What is the "Apostasy" mentioned at 2 Thessalonians 2:3?

[Diaste]

4 hours ago, BibleReader said:

Or is it possible that only those who have insight would understand?

Daniel 12:10:  ". . .None of the wicked will understand, but those who have insight will understand."  

 

I don't know. A lot of people say they understand but there are many versions of that understanding. 

[BibleReader]

1 hour ago, Diaste said:

I don't know. A lot of people say they understand but there are many versions of that understanding. 

I appreciated your modesty.  I really don't know either and so far I don't find any of the answers convincing enough.  I would love to have substantial evidence before believing one way or another.  

[DeighAnn]

8 hours ago, BibleReader said:

I appreciated your modesty.  I really don't know either and so far I don't find any of the answers convincing enough.  I would love to have substantial evidence before believing one way or another.  

Matthew 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

Thats the Apostasy/falling away. 
So great shall be the false teachings and combined with the great signs and wonders he will perform not to mention he is  SO GOOD AT DECEPTION,  that even the ELECT would fall under his deception, if God didn't shorten the time

GREAT tribulation as was not since.... 
Why is this "the hour of temptation/great tribulation" which shall come TO TRY them that dwell upon the earth going to be so GREAT ? 
Because it will not be just Satan's evil INFLUENCE, through another "kingdom/empire" ruling of the world BUT it will BE HIM, kicked out of heaven and fallen to the earth,  IN PERSON  and IN CHARGE.  And what does he want?  To be worshipped as God.



HOW does GOD talk of Satan so that we might "discern" what THAT HOUR of his is going to look like?  What is a part of him we need to know?  

Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.

15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.  16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.  17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.  18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick;

with

Ephesians 6:10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.

Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;

And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;

Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.

And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;


If you don't "withstand",  you have fallen/fallen away.  Gone to buy and sell in the night.  Been taken.  Didn't heed do not be deceived.  Allowed a thief to break into your house.  Didn't stand or endure to the end.  Followed after "lo, here He is" when told no HE WOULDN'T BE.  Didn't have enough back up "oil".  Took the mark of the beast.  Was found to be unfaithful by worshipping another when the True Christ returns MAKING you want to hide in the mountains........ 


Then go read how Christ was "tempted"

The Falling away is not going to be through a "decisive action" on the part of those who do it, it is THROUGH "being deceived" by the LIES they will come to believe as truth because they have not put on the gospel armor which protects you from the fiery darts from the "instead of" Christ coming and performing miracles and signs and quoting the Word of God WITH just a bit of a twist, to suit his needs.     

Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made.
And with a little adding to the Word and with a little taking from the Word and a little altering of the Word.....


 
What is the FIRST thing Christ tells us, therefore MOST IMPORTANT thing for us to know?  
Matthew 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.

Matthew 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.



In the simplicity of Christ, it reads just like this, doesn't it?
2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


another 
Colossians 2:6 As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him:

Colossians 2:7 Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving.

Colossians 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

Colossians 2:9 For in Him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Colossians 2:10 And ye are complete in Him, which is the head of all principality and power:

 

 

[Diaste]

3 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

Matthew 24:21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.
And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

Thats the Apostasy/falling away. 
So great shall be the false teachings and combined with the great signs and wonders he will perform not to mention he is  SO GOOD AT DECEPTION,  that even the ELECT would fall under his deception, if God didn't shorten the time

GREAT tribulation as was not since.... 
Why is this "the hour of temptation/great tribulation" which shall come TO TRY them that dwell upon the earth going to be so GREAT ? 
Because it will not be just Satan's evil INFLUENCE, through another "kingdom/empire" ruling of the world BUT it will BE HIM, kicked out of heaven and fallen to the earth,  IN PERSON  and IN CHARGE.  And what does he want?  To be worshipped as God.



HOW does GOD talk of Satan so that we might "discern" what THAT HOUR of his is going to look like?  What is a part of him we need to know?  

Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.

15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.  16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.  17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.  18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick;

with

Ephesians 6:10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.

Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;

And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;

Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.

