What is speaking in tongues and prophesying?

[enoob57]

I am not a cessationist as to God does not perform miracles... As I have witnessed many in my own life ...they are performed through prayer to God and He answers in ways that are hidden from the world around us (no man is needed) fulfilling His Word
Matt 6:6

6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.
KJV

God is about faith
Rom 10:17

17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
KJV

It is necessary
Heb 11:6

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
KJV

It is defined
Heb 11:1

11 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
KJV

You simply cannot fit signs and wonders into this designed pathway of God... The Bible is rife with the designed pathway in Scripture alone
as this below is the designed path of the future, prayed by Christ near His cross, and the whole is Scripture based not signs and wonders...

John 17:6-20

6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.

7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.

8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.

10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

13 And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.

14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.

16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
KJV
 

 

 

[enoob57]

10 hours ago, Waggles said:

What so NO Christians can grow and learn and become mature by building upon their experiences, their walk or their overcoming. Let us all remain babes and infants and deny our experiences of Christian faith and life.   I notice your having difficulty in giving up all that is here (why?)

1Co 3:9  For we are God's fellow workers. You are God's field, God's building. 
3:10  According to the grace of God given to me, like a skilled master builder I laid a foundation, and someone else is building upon it. Let each one take care how he builds upon it. 
3:11  For no one can lay a foundation other than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. 
3:12  Now if anyone builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw— 
3:13  each one's work will become manifest, for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed by fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done. 
3:14  If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. 
3:15  If anyone's work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire.

This passage you quoted is before the Great White Throne and the removal of the 1^st creation events by fire and later all knowledge of at the presentation of the new heaven and earth... that fire of God will burn up literally (all) so verse 12 that list all will be burnt up... so vs 13-15 speaks of the fire of God that reveals the eternal keeping through fire and that would be the work of faith the same substance of foundation 'Jesus Christ' started yet separated from that which passes away and fixed upon the hope of the new heaven and new earth where sin is nonexistent and cannot be fathomed in thought...

[enoob57]

2 hours ago, Heleadethme said:

Amen.  Goodness, if we were to throw out all the teachings and instruction having to do with miracles in the bible we wouldn't have much of a bible left.   Who are we to pick and choose anyhow?

Perhaps you missed the point of the post ... It is God that removes all knowledge of the 1 ^st creation  we will retain it till it is removed by God at the start of the new heaven and new earth. The point being if it isn't important enough to be kept then (when all will be perfect) why would we cling to it now knowing this?

[Marathoner]

3 hours ago, enoob57 said:

I am not a cessationist as to God does not perform miracles... As I have witnessed many in my own life ...they are performed through prayer to God and He answers in ways that are hidden from the world around us (no man is needed) fulfilling His Word
Matt 6:6

6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.
KJV

God is about faith
Rom 10:17

17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
KJV

It is necessary
Heb 11:6

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.
KJV

It is defined
Heb 11:1

11 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
KJV

You simply cannot fit signs and wonders into this designed pathway of God... The Bible is rife with the designed pathway in Scripture alone
as this below is the designed path of the future, prayed by Christ near His cross, and the whole is Scripture based not signs and wonders...

John 17:6-20

6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.

7 Now they have known that all things whatsoever thou hast given me are of thee.

8 For I have given unto them the words which thou gavest me; and they have received them, and have known surely that I came out from thee, and they have believed that thou didst send me.

9 I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given me; for they are thine.

10 And all mine are thine, and thine are mine; and I am glorified in them.

11 And now I am no more in the world, but these are in the world, and I come to thee. Holy Father, keep through thine own name those whom thou hast given me, that they may be one, as we are.

12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

13 And now come I to thee; and these things I speak in the world, that they might have my joy fulfilled in themselves.

14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.

16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth.

18 As thou hast sent me into the world, even so have I also sent them into the world.

19 And for their sakes I sanctify myself, that they also might be sanctified through the truth.

20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;
KJV
 

 

 

I understand what you're getting at, Steven. I see it and appreciate it, though others find that impossible given the circumstances. Therefore I encourage the burying of hatchets and the abandonment of offense so that what you bring to the assembly can be heard and duly considered. There was a time when even I thought you to be a cessationist, but this assessment crumbled as I read more of your contributions on the forum. It didn't add up.

Indeed, in my own way I have stated much the same: this faith which God gives to us is simple and straightforward. I not only believe in Christ our Lord but I believe Him. His Spirit has always led me to the scriptures; indeed, the reading and recitation of scripture describes how the Lord taught me how to speak and reason again after my brush with the grave. It was grueling and the greatest challenge I had faced in this life, but our Lord is the prefect Teacher and so His instruction bore abundant fruit. 

Yes, you look at what is to come and I can find no fault nor error in what you see, brother. We are a many-membered Body! Each of us knows in part so it behooves us all to be slow to speak, quick to listen, and above all, to love one another remembering our own shortcomings and faults. Mercy and love, not offense and wrath. 

Besides, I never once asked the Lord for gifts or even miracles. What the Lord accomplished He did according to His good pleasure and purpose, not my own.  

