Who said , Grace covers all of the law of Moses ?

[1to3]

11 hours ago, other one said:

if you follow the two laws that Jesus gave us to live by, which of the commandments could a person break....   with the exception of the fourth.   Let me ask you this::::

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Matt 25:31-46

31 "But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. 32 "And all the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; 33 and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left. 34 "Then the King will say to those on His right, 'Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35 'For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in; 36 naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.' 37 "Then the righteous will answer Him, saying, 'Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You drink? 38 'And when did we see You a stranger, and invite You in, or naked, and clothe You? 39 'And when did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?' 40 "And the King will answer and say to them, 'Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.' 41 "Then He will also say to those on His left, 'Depart from Me, accursed ones, into the eternal fire which has been prepared for the devil and his angels; 42 for I was hungry, and you gave Me nothing to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me nothing to drink; 43 I was a stranger, and you did not invite Me in; naked, and you did not clothe Me; sick, and in prison, and you did not visit Me.' 44 "Then they themselves also will answer, saying, 'Lord, when did we see You hungry, or thirsty, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not take care of You?' 45 "Then He will answer them, saying, 'Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it to one of the least of these, you did not do it to Me.' 46 "And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life."
NASB

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

This is red in my Bibles because it's Jesus himself talking.....       read this very carefully and tell me what of the ten commandments did this group of people that Jesus says he's sending to hell broke.

This is the danger of pushing the ten commandments instead of getting inside the Two we are supposed to be living by.   You can live by the ten commandments and still go to hell by not getting involved and preaching what is inside the two.

 

They failed to love their neighbor as themselves

also breaking the commandments is failing to love your neighbor as yourself, when it comes to coveting, bearing false witness,adultery, stealing, killing...

same difference.

when you love God with all your mind, body and soul

and love your neighbor as yourself, you are fulfilling all commandments in your heart.

The fulfillment of the Mercy and Grace of Christ Jesus paying for the penalty our our sins allows us the possibility of having the Holy Spirit of God live and work His laws in our hearts convicting our hearts and helping us to transform into His new Creation through the renewing of His Holy Spirit within us, within our hearts.

From my own understanding, this was not possible until Christ Jesus paid the penalty on the cross for our sins..

 

[other one]

7 hours ago, 1to3 said:

They failed to love their neighbor as themselves

also breaking the commandments is failing to love your neighbor as yourself, when it comes to coveting, bearing false witness,adultery, stealing, killing...

same difference.

 

no it isn't the same.....    yes breaking the ten is not loving your neighbor, that is true, but the reverse isn't necessarily so.  There isn't anything in the ten commandments that tells you to love your neighbor......    to help him when he/she's in trouble or in real need.   And, apparently not doing so can send you to hell.

I see a lot of people here at worthy pushing the ten commandments on people, when we should be pushing the two.

[1to3]

my full quote from earlier:

They failed to love their neighbor as themselves

also breaking the commandments is failing to love your neighbor as yourself, when it comes to coveting, bearing false witness,adultery, stealing, killing...

same difference.

when you love God with all your mind, body and soul

and love your neighbor as yourself, you are fulfilling all commandments in your heart.

The fulfillment of the Mercy and Grace of Christ Jesus paying for the penalty our our sins allows us the possibility of having the Holy Spirit of God live and work His laws in our hearts convicting our hearts and helping us to transform into His new Creation through the renewing of His Holy Spirit within us, within our hearts.

From my own understanding, this was not possible until Christ Jesus paid the penalty on the cross for our sins..

--------------------------------------------------------------

Matthew ch5 v17

Christ Jesus said:

"Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets, I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.

-18 for assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one title will be by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

-19 Whoever therefore breacks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called the least in the kindgdom of heaven,

but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

 

Chrisy Jesus said He did not come to be done with the Law and the prphets But to FULFILL it.

Romans ch11 19-31

¹⁹ Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” ²⁰ That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. ²¹ For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. ²² Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off. ²³ And even they, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God has the power to graft them in again. ²⁴ For if you were cut from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and grafted, contrary to nature, into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, the natural branches, be grafted back into their own olive tree.

 

The Mystery of Israel's Salvation

²⁵ Lest you be wise in your own sight, I do not want you to be unaware of this mystery, brothers:^[c] a partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.

²⁶ And in this way all Israel will be saved, as it is written,

“The Deliverer will come from Zion,
    he will banish ungodliness from Jacob”;
²⁷ “and this will be my covenant with them
    when I take away their sins.”