And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;


If you don't "withstand",  you have fallen/fallen away.  Gone to buy and sell in the night.  Been taken.  Didn't heed do not be deceived.  Allowed a thief to break into your house.  Didn't stand or endure to the end.  Followed after "lo, here He is" when told no HE WOULDN'T BE.  Didn't have enough back up "oil".  Took the mark of the beast.  Was found to be unfaithful by worshipping another when the True Christ returns MAKING you want to hide in the mountains........ 


Then go read how Christ was "tempted"

The Falling away is not going to be through a "decisive action" on the part of those who do it, it is THROUGH "being deceived" by the LIES they will come to believe as truth because they have not put on the gospel armor which protects you from the fiery darts from the "instead of" Christ coming and performing miracles and signs and quoting the Word of God WITH just a bit of a twist, to suit his needs.     

Genesis 3:1 Now the serpent was more subtil than any beast of the field which the LORD God had made.
And with a little adding to the Word and with a little taking from the Word and a little altering of the Word.....


 
What is the FIRST thing Christ tells us, therefore MOST IMPORTANT thing for us to know?  
Matthew 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.

Matthew 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.



In the simplicity of Christ, it reads just like this, doesn't it?
2 Thessalonians 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


another 
Colossians 2:6 As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him:

Colossians 2:7 Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving.

Colossians 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

Colossians 2:9 For in Him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Colossians 2:10 And ye are complete in Him, which is the head of all principality and power:

 

 

So are you saying the apostasy (rebellion, revolt, defection) is on the part of the ones deceiving?

It always looked to me like it was rebellion, revolt, defection on the part of the ones being deceived.

Like a swarm of refugees fleeing from one side to the other they heard the deception, believed it, and left for the other side.

I understand deception will come in strong opposition to the Most High God, it's already here in some measure, even signs and wonders appear and people think it's ET.

I think Paul alludes to a major event in 2 Thess 2 we will witness. If not an event it will be a global condition we can see in which many people formerly known by His name leave Him for the Deceiver. 

 

 

[Diaste]

13 hours ago, BibleReader said:

I appreciated your modesty.  I really don't know either and so far I don't find any of the answers convincing enough.  I would love to have substantial evidence before believing one way or another.  

I'm of the same mind. At this point I'm convinced it's certainly a leaving from a previous belief system. Not sure what Paul is referring to precisely as deception abounds today in the body of Christ and many have left the Truth behind.

I speculate the apostasy is a global happening as a result of catastrophe and the appearance of a man-god.

Masses of people like two things; full bellies and pleasing lies. I guess we'll see.

[DeighAnn]

9 hours ago, Diaste said:

So are you saying the apostasy (rebellion, revolt, defection) is on the part of the ones deceiving?

It always looked to me like it was rebellion, revolt, defection on the part of the ones being deceived.

Like a swarm of refugees fleeing from one side to the other they heard the deception, believed it, and left for the other side.

I understand deception will come in strong opposition to the Most High God, it's already here in some measure, even signs and wonders appear and people think it's ET.

I think Paul alludes to a major event in 2 Thess 2 we will witness. If not an event it will be a global condition we can see in which many people formerly known by His name leave Him for the Deceiver. 

 

 

I am saying that The Bible says it is through deception.   One is not aware they are  being deceived  UNTIL it is too late. 

 No Christian in their right mind would "choose" the instead of/anti Christ.  Only the gospel armor, the knowledge given in the Word of God, KEEPS you from being deceived.  For all those who "claim" they believe in Christ but know nothing of Him and haven't followed the commandments given us and  haven't heeded the warnings given the LIES Satan will be flooding the world with will be believed.  Remember, Satan was made the most "perfect" in beauty, and wisdom and all the rest.  He is more subtle than any of us.  If someone doesn't have on the breastplate and helmet and have their feet shod, those fiery darts of Satan, LIES and claiming to be God, are going to be believed. 


