Pre-tribbers, what do you have

[Salty]

I don't see us with The Father anywhere during Christ's thousand years reign on earth. Rev.5:10 is specific that Christ's elect priests and kings will reign... on the earth, and elsewhere is written reigning with Christ with the "rod of iron" over the nations.

[ARGOSY]

I don't see us with The Father anywhere during Christ's thousand years reign on earth. Rev.5:10 is specific that Christ's elect priests and kings will reign... on the earth, and elsewhere is written reigning with Christ with the "rod of iron" over the nations.

 

This is true, but other verses indicate our dwelling and true home after salvation is in heaven, and our place in Jerusalem is known as a "camp" in Rev 20, which is not a permanent dwelling. So I do agree we reign on earth, but have you got any verses that specifically exclude us from heaven as well during that entire period?   You could be right, but I don't see enough biblical evidence that we are restricted to earth for the entire period.

[Salty]

If you understand the Millennium layout given in Ezekiel 40 forward, then it is not just some campsite. The Greek word for 'camp' there has different meanings. The encampment in Jerusalem of the Roman soldiers was a castle, so that meaning can be applied to "camp" also. See how it is translated in other NT Scripture.

[ARGOSY]

If you understand the Millennium layout given in Ezekiel 40 forward, then it is not just some campsite. The Greek word for 'camp' there has different meanings. The encampment in Jerusalem of the Roman soldiers was a castle, so that meaning can be applied to "camp" also. See how it is translated in other NT Scripture.

 

Fair enough, but whether we are living in a castle or a tent on earth , our promise of a heavenly residence is in contrast to our earthly reign with Christ. These could be consecutive, earthly first, then heavenly. Or these could be simultaneous, with homes in both places. If you have no verse which excludes the possibility that we can reside in both places during the millenium, then I think its a valid possibility. 

 

Edit: as for the "millenial layout" of Ezekiel 40-48 , these are mortals. The priests have instructions regarding death. I believe the only ones who could be seen as immortals are the "sons of the prince"... which possibly is referring to us believers, adopted sons of God.

[Salty]

 

If you understand the Millennium layout given in Ezekiel 40 forward, then it is not just some campsite. The Greek word for 'camp' there has different meanings. The encampment in Jerusalem of the Roman soldiers was a castle, so that meaning can be applied to "camp" also. See how it is translated in other NT Scripture.

 

Fair enough, but whether we are living in a castle or a tent on earth , our promise of a heavenly residence is in contrast to our earthly reign with Christ. These could be consecutive, earthly first, then heavenly. Or these could be simultaneous, with homes in both places. If you have no verse which excludes the possibility that we can reside in both places during the millenium, then I think its a valid possibility. 

 

Edit: as for the "millenial layout" of Ezekiel 40-48 , these are mortals. The priests have instructions regarding death. I believe the only ones who could be seen as immortals are the "sons of the prince"... which possibly is referring to us believers, adopted sons of God.

 

 

Well, I guess the majority are not going to be convinced of the end of this flesh world today at Christ's coming until it happens to them on that day. That's when the heavenly dimension will be opened up for all to see, and will be manifest upon the earth too. So really, there is no Scripture evidence that we are going to live off the earth at any time after Christ's coming, because God is coming here on earth to live. Living up in the clouds is just not a Biblical idea, it's a doctrine of men. God is not the author of it.

 

When Apostle Paul said as we have borne the "image of the earthy", that of course includes all peoples born on earth, not just those of Christ's Church. So likewise all will bear the "image of the heavenly" too in Christ's Millennium. It will be a Heavenly age, not another flesh world age like this one of today.

 

As for speculative possibilities because there's no Scripture against, we could just as well say Mickey Mouse is going to sit upon a throne too in Christ's future Kingdom reigning over Disney World, because there's no specific Scripture written against it.

[ARGOSY]

 

 

If you understand the Millennium layout given in Ezekiel 40 forward, then it is not just some campsite. The Greek word for 'camp' there has different meanings. The encampment in Jerusalem of the Roman soldiers was a castle, so that meaning can be applied to "camp" also. See how it is translated in other NT Scripture.

 

Fair enough, but whether we are living in a castle or a tent on earth , our promise of a heavenly residence is in contrast to our earthly reign with Christ. These could be consecutive, earthly first, then heavenly. Or these could be simultaneous, with homes in both places. If you have no verse which excludes the possibility that we can reside in both places during the millenium, then I think its a valid possibility. 

 

Edit: as for the "millenial layout" of Ezekiel 40-48 , these are mortals. The priests have instructions regarding death. I believe the only ones who could be seen as immortals are the "sons of the prince"... which possibly is referring to us believers, adopted sons of God.

 

 

Well, I guess the majority are not going to be convinced of the end of this flesh world today at Christ's coming until it happens to them on that day. That's when the heavenly dimension will be opened up for all to see, and will be manifest upon the earth too. So really, there is no Scripture evidence that we are going to live off the earth at any time after Christ's coming, because God is coming here on earth to live. Living up in the clouds is just not a Biblical idea, it's a doctrine of men. God is not the author of it.

 

When Apostle Paul said as we have borne the "image of the earthy", that of course includes all peoples born on earth, not just those of Christ's Church. So likewise all will bear the "image of the heavenly" too in Christ's Millennium. It will be a Heavenly age, not another flesh world age like this one of today.