²⁸ As regards the gospel, they are enemies for your sake. But as regards election, they are beloved for the sake of their forefathers.

²⁹ For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. ³⁰ For just as you were at one time disobedient to God but now have received mercy because of their disobedience,

³¹ so they too have now been disobedient in order that by the mercy shown to you they also may now^[d] receive mercy.

 

[thereselittleflower]

 

6 hours ago, other one said:

no it isn't the same.....    yes breaking the ten is not loving your neighbor, that is true, but the reverse isn't necessarily so.  There isn't anything in the ten commandments that tells you to love your neighbor......    to help him when he/she's in trouble or in real need.   And, apparently not doing so can send you to hell.

I see a lot of people here at worthy pushing the ten commandments on people, when we should be pushing the two.

I agree completely with that last statement.     The  10 commandments are based on the 2 great commandments, but do not in any way encompass all of what the 2 great commandments encompass.  The 10 are more like what one would give to a child, very concrete, not abstract.   But when the child grows up, the 10 are too limiting, too concrete, and it becomes clear there is more to God's law than what the 10 commandments portray -  that is why when someone calls their brother  "racca" they are guilty of murder in their heart.

When we go to college we don't go back to the rudiments of kindergarten.   We move forward in our understanding; we are to be moving forward into ALL the 2 Great Commandments encompass.

 

 

[other one]

11 minutes ago, 1to3 said:

my full quote from earlier:

They failed to love their neighbor as themselves

also breaking the commandments is failing to love your neighbor as yourself, when it comes to coveting, bearing false witness,adultery, stealing, killing...

same difference.

when you love God with all your mind, body and soul

and love your neighbor as yourself, you are fulfilling all commandments in your heart.

The fulfillment of the Mercy and Grace of Christ Jesus paying for the penalty our our sins allows us the possibility of having the Holy Spirit of God live and work His laws in our hearts convicting our hearts and helping us to transform into His new Creation through the renewing of His Holy Spirit within us, within our hearts.

From my own understanding, this was not possible until Christ Jesus paid the penalty on the cross for our sins..

--------------------------------------------------------------

Matthew ch5 v17

Christ Jesus said:

"Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets, I did not come to destroy but to fulfill.

-18 for assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one title will be by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled.

-19 Whoever therefore breacks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called the least in the kindgdom of heaven,

but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

 

Chrisy Jesus said He did not come to be done with the Law and the prphets But to FULFILL it.

Romans ch11 19-31

¹⁹ Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” ²⁰ That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. ²¹ For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. ²² Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God's kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off. ²³ And even they, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God has the power to graft them in again. ²⁴ For if you were cut from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and grafted, contrary to nature, into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, the natural branches, be grafted back into their own olive tree.

 

The Mystery of Israel's Salvation

²⁵ Lest you be wise in your own sight, I do not want you to be unaware of this mystery, brothers:^[c] a partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.

²⁶ And in this way all Israel will be saved, as it is written,

“The Deliverer will come from Zion,
    he will banish ungodliness from Jacob”;
²⁷ “and this will be my covenant with them
    when I take away their sins.”

²⁸ As regards the gospel, they are enemies for your sake. But as regards election, they are beloved for the sake of their forefathers.

²⁹ For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. ³⁰ For just as you were at one time disobedient to God but now have received mercy because of their disobedience,

³¹ so they too have now been disobedient in order that by the mercy shown to you they also may now^[d] receive mercy.

 

I am simply warning you that you will not be judged by the old laws over spiritual matters.   The old law pertains to physical life on the planet today....    you will be rewarded or condemned by the new as the scripture in Matthew I posted earlier states.  heed my warning or not will not change the outcome on judgment day.

 

[1to3]

Quote from o.O

"What it takes to get to heaven is, come judgment day, Jesus says that you and/or I are his and judgment is passed over for none of us ever are going to be worthy to go to heaven. "

 

That also my understanding, that we are forgiven in Christ Jesus and so we will not be under the same judgements as someone who has not confessed their sins and asked Christ Jesus to make a home in their hearts.

My understanding is also when you truly ask God to forgive your sins through Gods only begotten Son Christ Jesus and ask Gods Holy Spirit to make a home in your life, you are asking that God who is LAW to come make His home in your heart.  From my own experience, when you do this, The Holy Spirit of God does come to you and begins to work in your heart, convicting your spirit, chastising your spirit making you aware of when you are going the wrong way and giving you His grace to show you how to overcome, and so by this we become born again, transformed step by step as the Holy Spirit of God works in our hearts.

