WHO IS THE WILD OLIVE TREE ?

[douge]

Who is the wild olive tree grafted into the good tree?
Is it Gentiles today in the church, body of Christ ?

Romans 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.

God is not done with unbelieving Israel.

Romans 11:5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

The remnant is composed of believing Jews and Gentiles. God has always made provision for the Gentiles to be saved through Israel.

11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

The election, the Jewish and Gentile believing remnant, has obtained to righteousness by grace through faith. Unbelieving Israel has been blinded.

11:11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.

Israel fell because of their rejection of Jesus as Christ, the Son of God. Beginning with the earthly ministry of Jesus Israel had to believe on the name of Jesus, that he is the Messiah, the Son of God, to be justified unto eternal life (John 8:24 Acts 2:36)). Jesus shed his blood and died for the remission of sins under the first testament (Matthew 26:28 Hebrews 9:15). Jesus died to put in force the new testament for Israel (Hebrews 9:17). Only the believing remnant of Jews received Jesus for the new testament promise of salvation. Gentiles also believed. Through the fall of Israel, salvation came to the Gentiles to provoke unbelieving Israel to jealousy in order to save them.

Romans 10:19 But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.

Israel, as can be seen in the above verse, would be provoked to jealousy by a foolish nation who are not a people (Deuteronomy 32:21); this foolish nation is believing Israel; the people who were not a people, but called the children of God, the people of God (Hosea 1:10 Hosea 2:23 1 Peter 2:9-10).

Romans 11:12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?

Israel's fulness is when Israel obtains all the promises and purpose of God.

11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

11:14 If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them.

11:15 For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?

Paul, in the book of Romans is addressing three existing groups:

1 Unbelieving Jews and Gentiles.

2 Jews and Gentiles in the body of Christ who believed the gospel of Christ as preached by Paul.

3 Jew and Gentile new testament saints who are in Christ by believing on the name of Jesus; believing Jesus is Lord and Christ. They believed Jesus died and rose again to fulfill the new covenant promised Israel in Jeremiah 31:31. They also believed the gospel of the kingdom, in which, Christ will come again to rule and reign with Israel on earth.

In Romans 11:13 Paul is speaking to Gentile new testament saints. Paul is speaking to the new testament Gentiles, not Gentiles in the church, the body of Christ, who believed Paul's gospel. Paul by any means would provoke them which are of his flesh, the unbelieving Jews, to salvation.

Romans 1:6 Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ:

1:7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

In verses 6 and 7 above, those called are Jews or Gentiles called into the body of Christ, and Jews or Gentiles called into the kingdom through the new testament (1 Corinthians 1:2 1:24 7:18).

Romans 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

9:25 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Verses 24 and 25 above refers to the holy nation, the little flock (Luke 12:32), the believing remnant. According to verse 24 the believing Gentiles are also of those whom he has "called".

Romans 10:12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

Paul, in the verse above is alluding to Psalm 145:9 and Psalm 145:18 below:

Psalm 145:9 The LORD is good to all: and his tender mercies are over all his works.

Psalm 145:18 The LORD is nigh unto all them that call upon him, to all that call upon him in truth.

Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

In the next verse above, Paul is mentioning Joel 2:32 below:

Joel 2:32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call.

In verses 12 and 13 of Romans above, it is both Jew and Gentile who make up the election of grace who call upon the name of the Lord; both Jews and Gentiles who believed on the name of Jesus by the preaching of Peter and the apostles.

Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved includes both Jew and Gentile in the remnant of believing Israel, not the body of Christ.

The Gentiles in Romans 11:13 are Gentile new testament saints, not the Gentiles in the church, the body of Christ.

11:17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

In verse 17 above, "thou being a wild olive tree" is the Gentile new testament saints, part of the election of grace. The remnant of Gentile new testament believers is the wild olive tree, grafted among the fruitfull branches of the believing Jews, the good olive tree. The broken off branches are unbelieving Israel.

It would not stand to reason to consider Gentiles in the body of Christ the "wild olive tree" because the body of Christ consists of both Jews and Gentiles. The Jews in the body could not be considered to be a "wild olive tree", but rather the natural olive tree; also, in the body there is neither Jew or Gentile (Galatians 3:28).

It can be seen from John 15 below that the broken off branches refers to unfruitful, unbelieving Israel.

