The Seven Heads of Daniel 7 and Rev. 17

[abcdef]

17 minutes ago, iamlamad said:

Perhaps he Ezekiel 38 war will come before Armageddon. I agree, it is not going to be long until all prophecy is fulfilled. 
I wonder if the world will call Armageddon as World War 3? Or will WW 3 come first?

The Ezek 38 war is history. They fight with bows and arrows, spears, etc..

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All the details of the events, politically, are not given. But some insights to Israel's situation are.

The idea is to find the same events that are shown or indicated to have happened, in different places and put them together.

The restoration of Israel to Jerusalem for example.

-----

Or where the dragon/beast is shown coming out of the abyss, 3 places, Rev 9:1-11 (5th trumpet), Rev 16:10-11 (5th vial), Rev 20:7 Satan/dragon is released from the abyss.

Try putting these 3 scriptures together. Then glean the details from each one into to one event. 

Satan, the dragon with 7 /8 heads, Rev 12:3, Rev 17:7, Roman nation sea beast, returns into existence when he sits on the seat of the beast again.

This happened in 1929 when the Vatican returned home to Rome, in the exact same spot that the Caesars were 2000 years ago.

When the Vatican took it's place among the nations again, then the beast nation had returned to his throne again.

Notice how this event took place not long before Jerusalem was restored to Israel, not a coincidence, but the fulfillment of prophecy before us. 

In 1929 the spirits from the 5th trumpet began to swarm across the planet attacking and killing all the flesh of Israel and the kingdom in an attempt to wipe out Israel from the planet.

The attempt failed again because Israel was still dispersed into the gentile nations.

But now that Israel is restored to Jerusalem and returned from the gentile nations, Satan/dragon nation with ten heads will surround Jerusalem.

When Jerusalem falls this time, .....then the fire from heaven.

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[Sister]

7 hours ago, abcdef said:

Why do you believe that Rev 18 is the place where this happens? It shows the fall of "Babylon" but that is not the end of lust and pride etc. for all of mankind.

Because everything that man has lusted after has been destroyed.  When Babylon is destroyed, there is nothing left.  See how the merchants and the kings, and the people of the earth are wailing.  They cannot continue in their lusts because the end has come for them.  They are left with absolutely nothing but the clothes on their back.  Their pride will fall because this world has carried them the whole time and has fed their lusts.  All be taken from them.

 

Quote

 

Even in the following chapter 19, where the beast is defeated, in v. 21 it says that there is a remnant of the beast that remains to be defeated with the gospel sword.

In ch 20 it shows the pride and arrogance of Magog attacking Jerusalem.

So how is Rev 18 the end of all lust and pride?

 

 Revelation 19:20   And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

  Revelation 19:21   And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

In Rev 18, we saw the material side of the world being taken away.  This will happen first before the beast and FP are thrown into the lake of fire, and before Christ strikes at the 7th trumpet.  This is part of the torment on Babylon, to see all the things made with man's hands, which have been worshiped gone before their very eyes.  Babylon's gods are not just religious idols, but their idols are the material things they have lusted after and possessed.  Anything that can be made or purchased. The goods and nice things we have lusted over is the pride of life.  Showing to others what we have achieved, and thinking ourselves worthy to have all these things.  Indulging in all the goodly and delicate things this world has to offer.  All will be gone, and all will have nothing.  Nothing to show their labours. 

Christians are still in Babylon which is why the Lord is calling us to come out of her.  All her goods are going to be destroyed.  Why hold on to it, when it's going to be destroyed?  The material world is the downfall of man, and all the pleasures that came out of it.  Why lose our soul to save something that is going to be destroyed?

Now to know how Babylon is going to be destroyed is another topic, but it will happen at the 6th angel stage, close to the end.  God is going to send in the Mede's to do this.....after the FP declares he is god just when he's just killed the two witnesses...... When that abomination that makes desolate is completed and fulfilled, there is another surprise coming upon the whole earth, another desolation.