What is he about?  WORSHIP me. He convinces the world that  "I am the one you have been waiting for to return".  See me come, see the lightening, feel the earthquake, I am bringing in "peace and safety", convincing with flatteries THE WHOLE WORLD.  Take the mark and life feels like heaven on earth.  BUT there are those who will not believe his lies  Those are the ones who will need to be put on trial as they are the ones who are "not believing and worshipping him", they are those with the armor on, they are THE BIG PRIZE.    The rest just fall away to him like he really is the Lord returned.   And he is supernatural, so there will be miracles the likes no one has ever witnessed before.  Satan is so good at DECEPTION that the time HAD to be shortened or else even the elect, those with armor would be convinced by his lies.  

The biggest deception Satan has running around today is the "tribulation" is a time of "unprecedented death and destruction"  OF THE FLESH. 
But the death REALLY TAKING PLACE is the death TO THE SPIRITUAL MAN, the inner man, ALONG with the opportunity  to be a part of the first resurrection. 
The death is to NO LONGER REMAIN the faithful/a virgin because you have believed the lies AND jumped into bed with Satan.  (Blessed are the barren and WOE to those who are with child and give suck.  Alll that happens to the SPIRITUAL part of man, not physical).  The whole world is worshipping after this one and the world is a happy place MOSTLY.  There are not people all over the place being "Physically killed",  AS THEY ARE BEING TAUGHT TODAY, SO THIS wonderful, deadly wound healer, peace bringer, safety bringer just MUST be the real thing.  Only problem is is it ISN'T and now they have been taken by the one who is sent overcoming and to overcome.  


Jesus says "Do not be deceived".   That's what's coming.  Super simple.

So no, I do not believe it will be "an event" of the physical, but of the spiritual.   Notice when addressing the churches and their teaching that EVERYONE of them ends with "HE".  The only thing the Pre trib rap has right is that GODS CHURCH wont be on earth because the one in power at that time is "the prince of the power of the air" so that ALL churches will be worshipping "that prince" or in that "synagogue of Satan" EVEN THOUGH THEY  still "believe" it is Gods True Church. 

"the church" during the tribulation is rendered down to the "he" wearing the gospel armor/knowledge/carrying spare oil  so as to get through it WITHOUT losing their virginity by worshipping another.  It is the great TEST in which a Christian best be ready for the FLOOD of lies coming to steal your soul.  

Many Christians don't seem to believe in THEIR OWN Baptism.  They believe that being in the "flesh" has any meaning as far as "life and death" goes not truly accepting that it is our spiritual "life or death" that IS ALL THAT MATTERS.  This flesh goes back to dust.  Our flesh is grass that withers. Crucify our flesh daily, don't we?  Whether alive or dead 'in the flesh' are we not with the Lord?  We are no longer of the world are we?  SO what happens to our "terrestrial" body JUST DOESN'T REALLY MATTER.  Take my head off in a beheading DOESN'T CHANGE but ONE THING. It is not much different than taking off my clothes to hop in the shower.  Just gonna be stepping out of this flesh body is all and going home.  And if I am BLESSED to be used of God so that HIS WILL that none should perish means "off with her head", well HALLELUJAH.  I READ the promises of God.  He will recompense.  THATS FOR ETERNITY.  I can't even believe that anyone wouldn't WANT to do for the Lord, knowing that He is WITH US at all times.  STOP

 

[Diaste]

11 hours ago, DeighAnn said:

I am saying that The Bible says it is through deception.   One is not aware they are  being deceived  UNTIL it is too late. 

 No Christian in their right mind would "choose" the instead of/anti Christ.  Only the gospel armor, the knowledge given in the Word of God, KEEPS you from being deceived.  For all those who "claim" they believe in Christ but know nothing of Him and haven't followed the commandments given us and  haven't heeded the warnings given the LIES Satan will be flooding the world with will be believed.  Remember, Satan was made the most "perfect" in beauty, and wisdom and all the rest.  He is more subtle than any of us.  If someone doesn't have on the breastplate and helmet and have their feet shod, those fiery darts of Satan, LIES and claiming to be God, are going to be believed. 


