Was The fall of Lucifer/Satan;Before The Creation or After The Creatio

[Bible2]

OneLight said in post 3:

 

We know he was fought and he lost, with the result being he and 1/3 of the angelic host being expelled from Heaven, yet we are not told when.

 

Revelation 12:7-9 hasn't happened yet, but is part of the things which must be hereafter (Revelation 4:1b).

 

Just as what John saw in Revelation 4:2-11 are literal things in heaven, so what he saw in Revelation 12:7-9 is a literal, future, mid-tribulation war in heaven, between Michael and his angels on the one hand, and Satan and his angels on the other, resulting in Satan and his angels being defeated and cast down to the earth permanently (Revelation 12:8-9,12-13).

 

Revelation 12:7-9 shows that Michael and his angels are more powerful than Satan and his angels. But this doesn't mean that Satan won't be able to deceive the world (Revelation 12:9) into thinking that he and his angels (with the help of a united mankind) will be able to defeat YHWH and his army (Revelation 16:14, Revelation 19:19).

 

For before Revelation 12:7-9 happens, an army of 200 million weird horse-like beings and their (possibly unclean spirit) riders will come upon the earth (Revelation 9:16-19). If they descend from the sky in spaceships, the world could see them as aliens. But they and the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") could (falsely) say they are YHWH God's main army. In fact, they could be loyal to Lucifer (Satan, the dragon, Revelation 12:9). The 4 fallen angels now bound at the Euphrates who will lead this army (Revelation 9:14-16) could employ it to make mankind utterly desperate before its complete takeover by Lucifer and the Antichrist mid-tribulation (Revelation 12:9 to 13:18). For when this army starts killing 1/3 of mankind (Revelation 9:16-19), then could also begin one of the biggest deceptions ever wrought on humanity. For the Antichrist, who by that time could have managed to have been elected as the President of a Mediterranean Union formed by the joining of the European Union with an Arab Union stretching from Oman to Morocco, could announce to the world that he has sent a mental distress call to (what he could call) "My Father, our Lord Lucifer, to come with his legions of angels, and rescue mankind from this murderous army of YHWH".

 

It is at this point that Lucifer and his fallen angels could be cast down out of heaven to the earth permanently after losing a mid-tribulation war in heaven (Revelation 12:7-9). But instead of coming down as a defeated force, they could descend for all the world to see in gigantic, magnificent golden spaceships onto the "Champ de Mars", Mars being the same as Marduk the dragon, the chief god of ancient Babylon. The "Champ de Mars" is the large open area in front of the Eiffel Tower in Paris. After landing there, Lucifer, a literal 7-headed, red dragon (Revelation 12:3,9), could emerge in great splendor and command his angels to capture the army of 200 million weird horse-like beings and their (possibly unclean spirit) riders, who could then pretend to defect from serving YHWH to serving Lucifer. Lucifer could then confirm that he has come to rescue mankind because the Antichrist, who he could say is his only-begotten "Son", called upon him (like in an Antichrist counterfeit of Matthew 26:53). Lucifer and the Antichrist could then be received wholeheartedly by the unsaved world as the saviors of mankind. And the unsaved world could be left thinking (mistakenly) that Lucifer and his angels were more powerful than even YHWH God's main army.

 

Lucifer and the Antichrist, along with the Antichrist's miracle-working False Prophet, will then deceive the world into actually worshipping Lucifer and the Antichrist and a speaking (possibly an android) image of the Antichrist (Revelation 13:4-16, Revelation 19:20; 2 Thessalonians 2:4, Daniel 11:36). And everyone will be made to receive a (possibly scarification) mark of the Antichrist either on their right hand or forehead, consisting of either the Antichrist's name or some representation of the gematrial number of his name (666) (Revelation 13:16-18). After Lucifer and the Antichrist have ruled the world for 3.5 literal years (Revelation 13:4-18), YHWH will send 7 vials of wrath against the unsaved world (Revelation 16).