(This is the Law of God working in our hearts) we don't need external circumcision, because the holy spirit of god has circumcised our hearts

Colossians 2:11

10 and in Him you have been made complete, and He is the head over all rule and authority

11 and in Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands,

in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ;

12having been buried with Him in baptism, in which you were also raised up with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead.…

 

and for the Jews it was:

Deuteronomy 30: 6

5 "The LORD your God will bring you into the land which your fathers possessed, and you shall possess it; and He will prosper you and multiply you more than your fathers.

6 "Moreover the LORD your God will circumcise your heart and the heart of your descendants, to love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul, so that you may live.

7"The LORD your God will inflict all these curses on your enemies and on those who hate you, who persecuted you.…

-----------------------------

I only know what I have experienced in my walk with God , and it is the Holy Spirit of God, who has gently awakened me to SEE where I went wrong, were I am still going wrong and what needs changing and transformation to become further purified in Him.

For sure, I am not there yet, but as long as I keep God close to my heart on a daily basis, my protection and salvation back to God has been covered by the shed blood of Gods only begotten Son Christ Jesus, that payed the penalty for ALL my sins. With that, my judgment was made when I turned my life to the cross and shed my sins with Christ Jesus on the cross and humbly asked the holy spirit of God to come into my heart and make His home in my heart.

By doing this the Laws of God are working in my heart, more so than without asking Him into my heart.

That means that God consciousness is working in my heart and conscious and when I go astray, like the good shepherd that Christ Jesus is, He comes gently to help me back up.

Over the years, its the Holy Spirit of God who has changed me by Him working in me. through this my behaviors have changed, not by my effort but by my heart being changed more and more to the heart of  God=into His image.

I know I have still learning and transformation to do, but as long a I continues asking the Holy Spirit of God -let go of self and let God take the reigns. I know He will continue to work in my heart and guide me

through my circumstances. and despite what may happen, good or bad, God is with me to see me through and to see me back home with Him

 

----------------------------------------

The 10 commandments where given as signs post to guide people in the right direction. They are not meant for good people to follow, because good people would naturally do them, they were placed to show the way to become good so to lead a healthier life, body, mind, soul.

They are still important, for some people especially in this day and age, don't know anymore right from wrong. because everybody does as they please in the secular world and everything becomes confusion. God is not the author of confusion.

God is Law, clear and simple to understand

The 10 commandments should be naturally in the heart of someone who is pure without sin.

The thing is that we ALL fall short of these laws because of our fallen nature.

Adam and Eve, lost the discernment of Gods Law when their egos got seduced by satan to stray and do their own thing.

When Abraham was, there were no established laws.

Why did God still honor Abraham even without any established Laws?

Because Abraham seeked God and seeked God alone,

Abraham seeked to establish a daily ongoing relationship with God, and listened to Gods guidance for all of his life.

Sometimes Abraham got side tracked by his wife Sera or other who did not yet believe like Abraham, and Abraham succumbed to going the wrong way by sleeping with the maid servant instead of trusting God. But Abraham continued turning to God, asking God for guidance. And for this, God Established His promises with Abraham's' seed. Because of Abraham's continued steadfast faithfulness in seeking an ongoing relationship with god and God alone.

And God honored Abraham, because Abraham stayed loyal and true to God  by seeking & asking God to show him the way, to show him His ways over mans ways .

Gods ways are His Laws.

I am not talking about all the man-made laws that came about to keep people so busy to do the right thing, they had barely had time to do the wrong thing, but still could not do the right thing because of their fallen nature.. Those became intellectual obsessive compulsive laws, that actually took away rather than brought forth Gods true Laws. They to me are tradition add-on laws, just as faulty as the traditional Catholic man made add on Laws.

Christ Jesus came to establish back the right Law that Satan had taken away from mans heart.

 

 

[thereselittleflower]

2 hours ago, 1to3 said:

Quote from o.O

"What it takes to get to heaven is, come judgment day, Jesus says that you and/or I are his and judgment is passed over for none of us ever are going to be worthy to go to heaven. "

 

That also my understanding, that we are forgiven in Christ Jesus and so we will not be under the same judgements as someone who has not confessed their sins and asked Christ Jesus to make a home in their hearts.

My understanding is also when you truly ask God to forgive your sins through Gods only begotten Son Christ Jesus and ask Gods Holy Spirit to make a home in your life, you are asking that God who is LAW to come make His home in your heart.  From my own experience, when you do this, The Holy Spirit of God does come to you and begins to work in your heart, convicting your spirit, chastising your spirit making you aware of when you are going the wrong way and giving you His grace to show you how to overcome, and so by this we become born again, transformed step by step as the Holy Spirit of God works in our hearts.

