to these screen names and God knows who each and every one of them are. We may be able to hide from our neighbor but we can't hide from God. 

 

Our witness carries over from one thread to the next, from one forum to the other. We shouldn't say one thing in one forum and say the exact opposite in the next. Our behavior and attitude should be uniform regardless of our location within these forums.

 

Hypocrisy is a serious issue. It can destroy an individuals witness and be a stumbling block for others. 

 

 

Amen to that.Well said 

[Hall7]

Yup well said Man.