 

Near the end of these 7 vials, unclean spirits like frogs will come out of the mouths of Lucifer, the Antichrist, and the False Prophet (Revelation 16:13). And these unclean spirits like frogs will go forth and perform amazing miracles to convince the world's armies to gather together at Armageddon (Har Megiddo: Mount Megiddo in northern Israel) (Revelation 16:16) to battle against YHWH himself (Revelation 16:14, Revelation 19:19). After gathering together at Armageddon as a staging area, the world's armies will travel south and pillage Jerusalem, right before Jesus (who is YHWH: John 10:30) returns from heaven and defeats them completely (Revelation 19:11 to 20:6, Zechariah 14:2-21).

 

When Jesus returns, immediately after the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 (Revelation 19:7-21, Matthew 24:29-31), he will descend physically from heaven on a white horse (Revelation 19:7-21; 1 Thessalonians 4:16, Zechariah 14:3-4, Acts 1:11-12) with all the holy angels (Matthew 25:31; 2 Thessalonians 1:7) for all the world to see (Matthew 24:27,30, Revelation 1:7). Then the church will be physically resurrected (if dead) or changed (if alive) into immortality (1 Corinthians 15:21-23,51-53; 1 Thessalonians 4:16, Revelation 20:4-6) and caught up together/gathered together (raptured) (Matthew 24:31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1) as high as the clouds of the sky to hold a meeting in the air with Jesus (1 Thessalonians 4:17).

 

At that meeting, Jesus will judge the church (Psalms 50:3-5, cf. Mark 13:27; 2 Corinthians 5:10, Luke 12:45-48) and marry its obedient part (Revelation 19:7-8, Matthew 25:1-12) in the clouds, before it mounts white horses and comes back down from sky (the 1st heaven) with Jesus (Revelation 19:14) as he defeats the world's armies (Revelation 19:19,21), and the Antichrist and False Prophet (Revelation 19:20), and has Lucifer (Satan) bound in the bottomless pit for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:1-3).

 

Jesus will then make the marriage supper of Revelation 19:9 for the obedient part of the church in the earthly Jerusalem (Isaiah 25:6-9; 1 Corinthians 15:54), while the birds will feast on the corpses of the world's defeated armies (Revelation 19:17-18). Then Jesus and the obedient part of the church will rule the surviving nations with a rod of iron for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29, Psalms 2). After the 1,000 years, Lucifer will be released from the bottomless pit and bring about the Gog/Magog rebellion, only to be defeated for the last time (Revelation 20:7-10, Ezekiel chapters 38-39).

 

At least 7 years after that defeat (Ezekiel 39:9b), the great white throne judgment will occur, in which all those who hadn't been resurrected and judged at Jesus' return will be resurrected and judged (Revelation 20:11-15). Then God will create a new heaven (a new 1st heaven: a new sky/atmosphere for the earth) and a new earth (a new surface for the earth) (Revelation 21:1; 2 Peter 3:10b,13). Then God the Father will descend from the 3rd heaven in the literal city of New Jerusalem (Revelation 21:2), the Father's house (John 14:2, Revelation 21:3), and he will dwell on the earth with Jesus and the church (Revelation 21:3).

 

In one area outside the walls of New Jerusalem on the new earth will be the lake of fire (Revelation 22:15, Revelation 21:8), in which all of unsaved humanity will be punished forever in fire and brimstone with Lucifer and his fallen angels (Revelation 20:10,15, Matthew 25:41,46).

[Rev2015]

I believe we must understand the difference between the realms that exist. The eternal state is where GOD and the heavenly host exist. In this realm there is no time per say as we understand it, seconds, minutes, hours, days, weeks, months, years and so on. We are conditioned by this, being a attribute in the creation realm. GOD basically created time itself, and placed the creation realm into it. All of the physical attributes of the creation realm, stars, galaxies, all that can be seen with our largest and most powerful telescopes, are just components of a huge time piece, a clock if you will, called creation. This clock was set for a 7000 year period. GOD says in Genesis, that He created the moon and the stars to tell times and seasons. 

 

The eternal realm also isn’t bound by the laws set forth in the creation realm. You always hear people say well how old is GOD, when was He created. It is because of the conditioning of the time flow of the creation realm people ask this. They systematically place GOD under the rules He set forth for the creation realm. GOD is not bound by these rules, not restricted to the flow of time of the creation realm. He exist in all time at the same moment, the real meaning to The Alpha and the Omega. He also through the Holy Spirit can exist every and anywhere at the same moment. We can’t go back in time to the beginning of creation, GOD is there now. We also can’t instantly go forward to the end of the 1000 reign of Christ. GOD is also there in that time now. He exist in all time. He is at the beginning of time and the end of time at the same instant. He is the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow.....get it.