 

 

 

 

 

[SisterWells]

45 minutes ago, Sister said:

abcdef

Because in those scriptures I quoted, none of them have been fulfilled yet.

This is how the truth is given, and this is how it's found, precept upon precept, line upon line, a little here and a little there.  Seek and ye shall find. 

Deut 18:20-22, But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the Lord hath not spoken? When a prophet speaketh in the name of the Lord, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the Lord hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.

So how long does the prophet get for his words to come to pass? 200 years, 2000 years? How could the prophet be put to death if he is predicting events that would happen hundreds or thousands of years later?

[Sister]

1 hour ago, SisterWells said:

Deut 18:20-22, But the prophet, which shall presume to speak a word in my name, which I have not commanded him to speak, or that shall speak in the name of other gods, even that prophet shall die. And if thou say in thine heart, How shall we know the word which the Lord hath not spoken? When a prophet speaketh in the name of the Lord, if the thing follow not, nor come to pass, that is the thing which the Lord hath not spoken, but the prophet hath spoken it presumptuously: thou shalt not be afraid of him.

So how long does the prophet get for his words to come to pass? 200 years, 2000 years? How could the prophet be put to death if he is predicting events that would happen hundreds or thousands of years later?

Hello SisterWells

Good question there.

We know who God's prophets are for their names have been given to us in the scriptures.  We hear them, for they are chosen of God to give the message. 

The last prophet was John who wrote the book of Revelation, and we need not look for more prophets, but await the two witnesses, who came before and who will return.  Enoch and Elijah.  Chosen by God, and preserved for this purpose to be given power to send as many plagues as they will on all the children of disobedience and rebellion.  These are the only two prophets taken up into the heavens in a chariot and the only two men who have not tasted death...yet....but they will.

Gods Word is a living Word.  Even though prophets die, God's Word never dies and is alive today just as it was 2000 years ago.  He sent his prophets rising 'early', declaring the Word of God and all his warnings way in advance, to give Israel and later the gentiles plenty of time to hear, and The Lord God knows in the beginning what the end shall be.

So, we don't kill today.  If a false prophet is found amongst us, or any prophet other than the two mentioned above, we shall know from what he speaks whether he speaks the truth or a lie.  To discern this we must know the truth first, and be familiar with what the Word of God has spoken already to compare. If not, we can be easily deceived as they are sent to tickle our ears.  I can expect 100% will speak lies, other than the two witnesses. 

We who know our scriptures already know the events to come, and in which order, and when, for the Lamb of God has fed us not in visions or dreams, or through doctrines of men, but directly through the Word of God, which was written and recorded for us as a witness, and to feed on just as the Lamb promised.

 

[SisterWells]

Oh

[abcdef]

On 7/6/2020 at 3:59 AM, Sister said:

Isaiah 45:13   I have raised him up in righteousness, and I will direct all his ways: he shall build my city, and he shall let go my captives, not for price nor reward, saith the LORD of hosts.

Isaiah 45:14   Thus saith the LORD, The labour of Egypt, and merchandise of Ethiopia and of the Sabeans, men of stature, shall come over unto thee, and they shall be thine: they shall come after thee; in chains they shall come over, and they shall fall down unto thee, they shall make supplication unto thee, saying, Surely God is in thee; and there is none else, there is no God.

 

 Revelation 11:15   And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

 

Isaiah 60:3   And the Gentiles shall come to thy light, and kings to the brightness of thy rising.

Isaiah 60:4   Lift up thine eyes round about, and see: all they gather themselves together, they come to thee: thy sons shall come from far, and thy daughters shall be nursed at thy side.

Isaiah 60:5   Then thou shalt see, and flow together, and thine heart shall fear, and be enlarged; because the abundance of the sea shall be converted unto thee, the forces of the Gentiles shall come unto thee.

