Some Questions

[Littlelambseativy]

Baptism is a ritual so either.

Sometimes men should be quiet in the congregation not only women....depends what you mean by congregation.

We do not wash each other's feet anymore.

The Father answers our prayers if asked through Jesus name .....for healing and all our needs....it is all through Jesus and the will of God the Father.

[Anita]

Thanks so much for your replies, brothers. *Blessings* I will soon update this post with what I think about the questions.

[Floatingaxe]

Hello to you all.

 

The following are some of the questions I have to answer in my next Bible Study class.

 

I want to know what you think.

 

1. BAPTISM, by sprinkling or by immersion?

 

2. Do women have to keep quiet in the congregation?

 

3. Do we have to wash each other's feet?

 

4. The ministry of physical healing, only with OIL?

 

 

1. "Baptizo" means IMMERSE...so we need to be baptizing the way they did originally---fully immersed in water. Sprinkling is a contortion.

 

2. Both men and women are to be quiet members of the congregation when in meeting. That is good "church etiquette", which is what Paul was teaching.

 

3. Physical demonstrations of servanthood one to another is what we ought to be doing. In Jesus' day, foot-washing was a daily tradition, as the roads in the middle east were dusty, and as footwear was mostly open, like sandals.

 

4. Jesus heals through faith. Laying hands on the sick, anointing with oil are powerful adjuncts, but are not what is necessary for healing power to be poured out on the sick. We have been given Jesus' authority to heal.

[Anita]

Amen. Thanks

[Willa]

1. I have been in churches that practiced both. My mom pointed out that immersion is accepted by all churches. It is also more meaningful as illustrated in Scripture, since it testifies to the death and buriel of the old sinful man and the resurrection of the new man, as we identify with Christ's death buriel and resurrection.

Some people cannot physically be immersed due to health problems, and in such cases I am sure that God understands. As said, it is not even critical to salvation but is an act of obedience and a testimony after we are saved. The act of obedience that God required of me was to make restitution.

2. Women may sing, pray, prophecy, and otherwise speak when under the authority of her husband and the pastor, and when under the inspiriation of the Holy Spirit. We are not supposed to teach or have authority over men as a head pastor according to Scripture. There may be exceptions when there is no man to do the job, as with Deborah the judge, but it is not the norm.

3. I have participated in a foot washing ceremony in a small group setting of a woman's prayer group. It was an act of love and was very meaningful. Feet don't bother me, since I was a nurse many years ago. Cool water can feel very good on a hot day as does soaking them in warm water on a cold day, especially when they ache. The point is to make it a blessing and a time of refreshment for the people you care for.

4. God heals, period. We can have all faith as to move mountains but without love we are nothing. The power behind it all is God's love. When pastors use oil in obedience to scripture, it is God's word that gives grace. No one has earned or is worthy of healing. He heals because He has compassion on us. He does honor His Word. But God wants us to depend on Him, not a method.

[Guest shiloh357]

Baptism is not a ritual.  Baptism is one of two ordinances that Jesus gave to the Church.   He specifically mentions baptism and sprinkling is NOT baptism.  Baptism in Scripture is always by immersion.

 

Women keeping silent in the church is an issue that was not given to all churches, but to a specific congregation.   We tend to forget that the epistles of Paul were personal letters written to either specific congregations or persons and were meant to address some issues that were germane to that congregation were not meant to be made into doctrine.  Not everything in Paul's letters are meant to be understood as universally applicable to all believers.  

 

Foot washing is not commanded in the Bible.  Jesus used foot washing as an object lesson and should not be taken to be a ordinance like baptism.

 

Healing comes from the Lord.  The idea of healing with oil comes from James 5.  James may be referring to a medicinal oil from the hyssop plant.  It was used in various strengths and had anti-septic properties.   The "anointing with oil"   isn't dabbing oil on someone's head.   Rather, it refers to the rubbing of oil onto a person, in this case rubbing on to a person who is ill.   This was usually done in concert with a medicinal wine also mentioned in Scripture.  When Paul Timothy to use a little wine for his stomach, he was referring to a concentrated bitter wine that used to cure internal ailments, to kill bacteria and so on.   All of this is to be done in conjunction with prayer.