John 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

In Matthew below, the kingdom will be taken from unbelieving Israel and given to the fruitful nation of Israel. They are not all Israel, which are of Israel, it is only the believing, promised seed (Romans 9:6).

Matthew 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

Romans 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

The election of grace, the remnant, would also be cut off if they fell into unbelief. They would not enter the promised Davidic kingdom.

11:23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.

11:24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?

The remnant of new testament Gentiles were cut out of a wild olive tree and grafted into the good olive tree of believing Israel: so unbelieving Israel would be grafted back into their own good olive tree if they repented and believed.

11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

Israel will be restored when the fulness of the Gentiles comes in; that is when the Gentiles, which would include Gentiles in the body of Christ, have fulfilled their purpose as determined by God. Jesus will come again to bring salvation to Israel.

11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

Jesus will fulfill the New Testament and restore, and bring salvation to Israel.

In conclusion, the wild olive tree is the remnant of believing new testament Gentiles. These Gentiles have, by the preaching of Peter and the apostles, believed on the name of Jesus as the crucified and risen Lord and Christ. These Gentiles have believed in the death, and shed blood of Jesus for the new testament. These Gentiles have believed the gospel of the kingdom; that by his resurrection, he will fulfill the promise of his coming to bring salvation. The Gentiles spoken of are the wild olive tree grafted into the good olive tree; they are part of the election of grace, who along with the little flock, will enter the coming kingdom on earth. These Gentiles are not in the body of Christ.

[Resurrection Priest]

The TREE of Romans Chapter Eleven

The "root is holy".   Every "branch" attached to that TREE draws "nourishment" from "the root". 

[I'll let you read Romans Eleven for yourselves.]

That "root" can be none other than Christ Himself.  This is "life from the vine".  We all draw life from Christ. 

"Branches were broken off for unbelief",   and other (formerly) "wild" branches were "grafted on" to the TREE.  (Like grafting a plum branch into a pear tree.)

 THE TREE REMAINS

Notice - it is an OLIVE TREE. 

Paul has taken an image from Jeremiah.

Jeremiah 11:16 "The LORD called thy name, Green Olive Tree, fair, and of goodly fruit: with the noise of a great tumult he hath kindled fire upon it, and the branches of it are broken." 

Not all the branches were broken off - just some, a fitting image of the Northern Kingdom, "burned with fire".  Some branches were left attached to "the tree", but were not producing much. 

So THE TREE represents ISRAEL.    Branches are "broken off" "for unbelief".   Other branches are "grafted in" because of belief. 

Paul says, "and thus all Israel will be saved".   He means "Israel" - the TREE, not every branch that was ever attached to that tree. 

When the LORD returns, everyone attached to that Olive Tree by faith, drawing nourishment from Christ, will be saved. 

The OLIVE TREE represents redeemed Israel - the people of God - the bride of Christ.  Paul could have said, "thus only Israel will be saved".  It would mean the same thing. 

"Israel" and the redeemed Church (congregation) of God are not two separate peoples.  They are one and the same.  One is either attached to the Tree, drawing life from Christ,  or lost. 

[Leonardo Von]

On 11/25/2019 at 10:53 AM, douge said:

Who is the wild olive tree grafted into the good tree?

The better question is: why those who aren't Israelites are called wild olive tree?

[Anne2]

2 hours ago, Leonardo Von said:

The better question is: why those who aren't Israelites are called wild olive tree?

 Origins make no difference in Christ, the wild olive tree is their origin. One is cut off, another graft in. The tree represents the king and his Kingdom, as  the root of it, is the strength and durability of his kingdom. Imo, we see this in  the book Daniel. We are all branches in it

  

 

 

 

 

[Leonardo Von]

57 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

 Origins make no difference in Christ, the wild olive tree is their origin. One is cut off, another graft in. The tree represents the king and his Kingdom, as  the root of it, is the strength and durability of his kingdom. Imo, we see this in  the book Daniel. We are all branches in it

What I am trying to ask is "why the Israelites is considered "good olive tree" and the non-Israelites, "wild olive tree"?

[Anne2]

37 minutes ago, Leonardo Von said:

What I am trying to ask is "why the Israelites is considered "good olive tree" and the non-Israelites, "wild olive tree"?

My post spoke to neither Israelites, nor non Israelites being the tree! His kingdom is the good olive tree. I think the passage speaks in similar fashion to ephesians, as citizens of the commonwealth.