 

As for speculative possibilities because there's no Scripture against, we could just as well say Mickey Mouse is going to sit upon a throne too in Christ's future Kingdom reigning over Disney World, because there's no specific Scripture written against it.

 

Lol!  I like the logic.   Yes arguments from silence aren't the best arguments, but I feel there is enough evidence of our place in the heavenly Jerusalem as different to the earthly Jerusalem (not floating in the clouds - haha)

 

John 14:2 My Father’s house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you?

Phill 3:20 But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ

Hebrews 12:22 But you have come to Mount Zion, to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem. You have come to thousands upon thousands of angels in joyful assembly,23 to the church of the firstborn, whose names are written in heaven.

 

And.. there is also enough evidence that there are mortals on the earth after the day of the Lord. Isaiah 65, Ezekiel 40-48 , Zechariah 12-14 . We will have to agree to disagree on this topic, but thanks for the civil discussion.

[Salty]

 

Lol!  I like the logic.   Yes arguments from silence aren't the best arguments, but I feel there is enough evidence of our place in the heavenly Jerusalem as different to the earthly Jerusalem (not floating in the clouds - haha)

 

John 14:2 My Father’s house has many rooms; if that were not so, would I have told you that I am going there to prepare a place for you?

Phill 3:20 But our citizenship is in heaven. And we eagerly await a Savior from there, the Lord Jesus Christ

Hebrews 12:22 But you have come to Mount Zion, to the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem. You have come to thousands upon thousands of angels in joyful assembly,23 to the church of the firstborn, whose names are written in heaven.

 

And.. there is also enough evidence that there are mortals on the earth after the day of the Lord. Isaiah 65, Ezekiel 40-48 , Zechariah 12-14 . We will have to agree to disagree on this topic, but thanks for the civil discussion.

 

 

I couldn't help it brother. Mickey Mouse isn't a Christian that I know of, especially since he played the Sorcerer's Apprentice.

 

The differences between our views on this topic is how I see the heavenly revealed upon... this earth, after Christ's coming, and that means those Scriptures about our heavenly home or abodes ("mansions"), The New Jerusalem, will begin to manifest on earth at Christ's coming. This is why the tree of life is shown having come back to earth per Ezek.47 and Rev.22:14-15 along with the holy city and God's House (Ezekiel's temple), while the wicked will dwell outside it. The places of Engedi and Eneglaim in the Middle East are associated with God's River back on earth in that time of Christ's thousand years reign (Ezek.47:8-12).

[Montana Marv]

I don't see us with The Father anywhere during Christ's thousand years reign on earth. Rev.5:10 is specific that Christ's elect priests and kings will reign... on the earth, and elsewhere is written reigning with Christ with the "rod of iron" over the nations.

That is because we have already been with the Father in Heaven, and been in His house, and been untied to the Bridegroom and received our crowns of glory.  We receive our assignments in heaven so we know how we will reign with Him/Christ on earth during the 1000 years.

 

In Christ

Montana Marv

[Salty]

 

I don't see us with The Father anywhere during Christ's thousand years reign on earth. Rev.5:10 is specific that Christ's elect priests and kings will reign... on the earth, and elsewhere is written reigning with Christ with the "rod of iron" over the nations.

That is because we have already been with the Father in Heaven, and been in His house, and been untied to the Bridegroom and received our crowns of glory.  We receive our assignments in heaven so we know how we will reign with Him/Christ on earth during the 1000 years.

 

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

 

You know by now I don't subscribe to that pre-trib rapture theory. When our Lord Jesus comes to end the tribulation that's when He will gather His Church, from heaven and from the earth on the way to Jerusalem. That's where His elect priests will reign with Him from, as that's where the "mansions" (abodes) of the priests will be, in the holy city.

[Montana Marv]

 

 

I don't see us with The Father anywhere during Christ's thousand years reign on earth. Rev.5:10 is specific that Christ's elect priests and kings will reign... on the earth, and elsewhere is written reigning with Christ with the "rod of iron" over the nations.

That is because we have already been with the Father in Heaven, and been in His house, and been untied to the Bridegroom and received our crowns of glory.  We receive our assignments in heaven so we know how we will reign with Him/Christ on earth during the 1000 years.

 

In Christ

Montana Marv

 

 

You know by now I don't subscribe to that pre-trib rapture theory. When our Lord Jesus comes to end the tribulation that's when He will gather His Church, from heaven and from the earth on the way to Jerusalem. That's where His elect priests will reign with Him from, as that's where the "mansions" (abodes) of the priests will be, in the holy city.

 

Salty

 

Then rest of mankind (2/3's) who were not killed by the three plagues continued to worship demons and idols, per Rev 9:20.  And they repented not.  It cannot get much clearer than that.  A strong delusion.  Yet, I will remove the sin of this land in a single day (Zech 3:9),  The Second Coming.

 

I cannot accept a demon and idol worshiping Church during this period of time, or at all.  So this Post - Trib doctrine theory of many is out the window.  There is no substance to the Post - Trib theory.  They cannot even get the scenes in Heaven and on Earth correct.

 

A know this is quite sharp.

 

In Christ

Montana Marv