 

Satan is a eternal created being, not a creation based being as we are. You can’t apply a creation year to Satan and the other beings created in the eternal realm. They were not created in the creation realm. The realms are separated from each other by a barrier. We can’t cross that barrier unless we die and then our spirit is allowed to enter the eternal realm, saved only of course. I believe the barrier GOD put in place to separate the realms, has to do with particle acceleration. The best way to describe this is. All the molecular particles of the physical attributes of the eternal realm are traveling beyond the speed of light. All the molecular particles of the creation realm are traveling well below the speed of light. When GOD allows, beings in the eternal realm can control the speed of the particles of their molecular structure, slowing them down to well below the speed of light, they then appear to men. This happened all through the O.T. When they speed their molecules up beyond the speed of light they will become intangible and invisible once again as they phase back into the eternal realm.

 

It is in my opinion, Lucifer existed un-fallen in the eternal realm when GOD created time and placed the creation realm into it. What made Satan rebel was pride. He more than likely became upset, that GOD created the earth and placed his new creation Adam as ruler instead of him. Satan then betrayed GOD and was cast out. However, this time frame in the creation realm was after the creation week had been completed. For GOD saw everything He had created and it was good, yah it was very good. Satan had not yet entered the picture. When he did enter the picture, well read Genesis for the rest of the story.

 

If you don’t separate the realms in perspective to their existence, and try to force the eternal realm under the time flow rules of the creation realm, you will always try and place a creation date on things that happened in the eternal realm (angelic rebellion), and it will never make since to you. I believe this misunderstanding of the realms has caused the creation of many theories based of trying to fit the evolution view into the creation account, one being the gap theory, where there existed a past history of the earth before GOD reformed it for Adam. This is used to explain the dinosaurs, by adding million and billions of years of prehistoric history that never truly existed.

 

 

JMHO

 

Peace, but not yet.

 

Maranatha,...The Lord Cometh.

 

[JohnD]

It is a mistake to read / study Revelation without understanding the recapitulation aspects of the text. This property of the Apocalypse is one of the reasons why I suggest using the book of Revelation as a guide for studying all of scripture. Revelation is therefore not all about the future (even to John the Revelator who penned the book 1919 years ago). 

 

The account of Revelation 12 for example had already happened by 96 CE.

 

Jesus said he saw Satan fall from heaven like lightning in Luke 10:18 which could easily have been an expression of a past event which the more recent blow to the dark kingdom was resonant of. Meaning it did not have to happen at that time, but that time was a blow to the evil kingdom as was the time in eternity past when Satan was cast out of heaven...

 

Well, what about the first two chapters of Job? Satan had access to heaven then.

 

Yes, but only when the angels presented themselves before the throne of God (at whatever interval that was / is). We must consider all the facts of the passages.

 

This in contrast to the apparent free access he had in Ezekiel 28 and the tactical campaign of Isaiah 14 to regain / overthrow...

[JohnD]

My take on the current disposition of the devil is that he is in exile from his own kingdom.

 

Revelation 20:1–5 (AV)

¹And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

²And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

³And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

 

Revelation 20:7–10 (AV)

⁷And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

⁸And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

⁹And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

¹⁰And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

 

The word for thousand in the Greek does not necessarily mean an actual 1,000 years, but is rather a plural meaning thousands... the Greek scholars among us here can verify this.

 

According to:

 

Jude 6 (AV)

⁶And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

 

This apparently distinguishes the fallen angels / demons who wander freely about the earth from those in the abyss under chains of darkness. And therefore keeping not their first estate cannot mean simply falling from the obedience to God.

 

Notice:

 

Luke 8:27–33 (AV)

²⁷And when he went forth to land, there met him out of the city a certain man, which had devils long time, and ware no clothes, neither abode in any house, but in the tombs.

²⁸When he saw Jesus, he cried out, and fell down before him, and with a loud voice said, What have I to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God most high? I beseech thee, torment me not.

