Think of All the Good They Could Do...

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, MorningGlory said:

Has this become an 'admiring Socialism' thread?  Shall I post the photos from the Venezuelan street riots which are happening TODAY?  Some countries have succeeded with Socialism but they rot from within.  It's simply not sustainable over the long term.

I know Venezuela is a mess. 

[MorningGlory]

2 hours ago, JaniceR said:

I know Venezuela is a mess. 

Oh yes; the people can't get food, gasoline or medical services.  They have one of the world's largest oil reserves and yet are bankrupt. They have disarmed the citizens.  I look for major bloodshed down there and it's the fault of the people themselves for not fighting back against the leftists when Chavez first showed up.  N0w the government there has started seizing foreign companies. 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/venezuelas-opposition-seeks-keep-pressure-maduro-040710504.htmhttps://www.yahoo.com/news/venezuelas-opposition-seeks-keep-pressure-maduro-040710504.html

[nebula]

JaniceR - which country is that you posted pictures of? 

In any event, trying to make America like Sweden or Norway, or whichever nation that is, can never happen. Look at California's economic mess. Look at the conditions or out inner cities. Do European nations have America's "inner city" communities to sustain? 

Sure, it's nice to have government paying for your needs, but it won't be nice to lost more of your income to taxes in order to pay for such things. 

No economic system is perfect, but I have yet to hear a pro-socialism argument that can show with actual figures how a socialist model could be economically feasible or viable here in America.

Again, look at California.

[Guest shiloh357]

On 4/21/2017 at 10:00 AM, Guest-JaniceR said:

More photos from a socialist country....

 

Actually, socialist countries, only those at the top of the food chain, live like that.  You don't get live in homes like that when your paying 50-70% in taxes. 

[Running Gator]

2 hours ago, shiloh357 said:

Actually, socialist countries, only those at the top of the food chain, live like that.  You don't get live in homes like that when your paying 50-70% in taxes. 

How is that any different than capitalistic countries, only the top of the food chain live like that in this country.

Then those on the other end live like this...

 

[Guest shiloh357]

1 minute ago, Running Gator said:

How is that any different than capitalistic countries, only the top of the food chain live like that in this country.

Then those on the other end live like this...

 

No, that is not true.  In socialist countries, the "top of the food chain"  is those in government.   Everyone else is equally poor.  

That is not true in capitalism.  If you are poor in capitalism, it's because you choose to be.

[Running Gator]

19 minutes ago, shiloh357 said:

That is not true in capitalism.  If you are poor in capitalism, it's because you choose to be.

While that is the party line, it simply is not true.  The US has a much worse social mobility rate than Denmark, Sweden, Norway, France, and Finland.

Out of all those counties the poor in this country have by far the worst chance of getting out of being poor. So, while there are some nice anecdotal stories about people who manage to do so, they are the exception to the rule.   Capitalism does not favor the poor, it hampers them.  That is why the US has the lowest social mobility rating and the biggest income disparity. 

I am not saying we need to become socialist, just presenting the facts.

[Guest shiloh357]

Just now, Running Gator said:

While that is the party line, it simply is not true.  The US has a much worse social mobility rate than Denmark, Sweden, Norway, France, and Finland.

Out of all those counties the poor in this country have by far the worst chance of getting out of being poor. So, while there are some nice anecdotal stories about people who manage to do so, they are the exception to the rule.   Capitalism does not favor the poor, it hampers them.  That is why the US has the lowest social mobility rating and the biggest income disparity. 

I am not saying we need to become socialist, just presenting the facts.

When I was 19, I caused a fender bender and ended up having to serve 40 hours of community service and most of it was doing busy work cleaning around at the local DFS and I watched plenty of abled-bodied people taking out food stamps and other financial assistance.   They were not mentally disabled, or physically disabled.  They were/are just lazy.

We have an entire homeless community in my city that prefers homelessness.  They live in tent cities and spend their days gaming the system and afflict us at every major intersection standing around trying to look as pathetic as they can with their cardboard signs.   They don't want help, they just want money that they can spend on pot and booze.

The police tell us not to give them money because many of them choose homelessness because they are sex offenders and can't get an apartment or a job without having to first having their name on the local sex offender registry.   These not people being kept down by the system.

Capitalism does not hamper anyone; laziness and lack of ambition does, though.  Capitalism doesn't guarantee that everyone will be "rich"  but it does provide enough opportunity that anyone who is willing to work and learn skills can prosper.   Financial aid is being handed out like candy at parade and a friend of mine, his son just got out of welding school last year and has a job in the field pulling in over $3000 a month after taxes.  

Work and opportunity are there for anyone willing to do what needs to be done get it.  

[MorningGlory]

5 hours ago, shiloh357 said:

When I was 19, I caused a fender bender and ended up having to serve 40 hours of community service and most of it was doing busy work cleaning around at the local DFS and I watched plenty of abled-bodied people taking out food stamps and other financial assistance.   They were not mentally disabled, or physically disabled.  They were/are just lazy.

We have an entire homeless community in my city that prefers homelessness.  They live in tent cities and spend their days gaming the system and afflict us at every major intersection standing around trying to look as pathetic as they can with their cardboard signs.   They don't want help, they just want money that they can spend on pot and booze.

The police tell us not to give them money because many of them choose homelessness because they are sex offenders and can't get an apartment or a job without having to first having their name on the local sex offender registry.   These not people being kept down by the system.

Capitalism does not hamper anyone; laziness and lack of ambition does, though.  Capitalism doesn't guarantee that everyone will be "rich"  but it does provide enough opportunity that anyone who is willing to work and learn skills can prosper.   Financial aid is being handed out like candy at parade and a friend of mine, his son just got out of welding school last year and has a job in the field pulling in over $3000 a month after taxes.  

Work and opportunity are there for anyone willing to do what needs to be done get it.  

I agree 100%; anyone who wants to succeed in the U.S. can absolutely do that.  Our entitlements are too generous; if they were cut back to only elderly, disabled and mothers with children under five we would see a LOT of people would have to go to work.  I don't buy that there are no jobs; there were 66,000 listed this morning on LinkedIn; and that was just in Houston. 

[Running Gator]

52 minutes ago, MorningGlory said:

I agree 100%; anyone who wants to succeed in the U.S. can absolutely do that.  Our entitlements are too generous; if they were cut back to only elderly, disabled and mothers with children under five we would see a LOT of people would have to go to work.  I don't buy that there are no jobs; there were 66,000 listed this morning on LinkedIn; and that was just in Houston. 

LinkedIn is not a good gauge.  

Most of the jobs listed there do not exist or are not really open. Companies keep jobs on there 100% of the time to keep the resumes flowing in. 

I spent a little time working as a Tech recruiter and was told that only roughly 15 to 20 percent that are advertised today are for actual postions that they are really trying to fill