Are Fossils evidence of evolution ....or are the evidence of fossils

[Sparks]

11 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

Anyway, here is the one question I would respectfully ask:  Do you believe the Bible is 100 % inspired by God AND thereby does NOT have ANY errors or contradictions within the 66 books?

Sure.  I do.

There is an author who wrote a book countering hundreds of alleged contradictions by atheists.  For example, one alleged contradiction is about God creating trees and animals in the book of Genesis, and then later we again see God creating trees and animals in the book of Genesis. 

To the atheist crowd, they think God was stuttering or something, but in reality He made the trees and animals for the world, and then made the Garden of Eden, and a new set of animals specifically for Adam to name.  There is no contradiction, and the atheists entirely missed this detail.   But I am sure the atheists are still ranting about God making the animals and trees, twice, and claiming there was no good reason.

In another it was chariots and horses and how they were counted which turned out to be that both authors had counted correctly, but one was counting the teams of horses, and stables, and the other just chariots.  It's always minor issues that don't actually conflict. 

According to Paul, the Bible is inspired by God. 

2 Timothy 3:17-17 (NLT) 16 All Scripture is inspired by God and is useful to teach us what is true and to make us realize what is wrong in our lives. It corrects us when we are wrong and teaches us to do what is right. 17 God uses it to prepare and equip his people to do every good work.

So, if there was global flood that covered the world, would we see a distribution of fossils like we do today?  I think so.  I think we would see layers of mud that hydrologically sorted, or did it take trillions of years for the layers to get covered over?

** Note, I say trillions of years because it's only slightly more ridiculous than billions of years, which some have no problem believing.

[Riverwalker]

Anytime any science report says "this  could mean" you know they have left the reservation of established facts

[teddyv]

We just don't fully know the energy environment of the Flood to make solid inferences in what we see in the natural world, especially at the global scale. It's usually interpreted as a high energy environment, at least in the observers (Noah's) area, but little is know about the greater world itself. Some have postulated the crust breaking up at this time (catastrophic plate tectonics or hydroplate theory), but there is little evidence for this as well. The bigger issues are the thermodynamic problems around these events.

We can observe multiple sequences of graded bedding in one location, or things like varves representing yearly cyclical sediment inputs (or algae blooms). The Flood, due to it's time constraints, might show one major sedimentary depositional event, probably with some basic sorting of coarse clasts at the bottom. The receding of the waters was quite quick considering the suggested depths of the waters (unless you support the earth was topographically subdued prior to Flood and all mountain ranges are a result of the Flood). There should be a major mélange of fossils from  land species intermixed within the sediments almost everywhere in the world that would be a correlatable stratigraphic horizon. To my knowledge, there is no convincing evidence of such a layer.

There are regions of the interior US that are underlain by quadrillions of belemnites, oysters and other bivalve fossils. These all had to have existed and perished at the same time.

Following years after the Flood, we should see a reversion to a fairly normal pattern of erosion and deposition. But there is also issues around the time to bury and lithify these post-Flood sediments.

 

[Charlie744]

1 minute ago, teddyv said:

We just don't fully know the energy environment of the Flood to make solid inferences in what we see in the natural world, especially at the global scale. It's usually interpreted as a high energy environment, at least in the observers (Noah's) area, but little is know about the greater world itself. Some have postulated the crust breaking up at this time (catastrophic plate tectonics or hydroplate theory), but there is little evidence for this as well. The bigger issues are the thermodynamic problems around these events.

We can observe multiple sequences of graded bedding in one location, or things like varves representing yearly cyclical sediment inputs (or algae blooms). The Flood, due to it's time constraints, might show one major sedimentary depositional event, probably with some basic sorting of coarse clasts at the bottom. The receding of the waters was quite quick considering the suggested depths of the waters (unless you support the earth was topographically subdued prior to Flood and all mountain ranges are a result of the Flood). There should be a major mélange of fossils from  land species intermixed within the sediments almost everywhere in the world that would be a correlatable stratigraphic horizon. To my knowledge, there is no convincing evidence of such a layer.

There are regions of the interior US that are underlain by quadrillions of belemnites, oysters and other bivalve fossils. These all had to have existed and perished at the same time.

Following years after the Flood, we should see a reversion to a fairly normal pattern of erosion and deposition. But there is also issues around the time to bury and lithify these post-Flood sediments.

 

I don't believe we will ever have enough time (even if we were given a million years more) to understand the things of God.... we are not meant to! 

