Do You Really Love The Sinner Hate The Sin

[LadyKay]

11 minutes ago, Davida said:

Then you would have to call the word of God legalism. 

Not the Word. But they way some of you are using it. 

[LadyKay]

56 minutes ago, Yowm said:

Which Christians befriended Paul before his conversion? Yet that didn't stop Paul from receiving Jesus.

I don't think this is a very good example. Saul before becoming Paul wanted to have Christians put to death. I would say that even I myself would find it hard to befriend someone who wanted me put to death.  

[LadyKay]

2 minutes ago, Davida said:

Some prefer to ignore the scripture that cramps their style. That is called cherry-picking, it's how some Christians support many things that God opposes. 

Say whatever you like about me. But I know where my heart lies. ?

[LadyKay]

4 minutes ago, maryjayne said:

I think the problem with this thread is simply one of what definition each poster is using for friendship. 

I think you are right.  

[LadyKay]

5 minutes ago, Davida said:

I was not speaking about you .

If your conscience gets pricked it has nothing to do with me. 

Well sorry. But when someone quotes me I think they are talking about me. 

[LadyKay]

10 minutes ago, Yowm said:

The point speaks against the necessity of friendship evangelism to see converts.

I don't think friendship is necessary for leading one to Christ. But I also think that a friendship can and has been used by God to lead one to Christ.  

[warrior12]

13 minutes ago, naominash said:

Did I hurt my witness or help it or neither?

Witnessing takes courage and perseverance and also to be prudent .  Not every situation and geographical places would be the same. In the modern countries with the western style of governance, it is easier to approach people and have decent conversations.  In other places like the middle east and underdeveloped places, communication I would suppose would be less restricted and maybe a different approach would have to be employed.  Plainly, some places where the majority is of one religion, then it is more difficult to witness as we know it in the west.   The  bible says, we are to be wise as serpents and gentle as doves.  How each apply his methods and with the guide of the helper, then witnessing will be of his choice.    Some go to bars ect., but I can never see myself going into those places as from experience I know it is not a place where men gather to hear the gospel.  Open air street preaching is a different situation that the hearer can be more receptive and can stop at his will to listen.

Sometimes and depending on the situation, witnessing requires a boldness that is without being fearful of persecution.  The Holy spirit I believe would lead as the event goes.

Matthew 10 King James Version (KJV)

¹⁶ Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves.

[Guest shiloh357]

1 hour ago, Badjao33 said:

Isn't this what some are doing to justify their position to not take unbelievers as friends? How many verses have been used in this thread in support of that position? Two or three out of 23,000+? There are far more verses in the Bible that give us reasons to befriend unbelievers than their are against doing so. 

No, there isn't.   All the Bible teaches is that we are not to avoid them or shun them.  It doesn't teach or give any reasons to be friends with them.

[Guest shiloh357]

2 hours ago, Badjao33 said:

But it's the same exact word Jesus uses to describe us.  The definition of friend is pretty straight forward and would have the same meaning throughout the New Testament regardless of the context.

You are confusing meaning based on definition vs. meaning based on usage and usage trumps definitions and that is why context is far more important.   The word "love" is used differently in different places in the NT.  The word "law" is used 5 different ways.   The word "saved" is also used five different ways in the NT.   There are at least two different ways the word "justification" is used in the NT.    And the word "atonement" is used  is used differently in the OT.

Greek and Hebrew are extremely nuanced languages and it is wrong to take a word that is used to mean one thing in one verse and then just plug that meaning into the word in other places.  That's simply not how it works. 

Secondly, it is pretty sloppy to take verses that are not espousing a doctrine that are pretty much a historical narrative and try to create a doctrine out of them.   

 

[Guest shiloh357]

33 minutes ago, Badjao33 said:

Can you provide these verses so we can compare how the words are used in each? 

I don't need to.   John 15: 14 is in a very intimate context.   Jesus is getting just about as personal as He can with His disciples.  These are among his last teachings to them and He is talking about abiding in them and they abiding in Him.   And the use of "friend" in THIS context is very, very intimate.  It is like that of brotherhood.  It is more than simply being a companion.  There is heart to heart discourse that Jesus is giving them.  

That is entirely different than how the word is used in Acts 19:31.  That simply refers to aristocrats who were friendly to Paul, there might have been a nominal friendship, and so they were favorably disposed to him.   But that is not the same thing as what is being described in John 15:4 when it comes to being Jesus' friend.   

And above all of that, note that Jesus places obedience as an evidence that they are his friends.  If they are His friends, they will keep His commandments.  And in that context, the recipients were not unbelievers, but were believers, as Jesus waited until after Judas left the upper room in order to get personal with his disciples.

So to  say that the same word is used the same way is to ignore the context and to employ some very sloppy hermeneutics.