"Heaven is for Real"

[other one]

 

bopeep, you did ask if anyone had seen it, so it's reasonable for people to assume that you wanted to know their opinion on it. i am not a believer in NDE either. but i read the book, and i thought it was great. the father of the boy was a preacher... who ALSO did not believe in NDE. but the kid was able to talk about things that he couldn't have just learned without some sort of revelation. things he couldn't have made up with his own imagination.

 

in the bible, God gave people visions of heaven, and things that are not of this world. God is the same God He always was, and i have no reason to doubt that He is still capable of providing visions to whomever He sees fit to give them to. the world calls what this little boy had a near death experience. but that's just a label that got stuck on something that really defied any other label. i was skeptical when i was first given the book, and remained skeptical for about half or more of it, until it occurred to me that this probably was not an nde at all, and that the kid was simply someone who was used by God for His purposes.

 

and let's face it, kids are much more open to things like this. by the time kids reach adulthood, they learn to shut out anything that doesn't have a natural explanation. children trust more, and have an innocence and faith that is more difficult for adults. so it makes perfect sense that God would use a child. 

 

now you probably think i'm a total nutcase. but that's ok. i'm a nut who loves Jesus and who is learning that He doesn't always fit neatly into the little box my mind used to put Him in. but like i said about noah... this movie is coming out, and it will get believers and unbelievers talking. if you are going to discuss the topic with anyone who has seen it, please either watch it or read it. this one, even more so than 'noah', is far too easy to pigeonhole and dismiss because of a label.

 

and if you don't want to see or read it, that's fine too... but i would encourage you to not discuss the merits (or lack of) of the story with someone who has. know what i mean? point them to the bible or encourage them to seek God through prayer to find their answers, but don't insist that anything they got from the story is not of God. God's wisdom is so far beyond our understanding, and He confounds us on a regular basis, right? it's definitely a much better idea, always, to steer people towards seeking God for themselves rather than trying to speak for Him.

 

The boy got his information from Satan maybe - have you thought of that? Satan can give revelations too. He would have known about the kid's great-grandfather and the married sister. Do you know that demons pretend to be the dead? This boy apparently met his dead miscarried sister. He also explained how really big God and his chair is. Even Moses was not allowed to see all of God but only his back.

 

 

 

Rev 4:1-8

4:1 After these things I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven, and the first voice which I had heard, like the sound of a trumpet speaking with me, said, "Come up here, and I will show you what must take place after these things." 2 Immediately I was in the Spirit; and behold, a throne was standing in heaven, and One sitting on the throne. 3 And He who was sitting was like a jasper stone and a sardius in appearance; and there was a rainbow around the throne, like an emerald in appearance. 4 And around the throne were twenty-four thrones; and upon the thrones I saw twenty-four elders sitting, clothed in white garments, and golden crowns on their heads. 5 And from the throne proceed flashes of lightning and sounds and peals of thunder. And there were seven lamps of fire burning before the throne, which are the seven Spirits of God; 6 and before the throne there was, as it were, a sea of glass like crystal; and in the center and around the throne, four living creatures full of eyes in front and behind. 7 And the first creature was like a lion, and the second creature like a calf, and the third creature had a face like that of a man, and the fourth creature was like a flying eagle. 8 And the four living creatures, each one of them having six wings, are full of eyes around and within; and day and night they do not cease to say,

NASB

 

[Guest LadyC]

thank you other one

 

also, i want to point out... i don't recall (although it may have been in the book) the boy saying how big God Himself was, although to a four year old, surely the throne would look huge. as would God Himself. i'd have to go back and look, but i don't recall a single description of God's appearance outside of bright.  like i said, the movie was highly hollywoodized, so it's not going to be as accurate a retelling as the book was.

 

what i do recall very well was that the boy (in the book) described what Jesus looked like. and it wasn't the hollywood version of his appearance.

[OakWood]

oak, with all due respect, i've read the book. i'm well aware of what satan can do. are you aware also of what God can do? surely you know that satan is the great imitator... and that he imitates what God can and has done. 

 

do you deny that God has revealed Heaven to people through visions? if you do not deny that, then it is presumptuous for you to assume that this boy's revelation MUST be from satan and can NOT be from God. it's also presumptuous for you to assume that i am just some clueless and gullible person that falls prey to every scheme satan uses.

 

was this a vision from God this kid had? it could very well have been. is it also possible it was from satan? yes, it could very well have been. but God has always graced me with a pretty good discernment, and after having read the book, i can say that i did not feel any catches in my spirit... although i certainly went in expecting to feel those checks and balances.

 

you can't say that, because you haven't read it. so while you are qualified to debate and discuss the subject of whether or not God ever has and ever does still give people glimpses of heaven through visions, you really are not qualified to comment on the content of the book.

 

for the record, i looked up some christian reviews earlier.... and found that the movie version was far inferior to the book, highly hollywoodized, and left out a great deal of what the book described. this really doesn't come as a surprise. but for those who might be interested in the story, i'd say skip the theatrical version and read the paperback.

 

You're right, I haven't read the book, but I'm not criticising the book, I'm criticising the movie which I haven't seen either. Have you seen the movie? I read the review and I don't like it. I won't be going to see it. He met his dead sister. There's a thread here on Worthy about whether the dead are sleeping or whether they are in heaven already. I can't remember what the conclusion was, but do you believe that the dead are 'alive' and capable of communicating?

[Guest LadyC]

i believe what we are told in scripture... that we are forbidden from reaching out to talk  with the dead. (see deuteronomy.) that, to me, leaves no doubt that it is possible to do so. after all, king solomon spoke to the spirit of samuel. scripture does not say, or even give any reason to suppose, that the ghost of samuel was actually a demon in disguise. my saying that is probably as unsettling to you as the review of the movie you read was, am i right?

