RustyAngeL Posted August 16, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 155 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,464 Content Per Day: 1.02 Reputation: 8,810 Days Won: 57 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/12/1952 Share Posted August 16, 2016 5 hours ago, spiderman1917 said: Let's simplify the question. If your babysitter gives a man He/she is not scared of, permission to kill your child, would you agree with them claiming they didn't want any harm to come to your child? Please say "yes" or no. You have dodged many of my questions . The shepherd has control of whether or not the wolf can harm his sheep I"m not sure I understand your question but I would give no one permission to kill my child. The question makes no sense at all. God does not make a plan for evil. It is simply a fact in this evil world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman1917 Posted August 16, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 117 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 1,028 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 810 Days Won: 2 Joined: 02/24/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 16, 2016 (edited) 34 minutes ago, RustyAngeL said: I"m not sure I understand your question but I would give no one permission to kill my child. The question makes no sense at all. God does not make a plan for evil. It is simply a fact in this evil world. He is the shepherd... The wolf is on his leash...the wolf gets to eat the sheep only if the shepherd gives him permission... God gives Satan permission to lead people astray, torment, confuse, torture, and kill.... It is part of Gods plan For his and our glory of course... So, if someone gives somebody permission to kill their kids, it is insane to try and argue that they didn't want any harm to come to their children Edited August 16, 2016 by spiderman1917 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RustyAngeL Posted August 16, 2016 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 23 Topic Count: 155 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 7,464 Content Per Day: 1.02 Reputation: 8,810 Days Won: 57 Joined: 03/30/2004 Status: Offline Birthday: 12/12/1952 Share Posted August 16, 2016 16 hours ago, spiderman1917 said: He is the shepherd... The wolf is on his leash...the wolf gets to eat the sheep only if the shepherd gives him permission... God gives Satan permission to lead people astray, torment, confuse, torture, and kill.... It is part of Gods plan For his and our glory of course... So, if someone gives somebody permission to kill their kids, it is insane to try and argue that they didn't want any harm to come to their children This pure rambling and nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Thallasa Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 On 14/08/2016 at 6:37 AM, spiderman1917 said: Nothing torments my mind more than to hear about innocent children being raped, tortured, or murdered. For whatever mysterious reason however, God gives the devil permission to do so, so it seems undeniable to me he wants it to happen. How can you give someone permission to harm your child if you don't want them to? Let me ask you, if you give a registered sex-offender freedom to rome your house and you know he's gonna rape your kid, could you really claim you didn't want it to happen? It is truly absurd for me to think otherwise. If you are going to say God doesn't want such things, please first answer that question. I'm not saying God commits any evil act or sin. God decides what is right and therefore everything he does is good because he decides what is good or bad. He defines good and therefore all his actions are good. If he gives the devil and wicked people permission to triumph over, fool, manipulate, and slaughter the good and just, then he's asking for it to happen. He wanted his son to be tortured, humiliated, and executed. If you don't think the crucifixion was a good thing, then you aren't Christian. I'm giving God the benefit and praise and assuming they will be so rewarded and filled with glory euphoria (like their slain victim spouse) on the other side, that they won't care about what happened to them or even be glad it happened, but I'm not going to deny the obvious. I know of some sweet girls that tried to help out a sociopathic murderer who was pretending to be injured. It was an act of kindness that cost them their life. Without violating free -will God could have enlightened them to not try helping the guy and recognize he's faking the injury so he can knock them out with a crow-bar and rape + mutilate their bodies. Their inability to discern the killers intentions is also the responsibility of God as well , because there is no violation of free -will to give people accurate instincts and the gift of discernment. Free -will is such an inadequate explanation or cop-out, it's interesting so many seeming rational thinkers buy into it. On 15/08/2016 at 2:46 AM, Butero said: There is a reason for everything that happens. We may not understand it, but God has a divine purpose in everything that takes place. For the righteous, it will work together for their good in the end. Job did have to go through a lot of suffering, but God rewarded him in the end, first in earthly family and possessions, and now, in eternal life. It is quite easy to know if you really want to ,but most Christians are still on milk foods . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Thallasa Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 On 14/08/2016 at 6:37 AM, spiderman1917 said: Nothing torments my mind more than to hear about innocent children being raped, tortured, or murdered. For whatever mysterious reason however, God gives the devil permission to do so, so it seems undeniable to me he wants it to happen. How can you give someone permission to harm your child if you don't want them to? Let me ask you, if you give a registered sex-offender freedom to rome your house and you know he's gonna rape your kid, could you really claim you didn't want it to happen? It is truly absurd for me to think otherwise. If you are going to say God doesn't want such things, please first answer that question. I'm not saying God commits any evil act or sin. God decides what is right and therefore everything he does is good because he decides what is good or bad. He defines good and therefore all his actions are good. If he gives the devil and wicked people permission to triumph over, fool, manipulate, and slaughter the good and just, then he's asking for it to happen. He wanted his son to be tortured, humiliated, and executed. If you don't think the crucifixion was a good thing, then you aren't Christian. I'm giving God the benefit and praise and assuming they will be so rewarded and filled with glory euphoria (like their slain victim spouse) on the other side, that they won't care about what happened to them or even be glad it happened, but I'm not going to deny the obvious. I know of some sweet got irls that tried to help out a sociopathic murderer who was pretending to be injured. It was an act of kindness that cost them their life. Without violating free -will God could have enlightened them to not try helping the guy and recognize he's faking the injury so he can knock them out with a crow-bar and rape + mutilate their bodies. Their inability to discern the killers intentions is also the responsibility of God as well , because there is no violation of free -will to give people accurate instincts and the gift of discernment. Free -will is such an inadequate explanation or cop-out, it's interesting so many seeming rational thinkers buy into it. No of course God does not in any way sanction this except that His creation is made in such a way, that everything we do has a consequence for good or bad, and what we do comes back to us . We are also vulnerable to attacks by evil, when we are not already protected by the Holy Spirit . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman1917 Posted August 16, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 117 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 1,028 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 810 Days Won: 2 Joined: 02/24/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 16, 2016 (edited) 3 hours ago, RustyAngeL said: This pure rambling and nonsense. Which part is rambling...perhaps the part about the wolf being on the leash? What I meant is, Satan can't do anything God doesn't give him permission to do. The wolf can't attack the sheep without the Shepherd's permission. Do tell me which part of that post was nonsense...God willing that Satan lead people astray?...of course God wills it...if God didn't will it, he wouldn't give Satan permission to confuse people. It's completely obvious that Satan leading people astray and harming them is part of God's plan. God knew Satan would be the author of confusion before he made Satan and then Gave him/her permission to confuse and tempt people. Please answer this question:If you have a pet mouse, and you let a boa constrictor go into the aquarium, and you sit back and watch the outcome, it is because you wanted the snake to eat the mouse, right? Would it violate the mouse's free-will to not let the snake into it's cage? No it wouldn't. Therefore, free-will is not a rational cop-out for this topic. Obviously Edited August 16, 2016 by spiderman1917 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigger398 Posted August 16, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 6 Topic Count: 562 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 2,074 Content Per Day: 0.31 Reputation: 648 Days Won: 2 Joined: 11/01/2005 Status: Offline Birthday: 05/31/1966 Share Posted August 16, 2016 (edited) Ok I think Jesus volunteer the cross. It is not Gods fault that people would rather follow satan and do there own thing. Things happen because that's just how life is. When I smoked I created health problems. should I blame God for it. Edited August 17, 2016 by tigger398 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Robert Posted August 16, 2016 Share Posted August 16, 2016 (edited) On 8/13/2016 at 10:37 PM, spiderman1917 said: Nothing torments my mind more than to hear about innocent children being raped, tortured, or murdered. For whatever mysterious reason however, God gives the devil permission to do so, so it seems undeniable to me he wants it to happen. How can you give someone permission to harm your child if you don't want them to? Let me ask you, if you give a registered sex-offender freedom to rome your house and you know he's gonna rape your kid, could you really claim you didn't want it to happen? It is truly absurd for me to think otherwise. If you are going to say God doesn't want such things, please first answer that question. I'm not saying God commits any evil act or sin. God decides what is right and therefore everything he does is good because he decides what is good or bad. He defines good and therefore all his actions are good. If he gives the devil and wicked people permission to triumph over, fool, manipulate, and slaughter the good and just, then he's asking for it to happen. He wanted his son to be tortured, humiliated, and executed. If you don't think the crucifixion was a good thing, then you aren't Christian. I'm giving God the benefit and praise and assuming they will be so rewarded and filled with glory euphoria (like their slain victim