(This is the Law of God working in our hearts) we don't need external circumcision, because the holy spirit of god has circumcised our hearts

Colossians 2:11

10and in Him you have been made complete, and He is the head over all rule and authority; 11and in Him you were also circumcised with a circumcision made without hands, in the removal of the body of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ; 12having been buried with Him in baptism, in which you were also raised up with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead.…

and for the Jews it was:

Deuteronomy 30: 6

5"The LORD your God will bring you into the land which your fathers possessed, and you shall possess it; and He will prosper you and multiply you more than your fathers. 6"Moreover the LORD your God will circumcise your heart and the heart of your descendants, to love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul, so that you may live. 7"The LORD your God will inflict all these curses on your enemies and on those who hate you, who persecuted you.…

-----------------------------

I only know what I have experienced in my walk with God , and  it is the Holy Spirit of God, who has gently awakened me to SEE where I went wrong, were I am still going wrong and what needs changing and transformation to become further purified in Him.

For sure, I am not there yet, but as long as I keep God close to my heart on a daily basis, my protection and salvation back to God has been covered by the shed blood of Gods only begotten Son Christ Jesus, that payed the penalty for ALL my sins. With that, my judgment was made when I turned my life to the cross and shed my sins with Christ Jesus on the cross and humbly asked the holy spirit og god to come into my heart and make His home in my heart.

By doing this the Laws of God are working in my heart, more so than without asking Him into my heart.

That means that God consciousness is working in my heart and conscious and when i go astray, like the good shepherd that Christ Jesus is, He comes gently to help me back up.

Over the years, its the Holy Spirit of god who has changed me by Him working in me. through this my behaviors have changed, not by my effort but by my heart being change more and more to the heart of  God=into His image.

I know I have still learning and transformation to do, but as long a I continues asking the Holy Spirit of God -let go of self and let God take the reigns. I know He will continues to work in my heart and guide me

through my circumstances. and despite what may happen, good or bad, god is with me to see me through and to see me back home with Him

 

----------------------------------------

The 10 commandments where given as signs post to guide people in the right direction. They are not meant for good people to follow, because good peaple would naturally do them, they were place to show the way to become good so to lead a healthier life, body, mind, soul

They are still important, for some people especially in this day and age, don't know anymore right from wrong. because everybody does as they please in the secular world and everything becomes confusion. God is  not the author of confusion.

God is Law, clear and simple to understand

The 10 commandments should be naturally in the heart of someone who is pure without sin.

The thing is that we ALL fall short of these laws because of our fallen nature.

Adam and Eve, lost the discernment of Gods Law when their egos seduced by satan to stray and do their own thing.

When Abraham was, there were no established laws.

Why did God still honor Abraham even without any established Laws?

Because Abraham seek God and seeked God alone, seeked to establish a daily ongoing relationship with God, and listened to Gods guidance.

sometimes Abraham got side tracked by his wife Sera who did not yet believe like Abraham, and Abraham secumed to going the wrong way by sleeping with the maid servant instead of trusting God. But Abraham continued turning to God, asking God for guidance. And for this Established His promises with Abrahms' seed. Because of Abraham's continued steadfast faithfulness in seekink an ongoing relationship with god and God alone.

And God honored Abraham, because Abraham stayed loyal and true to God  by asking God to show him the way, to show him His ways over mans ways .

Gods ways are His Laws.

I am not talking about all the man-made laws that came about to keep people so busy to do the right thing, they had barely had time to do the wrong thing, but still could not do the right thing because of their fallen nature.. Those became intellectual obsessive compulsive laws, that actually took away rather than brought forth Gods true Laws. They to me are tradition add-on laws, just as faulty as the traditional Catholic man made add on Laws.

Christ Jesus came to establish back the right Law that Satan had taken away from mans heart.

 

 

So you don't believe that Jesus makes us genuinely worthy of heaven?

 

 

[1to3]

55 minutes ago, thereselittleflower said:

So you don't believe that Jesus makes us genuinely worthy of heaven?

 

 

I can't help it if you don't know how to read.

[thereselittleflower]

Just now, 1to3 said:

I can't help it if you don't know how to read.

That's quite rude.

 

[1to3]

Sorry  that it offended you,

How can I explain this better?

My answer and belief is in what I already wrote.