What is he about?  WORSHIP me. He convinces the world that  "I am the one you have been waiting for to return".  See me come, see the lightening, feel the earthquake, I am bringing in "peace and safety", convincing with flatteries THE WHOLE WORLD.  Take the mark and life feels like heaven on earth.  BUT there are those who will not believe his lies  Those are the ones who will need to be put on trial as they are the ones who are "not believing and worshipping him", they are those with the armor on, they are THE BIG PRIZE.    The rest just fall away to him like he really is the Lord returned.   And he is supernatural, so there will be miracles the likes no one has ever witnessed before.  Satan is so good at DECEPTION that the time HAD to be shortened or else even the elect, those with armor would be convinced by his lies.  

The biggest deception Satan has running around today is the "tribulation" is a time of "unprecedented death and destruction"  OF THE FLESH. 
But the death REALLY TAKING PLACE is the death TO THE SPIRITUAL MAN, the inner man, ALONG with the opportunity  to be a part of the first resurrection. 
The death is to NO LONGER REMAIN the faithful/a virgin because you have believed the lies AND jumped into bed with Satan.  (Blessed are the barren and WOE to those who are with child and give suck.  Alll that happens to the SPIRITUAL part of man, not physical).  The whole world is worshipping after this one and the world is a happy place MOSTLY.  There are not people all over the place being "Physically killed",  AS THEY ARE BEING TAUGHT TODAY, SO THIS wonderful, deadly wound healer, peace bringer, safety bringer just MUST be the real thing.  Only problem is is it ISN'T and now they have been taken by the one who is sent overcoming and to overcome.  


Jesus says "Do not be deceived".   That's what's coming.  Super simple.

So no, I do not believe it will be "an event" of the physical, but of the spiritual.   Notice when addressing the churches and their teaching that EVERYONE of them ends with "HE".  The only thing the Pre trib rap has right is that GODS CHURCH wont be on earth because the one in power at that time is "the prince of the power of the air" so that ALL churches will be worshipping "that prince" or in that "synagogue of Satan" EVEN THOUGH THEY  still "believe" it is Gods True Church. 

"the church" during the tribulation is rendered down to the "he" wearing the gospel armor/knowledge/carrying spare oil  so as to get through it WITHOUT losing their virginity by worshipping another.  It is the great TEST in which a Christian best be ready for the FLOOD of lies coming to steal your soul.  

Many Christians don't seem to believe in THEIR OWN Baptism.  They believe that being in the "flesh" has any meaning as far as "life and death" goes not truly accepting that it is our spiritual "life or death" that IS ALL THAT MATTERS.  This flesh goes back to dust.  Our flesh is grass that withers. Crucify our flesh daily, don't we?  Whether alive or dead 'in the flesh' are we not with the Lord?  We are no longer of the world are we?  SO what happens to our "terrestrial" body JUST DOESN'T REALLY MATTER.  Take my head off in a beheading DOESN'T CHANGE but ONE THING. It is not much different than taking off my clothes to hop in the shower.  Just gonna be stepping out of this flesh body is all and going home.  And if I am BLESSED to be used of God so that HIS WILL that none should perish means "off with her head", well HALLELUJAH.  I READ the promises of God.  He will recompense.  THATS FOR ETERNITY.  I can't even believe that anyone wouldn't WANT to do for the Lord, knowing that He is WITH US at all times.  STOP

 

Sure. All true. In the OP I would have to pick 'C'. Since the question is 'What is the apostasy?' I'm saying it's a future happening scaled up from what we see today and have seen since this... 

"“You will not surely die,” the serpent told her. “For God knows that in the day you eat of it, your eyes will be opened and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”"

...which is the lie man can become God;

and this...

"Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to Him, we ask you, brothers, not to be easily disconcerted or alarmed by any spirit or message or letter seeming to be from us, alleging that the Day of the Lord has already come."

which is the attempt at deceiving in the day Paul wrote to the Thessalonians; have always been around enticing people to rebel against God.

It's a fair question, "What is the apostasy?" I would have to liken it to an event as Paul mentions three events quite clearly: Coming of the Lord, the gathering, and the revealing of the man of sin. Paul says the Coming and the gathering won't happen till the rebellion and the revealing occur. So the rebellion (apostasy) must be something we can see and know it's the apostasy from 2 Thess 2 as Paul used the apostasy as a guidepost to show us when the Coming and the gathering would occur.

