Defense of the Post Trib Rapture

[JesusisGod2]

Amen Davey!

Post -tribulation believers are always accused of being arrogant and accussed of being the 5 virgins with no oil in their lamps.

When the fact of the matter is just the opposite, we are ready and look forward to the gathering of the saints, which will come at a time unexpected, but Christ has says we will know the season, just not the day nor the hour.

They fail to see that the marriage supper doesnt happen until after the tribulation yet before God pours out His wrath nor the fact that the first resurrection coresponds with this, but brother its just not worth the arguement sometimes, especially when some are not seeking the truth of the scriptures in the first place.

The very temperment of spirit that some of these come in should give them a clue that they are not coming in the Spirit of our Lord.

Many because of this great deception portrayed by satan, will recieve his mark as well, because of the fact that they will believe that this cant be the mark because we will be gone (raptured) before this great temptation of deception occcurs.

Some will see through the deception, but the ones who have been decieved into recieving this mark will be the ones along with the rest of the world, who will turn over those of the faith to the courts. For no one who recieves this mark as far as what I understand will be saved.

God Bless you Bro, and keep the teachings coming. I agree with you also that those who preach pre-trib rapture have little or no scriptural definition to back up what they believe.

[rollinTHUNDER]

So now, "rolling-thunder", you want others to feel you've been slighted by my quoting of Scripture within these posts along with commentary? You're the one who brought a mocking attitude here, and I must say, you even did that without one word about the Scripture examples that were offered.

Not in the least Davey,

But if that makes you feel better, go with it. I'm content to let your interpretation hang by its own thread. There's a line that I choose not to cross, so there won't be any need to get the scriptures involved. There is no problem with the scripture, its with the interpretation of scripture.

[Guest shadow2b]

-So now, "rolling-thunder", you want others to feel you've been slighted by my quoting of Scripture within these posts along with commentary? You're the one who brought a mocking attitude here, and I must say, you even did that without one word about the Scripture examples that were offered.

-HEYYYYYYY Davey---ahhhhh,I see you have met worthy-boards resident"teacher of fables".........

-Interesting situation isn't it??AS usual the"attacks"used,accuse others of doing the attacking,being

-arrogant,pridefull & just"blind"....These are the usual tactics,so don't get too frustrated with your

-attempts at relying on scripture to refute fables,which usually demean,criticizes & explains

-away scriptural truths as {your wrong interpretation}.....YA see Davey,you have to understand

-where all these arrogant,self-serving,humialiting tactics have been developed....Working in a prison

-as a guard seems to allow"some"people to develop a superiority complex or attitude.....Which

-seems to be quite common among those that wear a badge of any type in these last days.......

-SO you can see how those "special"people really have opportunities to practice & improve these

-humiliating,demeaning,critical,& accusatory tactics.....Since those that are used as guinea pigs are

-totally defenseless, as they are usually hand-cuffed either behind the back or have a chain around

-the waist & are handcuffed to the chain....Leg-shackles are quite common also.....I hope this might

-provide a better understanding for you to consider in future discussions??,debates??along similiar

-lines.GOD-BLESS-ALL-TRUTH-SEEKERS

-Gary-

[rollinTHUNDER]

-So now, "rolling-thunder", you want others to feel you've been slighted by my quoting of Scripture within these posts along with commentary? You're the one who brought a mocking attitude here, and I must say, you even did that without one word about the Scripture examples that were offered.

-HEYYYYYYY Davey---ahhhhh,I see you have met worthy-boards resident"teacher of fables".........

-Interesting situation isn't it??AS usual the"attacks"used,accuse others of doing the attacking,being

-arrogant,pridefull & just"blind"....These are the usual tactics,so don't get too frustrated with your

-attempts at relying on scripture to refute fables,which usually demean,criticizes & explains

-away scriptural truths as {your wrong interpretation}.....YA see Davey,you have to understand

-where all these arrogant,self-serving,humialiting tactics have been developed....Working in a prison

-as a guard seems to allow"some"people to develop a superiority complex or attitude.....Which

-seems to be quite common among those that wear a badge of any type in these last days.......

-SO you can see how those "special"people really have opportunities to practice & improve these

-humiliating,demeaning,critical,& accusatory tactics.....Since those that are used as guinea pigs are

-totally defenseless, as they are usually hand-cuffed either behind the back or have a chain around

-the waist & are handcuffed to the chain....Leg-shackles are quite common also.....I hope this might

-provide a better understanding for you to consider in future discussions??,debates??along similiar

-lines.GOD-BLESS-ALL-TRUTH-SEEKERS

-Gary-

...but wait a minute,

[Guest davey]

Well, firstly, I don't hate my brethren who choose to believe on the 'fly away' doctrine which began in 1830's Great Britain. If we are given to plant 'seeds' by our Lord Jesus, then He only can make them grow. It's not of us. Nor do I see myself in any superior sense above those who believe in the 'fly away' doctrine.

