When Christians Love Theology More Than People

[OneLight]

On 12/23/2016 at 7:23 PM, shiloh357 said:

I am not implying anything scholastic.   I am simply stating that theology is informed by Scripture, not emotion.  "Reality-based theology?"   The Scriptures are God's perspective on reality.   They address real life.   There is no such thing as "reality-based theology."   Reality for one person is different than another because all of us operate from separate paradigms or perspectives on reality.   If you base theology in "reality" then what you have is each person having a view of God that is embedded in their own unique experience and that would only lead to a chaotic, morass of belief systems, each one looking the Bible subjectively through their own personal lens.   You would have an endless assortment of contradictory views on God, the Bible, Jesus, etc.  and people making up their own doctrines as they go.   That would lead a moral crisis as each person is operating from his own "reality-based theology" morality would end being a subjective value.

So, your theology is built on Sola Scriptura, eliminating all tradition, history, experience, etc.?

[Guest shiloh357]

4 hours ago, OneLight said:

You are repeating yourself.  Yes, theology is personal.  If theology was universal, we all would have the same theology, so your statement proves itself wrong.  No matter how hard you try, you cannot separate yourself from your theology, which makes it personal.  Just as our relationship with God is personal, so is our theology.

Theology isn't personal.  The theology pertaining to the incarnation of Christ isn't personal.  It is universal.  The theology pertaining to the deity of Jesus and the Hypo-static Union is not personal, but universal.  Soteriology, Christology, Hamartiology, Angelology, etc.  are not personal, at all. 

What's personal is the application of theology, not the formation of theology.   We apply it subjectively, we form it objectively.   Our relationship with God is personal.  The theology that governs that relationship isn't personal and it certainly isn't rooted in emotion.   It may impact our emotions, but that is the product of our application of theology, but not how it is formed, or arrived at. 

[OneLight]

7 hours ago, Davida said:

What are you meaning OneLight? by theology- is your meaning a persons belief in God, their personal relationship to God ? I assume a Christian based theology?  I thought by Christian theology itself is a formal study of the nature of GOD based upon the Bible & historical Christian scholars.  I agree emotions are apart of human life but how does that prove "feelings" form or inform our "theology" - with some perhaps, if that is the filter they put their view & chosen beliefs through. Some people's beliefs about God are formed by their personal preferences too. I don't have a "personal" theology if I did and if it was plausible I might chose to make it a less challenging one for me then what the Bible reveals.  

Feelings, emotions, folk lore, experience and more influence out theology.  We may not place as much value in them as we would scripture and tradition, to mention two other factors in creating our personal theology, but they do play a part, even if it is just a small part.  They influence what how we think, and thinking is required when building theology.

[OneLight]

6 hours ago, shiloh357 said:

Theology isn't personal.  The theology pertaining to the incarnation of Christ isn't personal.  It is universal.  The theology pertaining to the deity of Jesus and the Hypo-static Union is not personal, but universal.  Soteriology, Christology, Hamartiology, Angelology, etc.  are not personal, at all. 

What's personal is the application of theology, not the formation of theology.   We apply it subjectively, we form it objectively.   Our relationship with God is personal.  The theology that governs that relationship isn't personal and it certainly isn't rooted in emotion.   It may impact our emotions, but that is the product of our application of theology, but not how it is formed, or arrived at. 

Yes, scripture is universal, but theology is personal.  Is it possible you are talking about church theology and I am talking about our personal theology we begin making the very first time we really ask ourselves if there is a God?  If it is, than I agree that to church theology cannot be personal.

You misunderstand me if you are implying that I am saying personal theology is rooted in emotions.  It is rooted in God.  Part of our theology includes emotions, but emotions are not the root by far.

By removing the human factor from building a theology, we may as well let our computers build our theology to ensure no emotions are included.  Are you willing to give up your personal theology and let your emotionless computer build one for you?

[OneLight]

6 hours ago, Davida said:

I disagree. If I am studying Math my emotions do not influence the subject matter.

Perhaps I should of clarified personal Christian theology.  There is no relationship with math as we have with God.

[Guest shiloh357]

9 hours ago, OneLight said:

Feelings, emotions, folk lore, experience and more influence out theology. 

No, those things affect or influence how we apply theology.    Those things do not play into how we form theology.