So it's a flight en masse to the dark side at some point by the so called 'Church'. The "church' defects to the other side at some point and we'll all see it. This Covid thing is the trial run for just such a happening. The 'church' donned the mask at the behest of the governments as ostensibly altruistic. I imagine that is going to happen again based on some global circumstance, only this time it's going to be a real condition.

I could be wrong but you seem to discount the influence of the flesh in others, seemingly as you don't suffer under that master. That's great but it seems a hard sell to ignore a third of what makes us...us. I think we all need to remember that when our Father brings correction it's through the flesh. The martyrs under the altar are asking for vengeance for their deaths. It's obviously not spiritual death they want avenged as they are alive. Jesus said to flee Judea at the A of D. Jesus asked to get out of the path He was on. 

We need to be strong in the Spirit in the overcoming of the flesh, as you say. But the flesh is a powerful influencer and we must be on guard as it may come down to whether or not the belly is full or empty and that is nothing to scoff at.

 

 

 

 

Edited November 11, 2020 by Diaste

[DeighAnn]

6 hours ago, Diaste said:

Sure. All true. In the OP I would have to pick 'C'. Since the question is 'What is the apostasy?' I'm saying it's a future happening scaled up from what we see today and have seen since this... 

"“You will not surely die,” the serpent told her. “For God knows that in the day you eat of it, your eyes will be opened and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”"

...which is the lie man can become God;

and this...

"Now concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our being gathered together to Him, we ask you, brothers, not to be easily disconcerted or alarmed by any spirit or message or letter seeming to be from us, alleging that the Day of the Lord has already come."

which is the attempt at deceiving in the day Paul wrote to the Thessalonians; have always been around enticing people to rebel against God.

It's a fair question, "What is the apostasy?" I would have to liken it to an event as Paul mentions three events quite clearly: Coming of the Lord, the gathering, and the revealing of the man of sin. Paul says the Coming and the gathering won't happen till the rebellion and the revealing occur. So the rebellion (apostasy) must be something we can see and know it's the apostasy from 2 Thess 2 as Paul used the apostasy as a guidepost to show us when the Coming and the gathering would occur.

So it's a flight en masse to the dark side at some point by the so called 'Church'. The "church' defects to the other side at some point and we'll all see it. This Covid thing is the trial run for just such a happening. The 'church' donned the mask at the behest of the governments as ostensibly altruistic. I imagine that is going to happen again based on some global circumstance, only this time it's going to be a real condition.

I could be wrong but you seem to discount the influence of the flesh in others, seemingly as you don't suffer under that master. That's great but it seems a hard sell to ignore a third of what makes us...us. I think we all need to remember that when our Father brings correction it's through the flesh. The martyrs under the altar are asking for vengeance for their deaths. It's obviously not spiritual death they want avenged as they are alive. Jesus said to flee Judea at the A of D. Jesus asked to get out of the path He was on. 

We need to be strong in the Spirit in the overcoming of the flesh, as you say. But the flesh is a powerful influencer and we must be on guard as it may come down to whether or not the belly is full or empty and that is nothing to scoff at.

 

 

 

 

No, the belly isn' to be scoffed at.  My mother was in occupied France as a child, I have a bit of understanding.  But I also come from this as being  SHORTENED  to "an hour" AS WRITTEN, but generally not accepted as it doesn't fit in with the....... But the apostasy


And WHO sees it?  Only those with the eyes to see.  The rest have been blinded.  When the governing system is in place, with all the tares in their places of power and basically controlling the way the world works, aka the multi headed beast risen from the sea, for US who know what is going on because we have read what God tells us, it is very CLEAR.  For those who "are of this world" it is all happening and coming about as A NATURAL process of "the way the world works"  so YES, it is a slow and steady process of apostasy for those who don't understand THE REALITY of what is really happening in the spiritual terms.  When the deadly wound comes about and the world seems as if it is not going to be able to recover, and VOILA a savior appears and IT APPEARS, with his supernatural powers and his ability to deceive that "he" can ONLY be what ALL RELIGIONS have been reading about.  He will be able to explain away EVERY verse that "seems" to go against him being exactly who he says he is.  