[enoob57]

2 minutes ago, Marathoner said:

I understand what you're getting at, Steven. I see it and appreciate it, though others find that impossible given the circumstances. Therefore I encourage the burying of hatchets and the abandonment of offense so that what you bring to the assembly can be heard and duly considered. There was a time when even I thought you to be a cessationist, but this assessment crumbled as I read more of your contributions on the forum. It didn't add up.

Indeed, in my own way I have stated much the same: this faith which God gives to us is simple and straightforward. I not only believe in Christ our Lord but I believe Him. His Spirit has always led me to the scriptures; indeed, the reading and recitation of scripture describes how the Lord taught me how to speak and reason again after my brush with the grave. It was grueling and the greatest challenge I had faced in this life, but our Lord is the prefect Teacher and so His instruction bore abundant fruit. 

Yes, you look at what is to come and I can find no fault nor error in what you see, brother. We are a many-membered Body! Each of us knows in part so it behooves us all to be slow to speak, quick to listen, and above all, to love one another remembering our own shortcomings and faults. Mercy and love, not offense and wrath. 

Besides, I never once asked the Lord for gifts or even miracles. What the Lord accomplished He did according to His good pleasure and purpose, not my own.  

I have no hatchet   I just want to be in the light as He is in the light and I want my family there as well

[Marathoner]

4 minutes ago, enoob57 said:

I have no hatchet   I just want to be in the light as He is in the light and I want my family there as well

Heh, I know you don't have one to bear. My encouragement is for those who stumble over the stone of offense. I write from experience as one who has tripped over his fair share of stones! 

There's no shame in offense. No, the only shame to be had is when we treasure that stone and adore it. We nurse it like a child, currying its favor while its poisonous embrace obscures our vision and blinds us to our brother (or neighbor as it were). 

[Guest kingdombrat]

When we think about the [Scene and Setting] in the Bible, we must be relative to what is taking place at that time. For one, there was no modern technology, not even a rotary phone or operator connected phone.   There were no guns.   There were no vehicles, radios, televisions, [Hollyweird and the big Movie Industry].   What we have today in possessions related to modern technology, the [Setting] throughout the Bible cover to cover presents none of such.

^

Why is that important?

 

Today, we're a [fast food society], gotta have it now, no waiting, and we have enough going on we can drown out the rest of what's happening worldwide.

 

But in the Bible Setting, they had nothing but [TIME], so they were very aware of what was not just happening next door, but next village, or next town, or to the next Nation.   So when a MIRACLE took place, people knew it and the News spread like wildfire in the form of word of mouth.   Now turn that around to modern day.   If a Miracle happened in your surrounding area, how many people would know about it next city over, next state?  Not MANY would have a clue it ever happened.

 

I believe people are too busy with their lives, their own false doctrines to ever notice what God is actually doing any more.   Therefore, to say God is not performing Miracles in the same rate like we read in the Bible is a [False Truth].  My Word of God tells me 2 things.  God [NEVER] changes!  God is the [SAME] yesterday, today, and will be tomorrow.   I not only am a witness to Miracles, contact with God/Angels, and the many things we read in our Bibles, but I am also a witness to those making the [false claim] God doesn't do things like He once did (because that would Make God a LIAR who is the Same yesterday-today-tomorrow-forever)!

[Heleadethme]

3 hours ago, enoob57 said:

Perhaps you missed the point of the post ... It is God that removes all knowledge of the 1 ^st creation  we will retain it till it is removed by God at the start of the new heaven and new earth. The point being if it isn't important enough to be kept then (when all will be perfect) why would we cling to it now knowing this?

Maybe I'm not understanding you very well, but I'll just answer as best I can.  Many are clinging to miracles and chasing them, and that we should not do, but if we are clinging to Jesus sometimes we might find that we are just being carried along by Him, and it's not for us to quench the Spirit, He blows where He listeth.  I think that's because all is not perfect yet, and meanwhile there is an Enemy who occupies ground that he has no right to...the Lord has likened His church to an army and given us spiritual weapons to fight with.

[David1701]

19 hours ago, enoob57 said:

That really is the depth of my post- all of 1^st creation will be removed from memory including all experience
Isa 65:17

17 For, behold, I create new heavens and a new earth: and the former shall not be remembered, nor come into mind.
KJV

1 Cor 13:8

8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.
KJV

2 Peter 3:10-13

10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,

12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
KJV

Rev 21:1-5

21 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.

2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.

4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.
KJV

So anyone teaching that experience is to be built upon must be ignoring these Scriptures which state otherwise  

None of this answers why you don't believe the Scriptures about continuing gifts of the Holy Spirit, in the body of Christ.  The issue is not whether or not God still does miracles sometimes, without human agency; the issue is whether or not we believe what Scripture says about the gifts of the Holy Spirit, operating through God's people.

[enoob57]

5 hours ago, David1701 said:

None of this answers why you don't believe the Scriptures about continuing gifts of the Holy Spirit, in the body of Christ.  The issue is not whether or not God still does miracles sometimes, without human agency; the issue is whether or not we believe what Scripture says about the gifts of the Holy Spirit, operating through God's people.

you just don't see what is written happening today it's that simple ... and I have explained why I think that is....