Isaiah 60:6   The multitude of camels shall cover thee, the dromedaries of Midian and Ephah; all they from Sheba shall come: they shall bring gold and incense; and they shall shew forth the praises of the LORD.

Isaiah 60:7   All the flocks of Kedar shall be gathered together unto thee, the rams of Nebaioth shall minister unto thee: they shall come up with acceptance on mine altar, and I will glorify the house of my glory.

Isaiah 60:8   Who are these that fly as a cloud, and as the doves to their windows?

Who are they?

Isaiah 60:9   Surely the isles shall wait for me, and the ships of Tarshish first, to bring thy sons from far, their silver and their gold with them, unto the name of the LORD thy God, and to the Holy One of Israel, because he hath glorified thee.

Isaiah 60:10   And the sons of strangers shall build up thy walls, and their kings shall minister unto thee: for in my wrath I smote thee, but in my favour have I had mercy on thee.

Isaiah 60:11   Therefore thy gates shall be open continually; they shall not be shut day nor night; that men may bring unto thee the forces of the Gentiles, and that their kings may be brought.

Isaiah 60:12   For the nation and kingdom that will not serve thee shall perish; yea, those nations shall be utterly wasted.

Isaiah 60:13   The glory of Lebanon shall come unto thee, the fir tree, the pine tree, and the box together, to beautify the place of my sanctuary; and I will make the place of my feet glorious.

Isaiah 60:14   The sons also of them that afflicted thee shall come bending unto thee; and all they that despised thee shall bow themselves down at the soles of thy feet; and they shall call thee, The city of the LORD, The Zion of the Holy One of Israel.

 Isaiah 60:15   Whereas thou hast been forsaken and hated, so that no man went through thee, I will make thee an eternal excellency, a joy of many generations.

 Isaiah 60:16   Thou shalt also suck the milk of the Gentiles, and shalt suck the breast of kings: and thou shalt know that I the LORD am thy Saviour and thy Redeemer, the mighty One of Jacob.

 Isaiah 60:17   For brass I will bring gold, and for iron I will bring silver, and for wood brass, and for stones iron: I will also make thy officers peace, and thine exactors righteousness.

Isaiah 60:18   Violence shall no more be heard in thy land, wasting nor destruction within thy borders; but thou shalt call thy walls Salvation, and thy gates Praise.

Isaiah 60:19   The sun shall be no more thy light by day; neither for brightness shall the moon give light unto thee: but the LORD shall be unto thee an everlasting light, and thy God thy glory.

Isaiah 60:20   Thy sun shall no more go down; neither shall thy moon withdraw itself: for the LORD shall be thine everlasting light, and the days of thy mourning shall be ended.

Isaiah 60:21   Thy people also shall be all righteous: they shall inherit the land for ever, the branch of my planting, the work of my hands, that I may be glorified.

Isaiah 60:22   A little one shall become a thousand, and a small one a strong nation: I the LORD will hasten it in his time.

 

Sister,

The time frame for this prophecy is shown in Isaiah 60:19-20.

This prophecy is fulfilled in Rev 21:23, well after the millennium period.

This makes the events shown as symbolism of that time.

They are speaking to the people of that time, in a way that they can understand, about the eternal promises of God.

Understand that these symbols are not necessarily literal, but can be.

-------------------

The promises concern the kingdom/church and the new covenant.

Don't look for any material kingdom on planet earth, because Jesus said that His kingdom is a spiritual one.

The key to understanding this text is the love and devotion that souls feel towards Jesus and His spiritual kingdom/church/Israel in the spirit/love.

This shows the time when gentiles have entered in to the spiritual kingdom/church/covenant/relationship with Jesus and God, not long after Pentecost, say 3 yrs or so.

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Paul said in Heb 12:18-29, 22, "But ye are come unto Mount Sion, ........, the heavenly Jerusalem,"

When Paul say that you have come, it is not future, he is saying to the Hebrews of that time that they are already in the presence of God, in the new covenant relationship.