THAT is when the falling away happens en masse.  NOT on purpose, not because they don't think they love God, but because THEY now Believe the lies and the BELIEVE they are following "Jesus returned".  THEY don't know because THEY didn't care enough to put on the gospel armor TO NOT BE DECEIVED.  It seems so simple right now doesn't it?  But have you ever been the one against the many before?  When ALL you are being told SEEMS TO BE truth, when what you are seeing IS SUPERNATURAL, AND everyone with every RIGHT answer MAKING you the foolish, and it all fits so perfectly in the FLESH mind, THEIR way seems to be the only way. How can the world be wrong and you right?


THAT is what the gospel armor is.  IT is the eyes and ears that can DISCERN the TRUTH of what is really going on.  IF one has not studied what God has told us EXACTLY what will be happening and where we are to stand, there is NO WAY to discern at that point.  REMEMBER Satan is so good the time had to be shortened.  I can't seem to say that enough, it scares the hell out of me, that even the elect would be deceived, OMG.  The famine in the end times is for the Word of God.  It is the ONLY food for eternal life.  Satan has had his little "ads" running in our churches for a very long time.  Just believe or have faith, OSAS, or the ever present "get out of the test free flight" ALL BLINDING and making DEAF to those the word of God that actually WILL SAVE.  

In this day and age of superfast computers and knowledge and food, everyone wants the quick fix, and Satan is providing just that.   The church is just as much a drive through in our lives today as all the rest. Add to that the "you don't need to study the OT cause it doesn't apply to you", can you believe that there are people who PROFESS to love God and FOLLOW that line of thought? Like that is even POSSIBLE when you have been captured by the Lord.  Shoot, the Book isn't even big enough with it.   WE KNOW them when we interact with them as they say things that go so against GOD you almost can't respond because they lack so much information found in the Word there isn't time to teach them enough because they want to argue everypoint in between.  I'll stop there on this before I, Stop.

 


 

[Revelation Man]

On 11/7/2020 at 5:04 PM, BibleReader said:

2 Thessalonians 2:1, 3 (NASB):  "Regarding the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ. . .No one is to deceive you in any way! For it will not come unless the apostasy comes first, and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the son of destruction."  

What is the apostasy that comes first?  

Please choose one of the following:

A)  The apostasy described by Jesus in his illustration of the wheat and the weeds in which Satan sowed weeds (imitation Christians) after the death of the apostles which now results in false Christians and teachings. (Matthew 13:24:30, 36-42)  

B)  It is the same as the apostasy described in Daniel 11:30-32 and is yet future.  

C)  It is a great falling away from the one true church that will take place in the future.  

D) Something else.  (If you choose this option, please elaborate, thanks in advance)

 

 

 

It's not APOSTACY, the word used "Falling Away" was first translated 7 Times as DEPARTED in other English translations before the KJV put Falling Away in its translation. The Latin Vulgate used Dicessio (or close to that) and it meant DEPART also. 

So, what is DEPARTING? Well, what does verse 1 say? Its talking about a GATHERING unto Christ Jesus, LOL, this couldn't be any more clearer. NOWERE in the whole passage (NOT ANYWHERE) is the chapter/passage speaking about Faith, yet we are supposed to believe that its about a Falling Away from "THE FAITH" (makes me laugh tbh).

Alas, this is Paul telling the Thessalonians to FEAR NOT [That you are in God's Wrath] for THAT DAY (DOTL) can not come [UPON YOU] until the Church Departs AND that Man of Sin (Anti-Christ) shows up. So why are they NOT TO FEAR? Its spelled out, the Church will DEPART FIRST...........Verse 1, the Gathering unto Christ........