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We may not place as much value in them as we would scripture and tradition, to mention two other factors in creating our personal theology, but they do play a part, even if it is just a small part.  They influence what how we think, and thinking is required when building theology.

Theology is informed by ONE thing.  The Bible.  The Bible is the ONLY source for sound Christian theology.   Anything else including experience, cannot be our source for theology.   Experience is a very, very poor means of arriving at theological viewpoints, because experience isn't an objective uniform unit of measure.  Everyone's experience is different and if we form theology based on experience, then theology becomes incoherent, because experiences and emotions/feelings change over time.  We change as our experiences become more varied later in life.  

[Guest shiloh357]

20 hours ago, OneLight said:

So, your theology is built on Sola Scriptura, eliminating all tradition, history, experience, etc.?

Tradition, history and experience go into how we apply the theology present in the Bible.   The use of history/cultural context, traditions play into how we interpret the Bible and arrive at the understanding the author intended to convey to us.    Our experience only speaks to how theology/doctrine is walked out in our lives.   Those things do not inform the basis of theology.   The application of sound theology will be different for people living in the US than it will be for Christians in China, N. Korea or some other country. 

Sola Scriptura simply means that the Bible is the sole and final arbiter on all matters of Christian faith and practice.

[OneLight]

3 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

No, those things affect or influence how we apply theology.    Those things do not play into how we form theology.

Theology is informed by ONE thing.  The Bible.  The Bible is the ONLY source for sound Christian theology.   Anything else including experience, cannot be our source for theology.   Experience is a very, very poor means of arriving at theological viewpoints, because experience isn't an objective uniform unit of measure.  Everyone's experience is different and if we form theology based on experience, then theology becomes incoherent, because experiences and emotions/feelings change over time.  We change as our experiences become more varied later in life.  

I hear you continue to beat this drum, but I have not seen anywhere in your replies on how you separate your humanity from your decisions.  All of what makes us a person has to be part of how we create our theology.  Are you human, or have I been replying to a bot for the past 9 years?

[Guest shiloh357]

9 hours ago, OneLight said:

Yes, scripture is universal, but theology is personal. 

Incorrect. Scripture and theology are both objective and universal in scope.   Neither is personal.

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Is it possible you are talking about church theology and I am talking about our personal theology we begin making the very first time we really ask ourselves if there is a God?  If it is, than I agree that to church theology cannot be personal.

You're creating a false dichotomy.   Theology is the study of God.  It is an objective study of what the Bible says, not about how we feel about God.   You cannot create that kind of distinction.

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You misunderstand me if you are implying that I am saying personal theology is rooted in emotions.  It is rooted in God.  Part of our theology includes emotions, but emotions are not the root by far.

My point is that theology impacts our emotions.  But our emotions have no part in how good theology is formed.  Theology that is based on emotions at any point will be incoherent because emotions are entirely circumstantial and theology is not.

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By removing the human factor from building a theology, we may as well let our computers build our theology to ensure no emotions are included.  Are you willing to give up your personal theology and let your emotionless computer build one for you?

Not removing the human factor at all in terms of how it is applied.  But Theology isn't at all based on any particular aspect of our humanity.   The Bible was wholly inspired by God and it has no mixture of human wisdom or emotion in it.  That's why we can trust it.  Humanity had nothing to do with the theology contained in the Bible.

That's what Peter meant when he said that no prophecy in Scripture is of "private interpretation."  The word "interpretation" in Greek refers to "opinion."   The Scriptures are not at all the product of any human intelligence, emotional, ideas or impulse.   The Bible is based solely on God's objective transmission of truth to the human writers absent of their emotions, and thus without any mixture of error.   If we start using our humanity as a tool in the formation of theology, we are injecting error into it.

[OneLight]

12 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

No, those things affect or influence how we apply theology.    Those things do not play into how we form theology.

Theology is informed by ONE thing.  The Bible.  The Bible is the ONLY source for sound Christian theology.   Anything else including experience, cannot be our source for theology.   Experience is a very, very poor means of arriving at theological viewpoints, because experience isn't an objective uniform unit of measure.  Everyone's experience is different and if we form theology based on experience, then theology becomes incoherent, because experiences and emotions/feelings change over time.  We change as our experiences become more varied later in life.  

You cannot convince me that my experience with Jesus, when He spoke to me confirming that "I (He) am (is) alive." does not play part of my stage of truth when it comes to how I built my theology.