²⁹(For he had commanded the unclean spirit to come out of the man. For oftentimes it had caught him: and he was kept bound with chains and in fetters; and he brake the bands, and was driven of the devil into the wilderness.)

³⁰And Jesus asked him, saying, What is thy name? And he said, Legion: because many devils were entered into him.

³¹And they besought him that he would not command them to go out into the deep.†

³²And there was there an herd of many swine feeding on the mountain: and they besought him that he would suffer them to enter into them. And he suffered them.

³³Then went the devils out of the man, and entered into the swine: and the herd ran violently down a steep place into the lake, and were choked.

 

† abyss / abusos in Greek

 

In the Matthew 8 account (verse 29) we read that the reference to torment in Luke 8:28 is referring to their being sent to the abyss as a timely event (before "the time?")... the time of what? Judgment? No. Jude 6 says they are to be held there until the day of judgment. Obviously the demons were speaking of the time frame of the life of the host they possessed. Luke 8:31 dispels any doubt about their next destination, and that they asked Jesus to do something out of the norm by sending them rather to the herd of swine. And they in turn killed themselves rather than live with the possession of the demons.

 

So... what can we deduce from all this?

 

That a spirit (who mocks the indwelling of the Holy Spirit in believers in Jesus Christ through the cheap imitation of possession††) who possesses a host is bound to that host till their death (or exorcism) and from there it's straight into the abyss. 

 

†† The Holy Spirit indwells us benevolently always leaving the decisions / choices to the host (that's us)

Demon possession is of a dictatorial spirit who commands and rages and dominates the host

 

Footnote: the devil's ways are typically cheap imitations of God's perfect ways. Reincarnation, for example is a cheap erroneous imitation of resurrection.

 

Now note:

 

Luke 22:3 (AV)

³Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve.

 

John 13:26–27 (AV)

²⁶Jesus answered, He it is, to whom I shall give a sop, when I have dipped it. And when he had dipped the sop, he gave it to Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon.

²⁷And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.

 

Acts 1:25 (AV)

²⁵That he may take part of this ministry and apostleship, from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place.

 

Revelation 9:11 (AV)

¹¹And they had a king over them, which is the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in the Hebrew tongue is Abaddon, but in the Greek tongue hath his name Apollyon.

 

Would the world have been as evil as it has been these last 2000 years if the devil really were in prison in the abyss until the 70th Week of Daniel?

 

Certainly.

 

Humanity itself has the evil potential.

 

And this removes a second release of the devil / second Armageddon scenario from the book of Revelation making the two accounts about the same historic events.

[JohnD]

I am aware of the parable of the man who was possessed by seven spirits and they left into arid places to return to him with his house swept and clean and that the condition of the man was worse then than before (Matthew 12:43-45).

 

This is a parable and is in the context of the generation Jesus was condemning. And as the Matthew 8 and Luke 8 passages indicate the LORD is able to make exceptions to the rule (which does not negate was is apparently the rule or the norm).

 

And also of "the devil prowls around as a roaring lion..." 1 Peter 5:8...

 

Could be an expression like Jesus seeing Satan fall like lightning from heaven... note also the words Peter uses "your enemy" enemy / accuser = the devil also the article is not present in the Greek which does not necessitate THE devil but can be A devil or devils in general...

 

So, what if God made an exception with Satan like the legion and the swine?

 

He does (Revelation 20 when the thousands of years is past).

[JohnD]

2 Thessalonians 2:1–4 (AV)

¹Now we beseech you, brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him,

²That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

³Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

⁴Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

 

John 17:12 (AV)

¹²While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

 

Luke 22:3 (AV)

³Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve.

 

John 13:26–27 (AV)

²⁶Jesus answered, He it is, to whom I shall give a sop, when I have dipped it. And when he had dipped the sop, he gave it to Judas Iscariot, the son of Simon.

²⁷And after the sop Satan entered into him. Then said Jesus unto him, That thou doest, do quickly.

 

Acts 1:25 (AV)

²⁵That he may take part of this ministry and apostleship, from which Judas by transgression fell, that he might go to his own place.

 

Revelation 20:1–5 (AV)

¹And I saw an angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain in his hand.

²And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,

³And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

 

Revelation 20:7–9a (AV)

⁷And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

⁸And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

⁹And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city...