spouse) on the other side, that they won't care about what happened to them or even be glad it happened, but I'm not going to deny the obvious. I know of some sweet girls that tried to help out a sociopathic murderer who was pretending to be injured. It was an act of kindness that cost them their life. Without violating free -will God could have enlightened them to not try helping the guy and recognize he's faking the injury so he can knock them out with a crow-bar and rape + mutilate their bodies. Their inability to discern the killers intentions is also the responsibility of God as well , because there is no violation of free -will to give people accurate instincts and the gift of discernment. Free -will is such an inadequate explanation or cop-out, it's interesting so many seeming rational thinkers buy into it. It sounds to me like you want God to be "guilty" so you can accuse Him, yet what you do not allow for in your "free will is a cop out" statement is: what were the choices? If you were God, what would you do differently? Create a bunch of meat-robots that only did what you told them to do? "Love" would then become meaningless, as it would be forced. No creativity, choice, compassion or anything would be valid, as it would only be an extension of your own persona. Would you eliminate all evil? If so, then you would have to destroy all life and start over, and create the aforementioned "meat-robots". Either way, you are wronging God, and yes, that bothers me tremendously. God is INNOCENT, and has never done wrong, period. He doesn't deserve accusation, but that's what got heaped on Him at the cross. He took that for all of us, and this is what He gets for that? Your move. Edited August 16, 2016 by RobertS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman1917 Posted August 17, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 117 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 1,028 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 810 Days Won: 2 Joined: 02/24/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) 13 hours ago, RobertS said: It sounds to me like you want God to be "guilty" so you can accuse Him, yet what you do not allow for in your "free will is a cop out" statement is: what were the choices? If you were God, what would you do differently? Create a bunch of meat-robots that only did what you told them to do? "Love" would then become meaningless, as it would be forced. No creativity, choice, compassion or anything would be valid, as it would only be an extension of your own persona. Would you eliminate all evil? If so, then you would have to destroy all life and start over, and create the aforementioned "meat-robots". Either way, you are wronging God, and yes, that bothers me tremendously. God is INNOCENT, and has never done wrong, period. He doesn't deserve accusation, but that's what got heaped on Him at the cross. He took that for all of us, and this is what He gets for that? Your move. No you've got it all wrong... God wants some people confused which is why he doesnt enlighten them or give them understanding... God wants Satan to confuse, lead astray, torment, steal, kill, and destroy.... If you put a snake in a mouse cage, knowing it will eat the mouse, it is because you wanted him to. The Devil harming us is part of God's plan. God has to give him permission to harm us. But here is where you are so mistaken. I'm not accusing God of any wrong. If God wants people tortured and killed , it is to glorify him , and therefore is beautiful. God decides what is good so he does no wrong. No, I don't want people to be robots, but if Dad knows years in advance that a serial killer is going to kill his daughter, He could warn her about what she can do to stay safe. If he knows who the killer is and when and where and how he's going to kill her, and doesn't warn her year after year about the danger, it is because that was the destiny he wanted for her. When God was forming the murderer in his mother's womb, he knew he was destined to kill her. It was part of his plan that her Destiny was to be a victim. The Destiny he chose for his son was to be stripped down naked and humiliated before all, spit upon, mocked, scourged, whipped, lacerated, crowned with thorns, crucified, and pierced with a lance. That is absolutely what God had predestined his son for many hundreds of years in advance, therefore it is beautiful and glorified him. If a person is theologically confused and leading people astray, God could open their eyes to see the truth without a microscopic violation of free-will. So, absolutely I pray for that. I said God wants some of his children to be tortured and murdered (which is obviously true ), I didn't say God did anything wrong. Edited August 17, 2016 by spiderman1917 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spiderman1917 Posted August 17, 2016 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 11 Topic Count: 117 Topics Per Day: 0.04 Content Count: 1,028 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 810 Days Won: 2 Joined: 02/24/2016 Status: Offline Author Share Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) Hi MOD, could we please remove the voting option...when I started this thread I wanted it to be a poll where people answered "Yes" or "No" and instead it turned into a "Vote up" Or "Vote down" answer...that feature is just making me confused now as to what takes place chronologically, what was the latest post etc...so if you could please remove that feature , I'd greatly appreaciate it...in Jesus name...God's will be done and God bless you! Edited August 17, 2016 by spiderman1917 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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