If God wanted us to understand everything about our DNA or chemistry, or physics or geology, medicine, etc., HE would have given us this information for us to study. Instead, HE certainly has given us a brain to use to understand this physical world as best we can and improve our surroundings, but I believe HE gave us everything that is so important to HIM and US in HIS writings..... These are the answers to the questions we should be asking ourselves and trying to understand HIS answers. HE has given us HIS answers to the test.... 

But back to the issue of fossils and the age of the world, the interpreting of the physical geological columns, the earth's crust, etc.

The answer to this too has been provided in the Bible.... there is no mystery here.... so that is why I asked the question earlier, "if you believe in the Scriptures, then is the answer of the age of the earth, the fossils, etc., provided in it"?

Thanks, Charlie

 

[one.opinion]

13 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

I simply asked if you or anyone believes in the inerrant words in the Scripture

Yes.

13 hours ago, Charlie744 said:

if so, do you then believe the answer to the question of fossils, age of earth, etc., can be found in those Scriptures.

No, Scripture doesn't (and was never intended to) answer these questions.

[teddyv]

7 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

The answer to this too has been provided in the Bible.... there is no mystery here.... so that is why I asked the question earlier, "if you believe in the Scriptures, then is the answer of the age of the earth, the fossils, etc., provided in it"?

I believe the Scriptures but they do not speak to these specifically, like they do not speak to atomic theory or electricity or gravity. Scripture is about the story of God's revelation to humanity.

Quote

Thanks, Charlie

 

No prob.

 

Edited April 12, 2021 by teddyv
missed a word

[Charlie744]

5 minutes ago, one.opinion said:

Yes.

No, Scripture doesn't (and was never intended to) answer these questions.

Well, I appreciate your responding! Thank you! More importantly is that you believe in the Scriptures and they are without error.... 

Now, would you mind telling me why you do not think the Scriptures speak of the age of the world, the planet, the earliest fossil ever found - which of course is one of the Volkswagen Beetles.....

Thanks, Charlie

[Sparks]

54 minutes ago, teddyv said:

The bigger issues are the thermodynamic problems around these events.

If you refer to the latent heat of condensation, the world didn't have the mountains it has today, and the majority of the water came from under the Earth's crust, and remains today as oceans. 

Scripture points out that God made the mountains we see today after the flood.   As you see below, it cannot be referencing Genesis in the creation story, but after.

Psalm 104: 6-9 (NLT)

You clothed the earth with floods of water,
    water that covered even the mountains.
⁷ At your command, the water fled;
    at the sound of your thunder, it hurried away.
⁸ Mountains rose and valleys sank
    to the levels you decreed.
⁹ Then you set a firm boundary for the seas,
    so they would never again cover the earth.

[Charlie744]

1 minute ago, Sparks said:

If you refer to the latent heat of condensation, the world didn't have the mountains it has today, and the majority of the water came from under the Earth's crust, and remains today as oceans. 

Scripture points out that God made the mountains we see today after the flood.   As you see below, it cannot be referencing Genesis in the creation story, but after.

Psalm 104: 6-9 (NLT)

You clothed the earth with floods of water,
    water that covered even the mountains.
⁷ At your command, the water fled;
    at the sound of your thunder, it hurried away.
⁸ Mountains rose and valleys sank
    to the levels you decreed.
⁹ Then you set a firm boundary for the seas,
    so they would never again cover the earth.

Sparks, I may be incorrect here but I think the earth was 100 % covered with water prior to their being drawn down into the earth..... Charlie

[one.opinion]

5 minutes ago, Charlie744 said:

Now, would you mind telling me why you do not think the Scriptures speak of the age of the world, the planet, the earliest fossil ever found - which of course is one of the Volkswagen Beetles.....

The evidence God left for us in His creation is not consistent with the assumption of the 6,000-10,000 year old universe and earth. The distant starlight issue and the radiometric dating of the earth show us a universe and planet much older than a strictly literal interpretation of the Bible allows. The fossil record shows us clearly that fossils were NOT all deposited at the same time, in contrast to the argument that fossils only result from the flood of Noah's time.

Regardless, the age of these things is a secondary issue (if not tertiary or quaternary!) to the meaningful theology present in Genesis 1-3.

* The one true God is the Creator of the universe and everything in it.

* God made humans special, with the unique ability to relate with Him.

* God passed His image on to all humans through Adam and Eve.

* Adam and Eve chose their own "wisdom" over God's and ushered sin into the world, condemning humanity to sin and its consequences.

* God foretold of His redemptive plan through Jesus.