We also stand before Mount Sion and the new Jerusalem just as Paul did at the time of his writings.

So when these prophecies in Isaiah were written it is showing this spiritual side of the kingdom/church/new covenant, it is the relationship, the spirit of the material that is to be understood.

Jesus is called a lion and a lamb, He is neither one in a literal context, but symbolically He was both.

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See v 17? Is it material wealth that Jesus wants in the new covenant? Or souls?

 

  

 

[iamlamad]

13 hours ago, abcdef said:

The Ezek 38 war is history. They fight with bows and arrows, spears, etc..

---------------------

All the details of the events, politically, are not given. But some insights to Israel's situation are.

The idea is to find the same events that are shown or indicated to have happened, in different places and put them together.

The restoration of Israel to Jerusalem for example.

-----

Or where the dragon/beast is shown coming out of the abyss, 3 places, Rev 9:1-11 (5th trumpet), Rev 16:10-11 (5th vial), Rev 20:7 Satan/dragon is released from the abyss.

Try putting these 3 scriptures together. Then glean the details from each one into to one event. 

Satan, the dragon with 7 /8 heads, Rev 12:3, Rev 17:7, Roman nation sea beast, returns into existence when he sits on the seat of the beast again.

This happened in 1929 when the Vatican returned home to Rome, in the exact same spot that the Caesars were 2000 years ago.

When the Vatican took it's place among the nations again, then the beast nation had returned to his throne again.

Notice how this event took place not long before Jerusalem was restored to Israel, not a coincidence, but the fulfillment of prophecy before us. 

In 1929 the spirits from the 5th trumpet began to swarm across the planet attacking and killing all the flesh of Israel and the kingdom in an attempt to wipe out Israel from the planet.

The attempt failed again because Israel was still dispersed into the gentile nations.

But now that Israel is restored to Jerusalem and returned from the gentile nations, Satan/dragon nation with ten heads will surround Jerusalem.

When Jerusalem falls this time, .....then the fire from heaven.

--------

 

 The Ezek 38 war is history.  Wow! You believe that, while the Evangelical Christian world believes it is future.  Are you sure about the bows and spears?

 

Or where the dragon/beast is shown coming out of the abyss, 3 places, Rev 9:1-11 (5th trumpet), Rev 16:10-11 (5th vial), Rev 20:7 Satan/dragon is released from the abyss.

Try putting these 3 scriptures together. Then glean the details from each one into to one event.  Sorry, it does not work that way. it ignores TIME and TIMING.

Rev 9:1-11 (5th trumpet) This trumpet will sound in the first half of the future 70th week of Daniel - WAY before the 1000 years. 

Rev 16:10-11 (5th vial) This vial will be poured out late in the last half of the future 70th week. Before the 1000 years. 

Rev 20:7 Satan/dragon is released from the abyss. This will be after the 1000 year reign of Christ.

In other words, they could have the exact description (which they don't) and because of time could not be the same event. 

The idea is to find the same events that are shown or indicated to have happened, in different places and put them together. A much better idea would be:  to discover John's chronology so you will know what events happen when.

I believe most Evangelical believers today would say the rest of your post is myth. 

[Sister]

32 minutes ago, abcdef said:

Sister,

The time frame for this prophecy is shown in Isaiah 60:19-20.

This prophecy is fulfilled in Rev 21:23, well after the millennium period.

This makes the events shown as symbolism of that time.

They are speaking to the people of that time, in a way that they can understand, about the eternal promises of God.

Understand that these symbols are not necessarily literal, but can be.

-------------------

Greetings abcdef

I know you are trying very hard not to believe all this, but one day if the Lord permit you will see.

Isaiah 60:19   The sun shall be no more thy light by day; neither for brightness shall the moon give light unto thee: but the LORD shall be unto thee an everlasting light, and thy God thy glory.

