JohnD Posted July 13, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 0 Topic Count: 909 Topics Per Day: 0.19 Content Count: 9,660 Content Per Day: 2.02 Reputation: 5,839 Days Won: 9 Joined: 04/07/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted July 13, 2015 Some propose that Melchizedek was actually a pre-incarnate appearance of Jesus Christ, or a Christophany. This is a possible theory, given that Abraham had received such a visit before. Consider Genesis 17 where Abraham saw and spoke with the Lord (El Shaddai) in the form of a man. I believe this is the true understanding of Melchizedek -- King of Salem (King of Peace) and King of Righteousness (Heb 7:1-3): 1 For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him; 2 To whom also Abraham gave a tenth part of all; first being by interpretation King of righteousness, and after that also King of Salem, which is, King of peace; 3 Without father, without mother, without descent, having neither beginning of days, nor end of life; but made like unto the Son of God; abideth a priest continually. 4 Now consider how great this man was, unto whom even the patriarch Abraham gave the tenth of the spoils. Only the Son of God Himself has "neither beginning of days, nor end of life", therefore He "abideth a priest continually" -- our Great High Priest in Heaven. The coup de gras Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted July 13, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,900 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,781 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted July 13, 2015 I am wondering about something, and this may not be they way to put it, and I am not been cynical. And you know that already, you know the birth of the hight priest from the tribe of Juda, you know how the spirit sent thre men from afar and how they follow the light and how it was witnes to them, who is that star when it rested on Jesus and they gave him the gold and the spices, symbols of the sign that he is the priest from the tribe of Juda, the gold to make the golden insence holder and the spices to burn. That's what the high priest do before they enter in the most holy place. We all know his birth, why would you say, you don't know, this not good people may question your soundness , your credibility, I dont mean the Christians that too, but the enemies of the Gospel. Remember that Zaharias was without a son, a son was not given to him to continuing in the pristhood, instand the pristhood was given to a another son out of the Aaron's family. Even when Jonh the Baptis later been the heir of the priesthood said not me he is greater than me, he pointed to Jesus been the Christ. You know Jonh never served in the temple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnD Posted July 13, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 0 Topic Count: 909 Topics Per Day: 0.19 Content Count: 9,660 Content Per Day: 2.02 Reputation: 5,839 Days Won: 9 Joined: 04/07/2011 Status: Offline Share Posted July 13, 2015 The wise men came to honor the King of the Jews not the High Priest. Jesus is the High Priest of the faith and King and Prophet. Only his messianic office was to be all three. This is why King Saul was eliminated. The last straw with God was being a prophet and king he crossed the lines over into the priesthood when he offered an official sacrifice because he feared his troops were abandoning him and Samuel the priest was tardy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted July 13, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,900 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,781 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted July 13, 2015 If you ask anyone of the men who were with Melhisedec who is his father or mother, I am quiet sure that they will tell you, or if you ask Melhisedec he will tell you, all those people with him and the goods departed from Abraham and the others, no miraculous signs were perform, so Anraham will fall down to them, what happen to all the goods? Never in the past an angel took goods and left, and I am sure that Abraham if he wanted to go and visit Melhisedec at his Kingtom he could do it. To Make fictitious stories like that don't help the Gospel and we know who Jesus is when he was born and we knowvhis mother i hope so and we know his father who is in hesven the heavenly father , by his own testimony, also know who he was before he comes in the flesh, EMMANUEL , and we know that is the first of all creation. And that he came from the father, and we know what he did before he empty himself from all his glory and knowledge ... Been found as in conception void from everything from the past he brought nothing with him, no cheating there he started from scratch. He was inform who he was. Conception an embryo...think about that, listen to Paul. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted July 13, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,900 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,781 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted July 13, 2015 That's what I just said the magi met the king , from Juda and they brought to him gold to make the golden sensor and the spices to burn, that is a good picture of the king who would be the high priest the Christ. Couple with the sign of the of the Aaronic priesthood by not giving him a son. Later he got a son who declare his is greater than me meaning also a greater priest, thank you for interacting, You have guts, Jesus needs people like you in the front line, I am only suggesting, allow the spirit to work in you, don't come to Jesus with a frame mind from the information you get from some sources, go to him with a empty mind do to speak Thank you for interacting, I am always here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthitjah Posted July 13, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 1,285 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 17,917 Content Per Day: 2.27 Reputation: 355 Days Won: 19 Joined: 10/01/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted July 13, 2015 Grace to you, I don't wish to side track and start an agreement but saying Paul said that in Hebrews , many will see it not that you are just taking sides, but you are trying to use Paul's gredibility, Jesus beginning we know and Jesus knows Melhisedec beginning and that is when he was born, I mean Melhisedec selebrated his birth days. I understand that is a good figure of the future high pried who is not going to be the seed of Aaron and has to be a King , Is the most fascinated picture, David is not born yet , we don't have Aaron yet, maybe not Isaac yet. And we have the picture of Jesus Christ ,the blood of the new covenant, and the bread of life. That is given not only to Abraham but to everyone It's amazing, I like that you say may also has something to do with Abraham, it must the hole episode is very prophetic please I will.be glad to here your input, you are a man without fiction in this amazing historical event Timothy That is exactly what I am trying to do. Use Paul's Credibility! Paul has Apostolic Authority and the Word is given line upon line and precept upon precept. Peace, Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthitjah Posted July 13, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 1,285 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 17,917 Content Per Day: 2.27 Reputation: 355 Days Won: 19 Joined: 10/01/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted July 13, 2015 Omegaman, Dave, perhaps you should not state things that make is sound as though we know the author of Hebrews was Paul, just a suggestion. I know there are many who disagree on things like did Moses write the Pentateuch, did Peter writ the Petrine letters etc, but the book of Hebrews does not claim to be authored by Paul, as I am sure you know, nor does the majority of scholarship claim it is Pauline. Doubts about it's authorship go back a log way in church History. That being said, the book is a masterpiece, and deserves it's place in the Bible, regardless of who wrote it, it is scripture and carries scriptural authority and sound teaching in harmony with the rest of scripture. Origen stated that only God knew who was the author. However, most scholars agree that it is heavily influenced, if not written by Paul, by his thought and influence. Whether it was Barnabas , Luke, or Apollos doesn't matter. It has the mark of Paul all over it and it carries Apostolic Authority. Peace, Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliamL Posted July 14, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 10 Topic Count: 99 Topics Per Day: 0.03 Content Count: 5,159 Content Per Day: 1.48 Reputation: 2,568 Days Won: 4 Joined: 11/06/2014 Status: Offline Birthday: 09/01/1950 Share Posted July 14, 2015 In Joshua 10:13 and II Samuel 1:18 the Bible refers to the Book of Jasher. In the Book of Jasher Melchizedek is referred to as Adonizedek who is called Shem in Jasher 16:11, who is the son of Noah. Many believe this can't be the case because of Hebrews 7:3 but if one looks at the Complete Jewish Bible one can see Melchizedek as Shem: There is no record of his father, mother, ancestry, birth or death; rather, like the Son of God he continues as a cohen for all times. Hebrews 7:3 The Complete Jewish Bible So you don't want to make this into a doctrine but I believe that Melchizedek was Shem, but other like Ezra made be correct I supposed we may never know this side of heaven but it will be an interesting to ask when we see Jesus. Yes, Melchizedek was Shem, according to the Boof of Jasher, Seder Olam, and other ancient Jewish sources. Shem moved to "the land of Moriah" with Eber (from whom the name Hebrew derives), after living with his father Noah in Mesopotamia before Noah's death at 950. Abraham came to live with and be taught by them for about 38 years. Jasher 26:5 And Rebecca said unto [isaac], But arise now thou also and pray, that the Lord may hear thy prayer and grant me children, and Isaac hearkened to the words of his wife, and Isaac and his wife rose up and went to the land of Moriah to pray there and to seek the Lord, and when they had reached that place Isaac stood up and prayed to the Lord on account of his wife because she was barren. ... 8 And the Lord heard the prayer of Isaac the son of Abraham, and the Lord was entreated of him and Rebecca his wife conceived. 