 

Revelation 13:1–10 (AV)

¹And I stood upon the sand of the sea†††, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

²And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.

³And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.

⁴And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?

⁵And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

⁶And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

⁷And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

⁸And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

⁹If any man have an ear, let him hear.

¹⁰He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

 

†††

Genesis 22:17 (AV)

¹⁷That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which is upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies;

 

Matthew 24:16–21 (AV)

¹⁶Then let them which be in Judaea flee into the mountains:

¹⁷Let him which is on the housetop not come down to take any thing out of his house:

¹⁸Neither let him which is in the field return back to take his clothes.

¹⁹And woe unto them that are with child, and to them that give suck in those days!

²⁰But pray ye that your flight be not in the winter, neither on the sabbath day:

²¹For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

[JohnD]

Suppose you have a man who appears on the scene and is able to back up his claim to be Judas Iscariot. DNA or blood content... able to scientifically prove that he was a Jewish male who lived 2000 years ago. Remember in order to convince the whole world (the one exception being Spirit-filled believers in Jesus) this guy will have to be extremely convincing to skeptics, agnostics, atheists, other religions...

 

Just FYI, this is when Christians stick their heads back in the sand with the excuse "I look for Christ not antichrist" or "why so much focus on the devil?"

 

It's all in the Bible. If we were not to be concerned about it, why is it there?

 

Secondly,

 

How certain are you that these things will not happen before the rapture?

 

Revelation 12:17 (AV)

¹⁷And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

 

Revelation 13:5–10 (AV)

⁵And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

⁶And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.

⁷And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations.

⁸And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

⁹If any man have an ear, let him hear.

¹⁰He that leadeth into captivity shall go into captivity: he that killeth with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.

 

 

Daniel 9:27 (AV)

²⁷And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

 

Daniel 12:11–12 (AV)

¹¹And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days.

¹²Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the thousand three hundred and five and thirty days.

 

 

click on to enlarge

[missmuffet]

He was removed from his duties, but I don't think he was actually kicked out of heaven.....   I think he still has access to heaven, at least he did during the book of Job.

 

Actually the book of Revelation speaks of him and the fallen angels being thrown down here and the vision that John saw in the sky actually happens in 2017...

I think Satan has occasional access to the Throne of God as well but heaven is still very safe.

[JohnD]

 

He was removed from his duties, but I don't think he was actually kicked out of heaven.....   I think he still has access to heaven, at least he did during the book of Job.

 

Actually the book of Revelation speaks of him and the fallen angels being thrown down here and the vision that John saw in the sky actually happens in 2017...

I think Satan has occasional access to the Throne of God as well but heaven is still very safe.

 

Well, what about the first two chapters of Job? Satan had access to heaven then.

 

Yes, but only when the angels presented themselves before the throne of God (at whatever interval that was / is). We must consider all the facts of the passages.

 

This in contrast to the apparent free access he had in Ezekiel 28 and the tactical campaign of Isaiah 14 to regain / overthrow..

[Ezra]

 

He was removed from his duties, but I don't think he was actually kicked out of heaven.....   I think he still has access to heaven, at least he did during the book of Job.

 

Actually the book of Revelation speaks of him and the fallen angels being thrown down here and the vision that John saw in the sky actually happens in 2017...

I think Satan has occasional access to the Throne of God as well but heaven is still very safe.

 

There is a lot of confusion about where Satan is, and what he has access to.  I can provide chapter and verse, but will simply summarize:

 

1. When Lucifer and his evil angels rebelled they were cast out of the third heaven -- the Heaven where God's throne resides.  They cannot have access to this Heaven snce that time because nothing that is evil, sinful, or unholy can ever enter God's Heaven.

 

2. When we read the book of Job, that does not say that Satan entered the third heaven.  Since he is given free access to the first and second heavens (the atmosphere, the stratosphere, and outer space) that dialogue with God (surrounded by the holy angels) would have occurred somewhere outside the third heaven.

 

3. When we read in Revelation about the war in heaven, Satan and his evil angels are cast down to earth from the first and second heavens.  Presently Satan is "the prince of the power of the air", but that will change just before the Antichrist takes control of the earth.  All those evil angels will either be on earth or in the bottomless pit until they are released for a season and then consigned to the Lake of Fire.