 

this kid though, was not going around seeking to talk to any dead person. he had a vision, and part of that vision was people whom he didn't even know existed prior to the vision. and in that vision, these people indicated to him that they were his grandfather and his sister.

 

i've already stated i have not seen the movie. i read the book. i made that clear so i'm not sure why you're asking it again. the movie is not going to be true to the written account of what the kid says he saw in  that vision. that's why i've encouraged people who are even thinking about seeing the movie to read the book instead. and if you are not interested in either version of the account, that's fine too... but to dogmatically criticize it based on what someone else says does not make for a credible argument. and to criticize someone who has seen it as believing some heretical teaching, which is what you are implying, also lacks credibility.

[OakWood]

i believe what we are told in scripture... that we are forbidden from reaching out to talk  with the dead. (see deuteronomy.) that, to me, leaves no doubt that it is possible to do so. after all, king solomon spoke to the spirit of samuel. scripture does not say, or even give any reason to suppose, that the ghost of samuel was actually a demon in disguise. my saying that is probably as unsettling to you as the review of the movie you read was, am i right?

 

this kid though, was not going around seeking to talk to any dead person. he had a vision, and part of that vision was people whom he didn't even know existed prior to the vision. and in that vision, these people indicated to him that they were his grandfather and his sister.

 

i've already stated i have not seen the movie. i read the book. i made that clear so i'm not sure why you're asking it again. the movie is not going to be true to the written account of what the kid says he saw in  that vision. that's why i've encouraged people who are even thinking about seeing the movie to read the book instead.

 

Okay, I'm sorry - you may be right.

But before I was saved, I was a believer in NDEs and some of them that I read about were extremely convincing but others led me down the wrong path. I have vowed never to have anything else to with them. I stay away from them and any stories involved with them. Maybe the boy's revelation was genuinely from God - who knows? If people want to read the book or see the movie that is up to them. Maybe the movie may convince others to believe in God, so it might be no bad thing.

 

However for me personally there are two issues:

 

1/ I'm suspicious of anything that Hollywood does

 

2/ I stay away from NDEs and anything to do with them.

[Guest LadyC]

LOL, i put about as much stock in what hollywood does as i do in what the government says. so we're on the same page with that one!

 

and i certainly understand your second point. i don't usually read, watch or listen to any NDE's, but the book was given to me by my sis-in-law, and one day when i was bored, i decided to see what it was about. i finished it with a completely different perspective than i picked it up with. still, i'm not a believer in NEDs in general. this is actually the only one that ever even seemed plausible or had a ring of integrity to it (to me).

 

but we all must stand by our convictions, and it sounds like your past is a very good reason why God has convicted you to avoid anything to do with stories of such things. just remember that when God convicts us of things that are not specifically mentioned in scripture, the conviction is intended for us alone, and we have to be careful about becoming judgmental or critical of those whom God has not given the same conviction to.

[OakWood]

LOL, i put about as much stock in what hollywood does as i do in what the government says. so we're on the same page with that one!

 

and i certainly understand your second point. i don't usually read, watch or listen to any NDE's, but the book was given to me by my sis-in-law, and one day when i was bored, i decided to see what it was about. i finished it with a completely different perspective than i picked it up with. still, i'm not a believer in NEDs in general. this is actually the only one that ever even seemed plausible or had a ring of integrity to it (to me).

 

but we all must stand by our convictions, and it sounds like your past is a very good reason why God has convicted you to avoid anything to do with stories of such things. just remember that when God convicts us of things that are not specifically mentioned in scripture, the conviction is intended for us alone, and we have to be careful about becoming judgmental or critical of those whom God has not given the same conviction to.

 

I can agree with you there. I frequently study Islamic scriptures (even though they are evil) but I advise other Christians to stay away from them because they may corrupt others. If you want to know why I take a great fascination with Islam (even though it disgusts me) then check out my testimony and you will see why.

 

 

For me, NDEs are something to stay away from, but when it comes to Islam (which is more evil) I feel that God protects me from it.

[Guest LadyC]

i understand, and i think i'd like to read your testimony... although i'm about to close down the computer today. i hope you'll consider linking to it in your signature line so that i can find it easily later.

 

and i totally get why you would study islam. it's kinda like what i keep harping on... until you know firsthand what something says, you can't argue against it with any credibility. i'm glad that God has put it on your heart to study it, and that He is keeping a hedge of protection around you from it. me, i have no interest in studying it. i have a hard enough time keeping the self discipline to study God's word... although i do. and totally off the subject (well, kinda off the subject), in the five years since i quit smoking, i've started reading through the bible on every anniversary. the first three times i did it in 90 days (give or take a day or two). strangely enough, i found that much easier than going through it more slowly, like this last year. in fact, if i don't push myself a little harder, i'll miss my july 21 start date because i won't be finished! i'm close though... i'm about to start on the NT. i also think i got more out of it when i read through in 90 days. especially the third time, because i blogged my way through it. i am not kidding when i say that it took about 8 hours of each day, between reading, digging deeper and researching, then writing about something that had stood out to me, and then proofing it. by the time i was finished, my husband and mother were so relieved!

[missmuffet]

Satan is always ready to cause deception and twist thinking 2 Corinthians 11:14-15 And no wonder! For Satan himself transforms himself into an angel of light. ¹⁵ Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also transform themselves into ministers of righteousness, whose end will be according to their works.

This a serious concern on my part.

[Guest LadyC]

nothing wrong with having concerns. just remember that for satan to be able to transform himself into an angel of light, there has to be an angel of light for him to know what to transform himself into. anything that satan can do, God can do, and does, and does better. test the spirits, don't just assume you know what the spirit is.