Isaiah 60:20   Thy sun shall no more go down; neither shall thy moon withdraw itself: for the LORD shall be thine everlasting light, and the days of thy mourning shall be ended.

 

The physical sun will still be there during the thousand years, and the moon.  He is speaking about the spiritual light, the same light Jesus gave us.  We need the physical sun to see where we are going in the day, and the moon gives light in the night so we can also see, but that's not the light that gives us salvation, only the light that can come from God, when it shines on us, it gives us understanding.

Verse 20 is a repeat and interpretation of what he already said in verse 19.  That this type of light is the light that comes from God when he opens our eyes.  God is speaking in the spirit here.

 

 

[Sister]

57 minutes ago, abcdef said:

The promises concern the kingdom/church and the new covenant.

Don't look for any material kingdom on planet earth, because Jesus said that His kingdom is a spiritual one.

The key to understanding this text is the love and devotion that souls feel towards Jesus and His spiritual kingdom/church/Israel in the spirit/love.

This shows the time when gentiles have entered in to the spiritual kingdom/church/covenant/relationship with Jesus and God, not long after Pentecost, say 3 yrs or so.

 

Jesus will set up his throne in Jerusalem.  It is not heaven yet, because there is still flesh living in that kingdom, and also those living outside. Flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom, so they have not inherited yet, but are saints in training.  Only those who took part in the resurrection have already inherited, but the rest are only 'dwelling' there in their flesh bodies, learning to worship in the spirit. 

Only after the 2nd resurrection will all who made it - be spirit and our whole world will be spirit.  All the carnal things will be gone.  We do not go to heaven, but heaven comes down to us.

'Thy kingdom come, thy will be done, on earth, as.... it is in heaven.

You need to read Isaiah chapter 60 again and really go over it to see if this has been fulfilled?  Then go to Revelation 20 again and be reminded that Satan will be locked up for a thousand years so that he doesn't deceive the nations again until that thousand years is up.  Surely something we have not experienced yet is coming?   What is going to happen during this time?  Well these are the scriptures I am giving you to look up to decide for yourself.  Pray for light my friend.

 

 

[Sister]

1 hour ago, abcdef said:

Paul said in Heb 12:18-29, 22, "But ye are come unto Mount Sion, ........, the heavenly Jerusalem,"

When Paul say that you have come, it is not future, he is saying to the Hebrews of that time that they are already in the presence of God, in the new covenant relationship.

We also stand before Mount Sion and the new Jerusalem just as Paul did at the time of his writings.

So when these prophecies in Isaiah were written it is showing this spiritual side of the kingdom/church/new covenant, it is the relationship, the spirit of the material that is to be understood.

Jesus is called a lion and a lamb, He is neither one in a literal context, but symbolically He was both.

That's right, we are dwelling in Mt Zion now serving the Lord....but the city is not manifested yet because many are still in unbelief.  They don't believe that this city of righteousness exists.  When Jesus comes he will manifest his city, so that all can see who is living in the light.  That city of Jerusalem will be the world's headquarters.  The nations will come in and learn the ways of the Lord.  Israel's job now is to do the preaching.  They will be preaching Christ, the Kingdom of our Lord to all the nations.  They are put in charge of this now.  They will be respected because all will know that the Lord is with them.  That city is full of blessings where nothing will hurt nor destroy.  Everything in there is physical.  They still eat, they drink, they sleep, they have cattle, they grow food, and all the gold and silver is stored there. All the judges and counselors are in that city.   What many are expecting is angels flying everywhere,  harps playing?  A place that is fully spirit like heaven?  No. God's city on earth is all about his laws, holiness, and righteous judgment.  It is about order, and obedience, not chaos, but well organised full of justice, peace and knowledge of the Lord.  The spirit of the Lord is in there, and in the hearts of his new converts, and anyone else who wish to learn and worship the Lord, may come in and take part of the protection and blessings and work their way towards being a part in the second resurrection.

abcdef, keep asking questions, because it only brings out more truth.