Eph 2:12  That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:
We had no citizenship in uncircumcision. It is circumcision which is the covenant made with Abraham. In Jesus the Christ we are also the seed of Abraham. It is speaking of the Israel of God IMO. That's how I see it anyway.

Notice: Both Jew and Gentile have access to the household of the saints in Christ Jesus.

Eph 2:17  And came and preached peace to you which were afar off, and to them that were nigh.
18  For through him we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father.
19  Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God;

This imo is going further than mere citizenship in Israel, as we often think of it. But rather God's very household. The tabernacle (or later the temple) Which only the priests (saints) were citizens of. As The sons of aaron, and the entire tribe of Levi could enter. The Israelites were strangers to the household of God.
 

 

[David1701]

1 hour ago, Leonardo Von said:

What I am trying to ask is "why the Israelites is considered "good olive tree" and the non-Israelites, "wild olive tree"?

God formed Israel as his chosen people (good olive tree).  The Gentiles were not his chosen people (wild olive tree).  Whenever a Gentile is saved, he is grafted into spiritual Israel.  In a sense, there is no salvation outside of Israel (spiritual Israel, not the nation).

[David1701]

4 minutes ago, Josheb said:

Amen. May I add to that a little? 

.......Whenever a Gentile is saved, he is grafted into the Israel-of-faith that are the true descendants of Abraham because not all Israel is Israel; the righteous shall live by faith.  In a sense, there is no salvation outside of that Israel. 

 

My regrets if that not amenable. I've always had a hitch about the term "spiritual Israel," preferring instead to stick to the language of scripture as much as possible. Bloodline, geo-political nation-state Israel is soteriologically worthless. No matter the salvation (temporal or eternal) it is always by grace and it is always God who initiates the choosing. God created the seed from which the olive tree would grow, He made the tree what it is, bore the fruit He wishes it to bear, and does what he wants with its branches. 

What you have posted is exactly what I was referring to. 

I have never been very good at giving all my working (my maths teachers used to complain that I would just give the answer to a question, without showing how I reached it).  Some people say too much, but I tend to say too little.  This is one example of why we all need each other...

Edited October 10, 2021 by David1701

[Your closest friendnt]

On 11/25/2019 at 8:53 AM, douge said:

Who is the wild olive tree grafted into the good tree?
Is it Gentiles today in the church, body of Christ ?

Romans 11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.

God is not done with unbelieving Israel.

Romans 11:5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.

The remnant is composed of believing Jews and Gentiles. God has always made provision for the Gentiles to be saved through Israel.

11:7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded.

The election, the Jewish and Gentile believing remnant, has obtained to righteousness by grace through faith. Unbelieving Israel has been blinded.

11:11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.

Israel fell because of their rejection of Jesus as Christ, the Son of God. Beginning with the earthly ministry of Jesus Israel had to believe on the name of Jesus, that he is the Messiah, the Son of God, to be justified unto eternal life (John 8:24 Acts 2:36)). Jesus shed his blood and died for the remission of sins under the first testament (Matthew 26:28 Hebrews 9:15). Jesus died to put in force the new testament for Israel (Hebrews 9:17). Only the believing remnant of Jews received Jesus for the new testament promise of salvation. Gentiles also believed. Through the fall of Israel, salvation came to the Gentiles to provoke unbelieving Israel to jealousy in order to save them.

Romans 10:19 But I say, Did not Israel know? First Moses saith, I will provoke you to jealousy by them that are no people, and by a foolish nation I will anger you.

Israel, as can be seen in the above verse, would be provoked to jealousy by a foolish nation who are not a people (Deuteronomy 32:21); this foolish nation is believing Israel; the people who were not a people, but called the children of God, the people of God (Hosea 1:10 Hosea 2:23 1 Peter 2:9-10).

Romans 11:12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?

Israel's fulness is when Israel obtains all the promises and purpose of God.

11:13 For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles, I magnify mine office:

11:14 If by any means I may provoke to emulation them which are my flesh, and might save some of them.

11:15 For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?

Paul, in the book of Romans is addressing three existing groups:

1 Unbelieving Jews and Gentiles.

2 Jews and Gentiles in the body of Christ who believed the gospel of Christ as preached by Paul.

3 Jew and Gentile new testament saints who are in Christ by believing on the name of Jesus; believing Jesus is Lord and Christ. They believed Jesus died and rose again to fulfill the new covenant promised Israel in Jeremiah 31:31. They also believed the gospel of the kingdom, in which, Christ will come again to rule and reign with Israel on earth.