9 And in about seven months after the children struggled together within her, and it pained her greatly that she was wearied on account of them, and she said to all the women who were then in the land, Did such a thing happen to you as it has to me? and they said unto her, No. 10 And she said unto them, Why am I alone in this amongst all the women that were upon earth? and she went to the land of Moriah to seek the Lord on account of this; and she went to Shem and Eber his son to make inquiries of them in this matter, and that they should seek the Lord in this thing respecting her. 28:18 ...Isaac sent his younger son Jacob to the house of Shem and Eber, and he learned the instructions of the Lord, and Jacob remained in the house of Shem and Eber for thirty-two years, and Esau his brother did not go, for he was not willing to go, and he remained in his father's house in the land of Canaan. The land of Moriah is, of course, where Salem/Jerusalem was/is; the Temple Mount is also called Mount Moriah, and believed to be the site where Abraham's near-sacrifice of Isaac took place. Re: the phrase in Hebrews "without geneology, without beginning of days or end of life," Paul is pointing out that this great Biblical figure was not provided by Moses with the same type of birth and death records that other great men of Genesis were, which allows him to appear like (resemble) the Son of God. However, Psalm 110 only says that it is the Messiah that shall be a priest forever, not Melchizedek. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted July 14, 2015 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 599 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,268 Content Per Day: 7.55 Reputation: 28,001 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted July 14, 2015 Shem lived about 35 years longer than did Abraham.... Jacob was in his 40's when Shem died. You won't find many here that will take any information on matters such as this, out of anything but the Canon Bible...... Jasher, Jubilees, Enoch are usually frowned upon here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Your closest friendnt Posted July 14, 2015 Group: Royal Member Followers: 18 Topic Count: 7 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 7,900 Content Per Day: 2.42 Reputation: 2,781 Days Won: 3 Joined: 06/05/2015 Status: Offline Share Posted July 14, 2015 (edited) The wise men came to honor the King of the Jews not the High Priest. Jesus is the High Priest of the faith and King and Prophet. Only his messianic office was to be all three. This is why King Saul was eliminated. The last straw with God was being a prophet and king he crossed the lines over into the priesthood when he offered an official sacrifice because he feared his troops were abandoning him and Samuel the priest was tardy. You have misread me, I said the same thing, that the wise men came to honor the promised King of the Jews, but look at the gifts they bring, was it , because they had understood that the promised King will also inherit the priesthood, which was not a secret but well understood by many, and they gold for a golden sensor and spices that burn in the golden sensor by the high priest when he enters the most holy place for the service upon the golden altar, was it a very digestive geusture guided divinely? That's what I just said, that Jesus is the promise King with everlasting kingdom , because he is everlasting , and the promise lamb, that will provide the blood of the new covenant, and the high priest not from the earthly line (Aaron's) but as the promise said a line just the line of , from the kings family of David will come the high priest with promice of the Chrisy, not from the Priest's family having the promice of the kingdom, that what I said, In the Saul's example in 1st Samuel 13:13 and Samuel said to Saul, thou has done foolishly: thou has not kept the commandment of the Lord thy God, which he commanded thee: for now would the Lord have establish thy kingdom upon Israel for EVER. 13:14 but now thy Kingdom shall not continue: Chapter 15:1 Samuel said undo Saul, the Lord sent me to anoint thee to be king over his people, over Israel. In chapter 15: in this chapter Saul did not kill all the animals of the Amalekites as per the Lords command, Saul acknowledge his sin, but he was not pardon when he asked to be pardon and in verse,26. And Samuel said unto the Saul, I wiil not return with thee: for thou has rejected the word of the Lord, and the Lord has rejected thee from been king over Israel. This is not a relevant example of the point you trying to make, this is just a change in kingdom family, and this is not sacrifieses offered in the temple, even Samuel is not a priest ( never offered sacrifises as a priest in the temple he does not have an efod he is from Efraim. He offered only burn and peace offerings, just like the prophet Balaam, Anraham , Isaac, Jacob, think of others. The example you need to make your point is fount in the book of II Chronicles, Chapter 26: it is about Uz-zia the King from the family of Juda who went in the temple im place only for the priest and he took a censer to burn incense at the altar of incense BEFORE the Lord, and the Lord smitten him with leprosy . This is what I am referring to, when I said the wise men brought gold for the censor and herbs , Cause Jesus is the one as a king from Juda to be accepted by God to offered incense before him. ve:16 to 20 when he enter Edited July 15, 2015 by Your closest friendnt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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