2 Thessalonians 2:1 Now we beseech you(ASK URGENTLY/Implore), brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

We PLEAD WITH YOU to hear us..........via the Coming of Jesus AND via him Gathering us unto him (Rapture). So, they are BEGGING THEM URGENTLY to hear what they have to say, and its about the coming RAPTURE, then they say why they should hear them out via this subject about their Rapture understanding. They tell them HEY MEN, don't fear (shaken and troubled), neither in your spirt, NOR by any word (people were telling them they were in the Wrath of God) nor by letter as if it were from us (others were sending the letters telling them the Wrath of God was at hand).........as if the Wrath of God is at hand (upon us). 

LET NO MAN DECIEVE YOU...............For THAT DAY (Day of the Lord God's Wrath) SHAL NOT COME except first there comes a DEPARTURE [of the Church which is why YOU DON'T HAVE TO FEAR, Thessalonians] and after the Rapture, the Anti-Christ will also show up, BOTH happen BEFORE the DOTL arrives. (SO STOP FEARING). 

We have allowed the KJV Translation to become Apostacy, when its has nothing to do with leaving the faith, all because it seems the English Church wanted to stigmatize the RCC as being heretic in nature.

It amazes me that people can just cross up meanings of things when the FACTS do not follow. I have begged ANYONE to show me anywhere in that whole passage where FAITH is being mentioned, its NOT THERE ANYWHERE, yet they keep spouting it anyway. 

The Falling Away is the Church Departing. PERIOD. 

 

Edited November 13, 2020 by Revelation Man

[BibleReader]

16 hours ago, Revelation Man said:

It's not APOSTACY, the word used "Falling Away" was first translated 7 Times as DEPARTED in other English translations before the KJV put Falling Away in its translation. The Latin Vulgate used Dicessio (or close to that) and t meant DEPART also. 

So, what is DEPARTING? Well, what does verse 1 say? It stalking about a GATHERING unto Christ Jesus, LOL, this couldn't be any more clearer. NOWERE in the whole passage (NOT ANYWHERE) is the chapter/passage speaking about Faith, yet we are supposed to believe that is about a Falling Away from "THE FAITH" (makes me laugh tbh).

Alas, this is Paul tellin the Thessalonians to FEAR NOT [That you are in God's Wrath] for THAT DAY (DOTL) can not come [UPON YOU] until the Church Departs AND that Man of Sin (Anti-Christ) shows up. So why are they NOT TO FEAR? Its spelled out, the Church will DEPART FIRST...........Verse 1, the Gathering unto Christ........

2 Thessalonians 2:1 Now we beseech you(ASK URGENTLY/Implore), brethren, by the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, and by our gathering together unto him, 2 That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

We PLEAD WITH YOU to hear us..........via the Coming of Jesus AND via him Gathering us unto him (Rapture). So, they are BEGGING THEM URGENTLY to hear what they have to say, and its about the coming RAPTURE, then they say why they should hear them out via this subject about their Rapture understanding. They tell them HEY MEN, don't fear (shaken and troubled), neither in your spirt, NOR by any word (people were telling them they were in the Wrath of God) nor by letter as if it were from us (others were sending the letters telling them the Wrath of God was at hand).........as if the Wrath of God is at hand (upon us). 

LET NO MANN DECIEVE YOU...............For THAT DAY (Day of the Lord God's Wrath) SHAL NOT COME except first there comes a DEPARTURE [of the Church which is why YOU DON'T HAVE TO FEAR, Thessalonians] and after the Rapture, the Anti-Christ will also show up, BOTH happen BEFORE the DOTL arrives. (SO STOP FEARING). 

We have allowed the KJV Translation to become Apostacy, when its has nothing to do with leaving the faith, all because it seems the English Church wanted to stigmatize the RCC as being heretic in nature.

It amazes me that people can just cross up meanings of things when the FACTS do not follow. I have begged ANYONE to show me anywhere in that whole passage where FAITH is being mentioned, its NOT THERE ANYWHERE, yet they keep spouting it anyway. 

The Falling Away is the Church Departing. PERIOD. 

 

Thanks for your response but this is not how early Christians viewed the matter.  Several church fathers referred to 2 Thessalonians 2 quite a bit and made reference to an apostasy during the time of the end.