In Romans 11:13 Paul is speaking to Gentile new testament saints. Paul is speaking to the new testament Gentiles, not Gentiles in the church, the body of Christ, who believed Paul's gospel. Paul by any means would provoke them which are of his flesh, the unbelieving Jews, to salvation.

Romans 1:6 Among whom are ye also the called of Jesus Christ:

1:7 To all that be in Rome, beloved of God, called to be saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.

In verses 6 and 7 above, those called are Jews or Gentiles called into the body of Christ, and Jews or Gentiles called into the kingdom through the new testament (1 Corinthians 1:2 1:24 7:18).

Romans 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

9:25 As he saith also in Osee, I will call them my people, which were not my people; and her beloved, which was not beloved.

Verses 24 and 25 above refers to the holy nation, the little flock (Luke 12:32), the believing remnant. According to verse 24 the believing Gentiles are also of those whom he has "called".

Romans 10:12 For there is no difference between the Jew and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him.

Paul, in the verse above is alluding to Psalm 145:9 and Psalm 145:18 below:

Psalm 145:9 The LORD is good to all: and his tender mercies are over all his works.

Psalm 145:18 The LORD is nigh unto all them that call upon him, to all that call upon him in truth.

Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

In the next verse above, Paul is mentioning Joel 2:32 below:

Joel 2:32 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the LORD shall be delivered: for in mount Zion and in Jerusalem shall be deliverance, as the LORD hath said, and in the remnant whom the LORD shall call.

In verses 12 and 13 of Romans above, it is both Jew and Gentile who make up the election of grace who call upon the name of the Lord; both Jews and Gentiles who believed on the name of Jesus by the preaching of Peter and the apostles.

Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved includes both Jew and Gentile in the remnant of believing Israel, not the body of Christ.

The Gentiles in Romans 11:13 are Gentile new testament saints, not the Gentiles in the church, the body of Christ.

11:17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert graffed in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;

In verse 17 above, "thou being a wild olive tree" is the Gentile new testament saints, part of the election of grace. The remnant of Gentile new testament believers is the wild olive tree, grafted among the fruitfull branches of the believing Jews, the good olive tree. The broken off branches are unbelieving Israel.

It would not stand to reason to consider Gentiles in the body of Christ the "wild olive tree" because the body of Christ consists of both Jews and Gentiles. The Jews in the body could not be considered to be a "wild olive tree", but rather the natural olive tree; also, in the body there is neither Jew or Gentile (Galatians 3:28).

It can be seen from John 15 below that the broken off branches refers to unfruitful, unbelieving Israel.

John 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.

15:6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

In Matthew below, the kingdom will be taken from unbelieving Israel and given to the fruitful nation of Israel. They are not all Israel, which are of Israel, it is only the believing, promised seed (Romans 9:6).

Matthew 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

Romans 11:22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

The election of grace, the remnant, would also be cut off if they fell into unbelief. They would not enter the promised Davidic kingdom.

11:23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.

11:24 For if thou wert cut out of the olive tree which is wild by nature, and wert graffed contrary to nature into a good olive tree: how much more shall these, which be the natural branches, be graffed into their own olive tree?

The remnant of new testament Gentiles were cut out of a wild olive tree and grafted into the good olive tree of believing Israel: so unbelieving Israel would be grafted back into their own good olive tree if they repented and believed.

11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in.

11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

Israel will be restored when the fulness of the Gentiles comes in; that is when the Gentiles, which would include Gentiles in the body of Christ, have fulfilled their purpose as determined by God. Jesus will come again to bring salvation to Israel.

11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

Jesus will fulfill the New Testament and restore, and bring salvation to Israel.

In conclusion, the wild olive tree is the remnant of believing new testament Gentiles. These Gentiles have, by the preaching of Peter and the apostles, believed on the name of Jesus as the crucified and risen Lord and Christ. These Gentiles have believed in the death, and shed blood of Jesus for the new testament. These Gentiles have believed the gospel of the kingdom; that by his resurrection, he will fulfill the promise of his coming to bring salvation. The Gentiles spoken of are the wild olive tree grafted into the good olive tree; they are part of the election of grace, who along with the little flock, will enter the coming kingdom on earth. These Gentiles are not in the body of Christ.

Abraham"s name was not Israel.