[gdemoss]

I was baptized into the body by the Spirit.

Mom's the word.

How beautiful are their feet!

The water washes while oil anoints and good to have cookies with milk...

[Ezra]

Women keeping silent in the church is an issue that was not given to all churches, but to a specific congregation.   We tend to forget that the epistles of Paul were personal letters written to either specific congregations or persons and were meant to address some issues that were germane to that congregation were not meant to be made into doctrine.  Not everything in Paul's letters are meant to be understood as universally applicable to all believers.  

 

That is an extremely dangerous approach to Scripture.  If we take this approach to Scripture, then individuals and churches can simply pick and choose what they will believe or disregard (as is happening throughout Christendom). 

 

The fact that Paul uses "the Law" (the entire OT) as the authority for (1) women to be silent in public worship, (2) to be forbidden from preaching, teaching, and usurping authority within the churches, and (3) to wear head coverings during public worship, in different portions  of the New Testament is sufficient to establish that everything that is taught in the NT is for ALL CHURCHES FOR ALL TIME until the Rapture.

 

1 Corinthians 14:34,35 -- PAUL SAYS "THE CHURCHES" (UNIVERSAL) NOT "YOUR CHURCH" (LOCAL)

³⁴ Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law.

³⁵ And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

 

1 Timothy 2:9-15 -- WOMEN FORBIDDEN TO PREACH, TEACH, OR ASSUME AUTHORITY

⁹ In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;

¹⁰ But (which becometh women professing godliness) with good works.

¹¹ Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.

¹² But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

¹³ For Adam was first formed, then Eve.

¹⁴ And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

¹⁵ Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety.

 

1 Corinthians 11:3-16 WOMENS' HEAD COVERING IN ALL THE CHURCHES OF GOD

³ But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God.

⁴ Every man praying or prophesying, having his head covered, dishonoureth his head.

⁵ But every woman that prayeth or prophesieth with her head uncovered dishonoureth her head: for that is even all one as if she were shaven.

⁶ For if the woman be not covered, let her also be shorn: but if it be a shame for a woman to be shorn or shaven, let her be covered.

⁷ For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man.

⁸ For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man.

⁹ Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man.

¹⁰ For this cause ought the woman to have power on her head because of the angels.

¹¹ Nevertheless neither is the man without the woman, neither the woman without the man, in the Lord.

¹² For as the woman is of the man, even so is the man also by the woman; but all things of God.

¹³ Judge in yourselves: is it comely that a woman pray unto God uncovered?

¹⁴ Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?

¹⁵ But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering.

¹⁶ But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

[Guest shiloh357]

I disagree in that there are things Paul says about how men should wear their hair in I Corinthians that is not meant to be for all people for all time.  It was meant to address a problem in that church given that men were being saved out of male prostitution and were accustomed to wearing their hair long and effeminate and so Paul is addressing that issue. 

 

It is easy to see where in a given epistle the exhortation is doctrinal and where it is not.   We run into a huge set of problems when we start taking what was good for that congregation and make it the rule for everyone. 

 

We have the benefit of reading an entire, completed canon and so naturally we personalize everything as if it is was written to us and that is not always a wise approach  All of Scripture is relevant for doctrine, but not all of it is applicable.

[Qnts2]

Hello to you all.

 

The following are some of the questions I have to answer in my next Bible Study class.

 

I want to know what you think.

 

1. BAPTISM, by sprinkling or by immersion?

 

 

Everyone has given very good answers.

 

I just wanted to add to Baptism based on some history that I have read.

 

Christianity was illegal in the Roman empire until the 300's. Some knew about Christians performing Baptism by immersion for new believers so those who were against Christianity would watch the rivers which Christians used for Baptisms to see who the new believers were and report them to Rome. The practice of immersion was a risk to new believers so they moved into peoples homes and used sprinkling for a time to protect the new believers from spys and the Roman government.

 

So, Baptism was by immersion but sprinkling was accepted, even in the early church, as the life of the new believers was considered more important then the method of Baptism.