My main inclination and feeling about those brethren is in how unstudied in the Scriptures they are. But not all of them are unstudied. I'm sure we've all discovered how easy it is to miss various anchor points within Scripture study, because once returning to study again, more is opened up to us. So I'm also sure many of those think we are unstudied too. Even the excellent Christian scholar E.W. Bullinger believed in an early version of the "secret rapture", and I think mainly because it was a popular teaching in his era of the 1880's, and he simply allowed himself to get misled, for he had gained a lost of respect and popularity at that time (Satan loves to tempt using pump-up tactics). If Bullinger was alive today, and able to see all the signs around us we see today, then I don't think he would have succumed to such doctrine.

A major misleading I've noticed though, is of many of those wanting to follow what is popular, instead of thinking for themselves in The Word. I know one brother who has believed in the secret rapture fly away doctrine all his life, and since he has now covered more Old Testament Scripture, he's not so sure of the pre-trib secret rapture idea anymore. He did not get any help from his Church in doing that Old Testament Bible study for himself. He disciplined himself in it with our Lord's help. That also means he had to quit listening to what was popular, and what the majority accepted, and began to really listen to what God's Word says.

I don't know any other way to help other believers to get down to serious disciplined Bible study for theirselves, except to tell them that no man will be standing with us before Christ's Judgment Seat to represent us. For many, I simply don't think that responsibility has soaked in just yet. But possibly, when the latter day events do reveal a false messiah working great miracles while we all are still in a flesh body on earth, then maybe they will remember some of these things? I don't think our seed planting will go wasted.

In Christ,

Davey.

[Adstar]

A major misleading I've noticed though, is of many of those wanting to follow what is popular, instead of thinking for themselves in The Word. I know one brother who has believed in the secret rapture fly away doctrine all his life, and since he has now covered more Old Testament Scripture, he's not so sure of the pre-trib secret rapture idea anymore. He did not get any help from his Church in doing that Old Testament Bible study for himself. He disciplined himself in it with our Lord's help. That also means he had to quit listening to what was popular, and what the majority accepted, and began to really listen to what God's Word says.

I don't know any other way to help other believers to get down to serious disciplined Bible study for theirselves, except to tell them that no man will be standing with us before Christ's Judgment Seat to represent us. For many, I simply don't think that responsibility has soaked in just yet. But possibly, when the latter day events do reveal a false messiah working great miracles while we all are still in a flesh body on earth, then maybe they will remember some of these things? I don't think our seed planting will go wasted.

In Christ,

Davey.

Amen Davey my sentiments also

We all must take personal responsibility for our personal relationship with God.

Philippians 2:12

Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;

All praise The Ancient Of Days

[Guest choobaca]

rollin:

As usual, all post-tribbers confuse the second coming with the rapture, but I just wonder who died and appointed you judge.

Only puffed up pride would allow a believer to tell another fellow believer that he will end up worshipping a false messiah, unless of course, he believes he's a prophet.

I don't mind taking the time to talk about such things, that is, until people like you come in here riding on your high horse trying to condemn others. How does that edify the body?

You arrogant little twirp! The ONLY person I see "puffed up with pride" and "confused" about the "second coming and"....FIRST RESURRECTION" is you twit! Your supposed predictions are not happening nor did they, you come on like some sort of authority and belittle those who seek and spread the Truth. Why don't you get a life....preferably "Everlasting Life" in Christ because your own behaviour and words make you evident you "do not hear" though you have ears. You lie, you berate others, you DO NOT have Christ in you....a demon maybe but not Christ.

Spoken like a true accuser. And now you have resorted to childish name calling. I thought you would have matured at least a little since the old board, but apparently that was wishful thinking. Why am I not surprised?

You shouldn't waste your time calling me names and trying to judge me, because its not working out the way you had planned. I'm not angry in the least. I still have the Lord's peace and joy in my heart. Honestly, I feel sorry for you Cruise. No wonder you are still a travelling preacher, and don't have a flock of your own. I'm gonna pray for you, even though my flesh doesn't want me to.

Hi All,

My name is Frank and my user name is choobaca. I'm new here, but certainly not new to this ongoing debate.

I guess I am appalled to open up this section and find nothing but mud slinging over the trib.

Proverbs says "iron sharpeneth iron as one man sharpeneth another". This truth certainly is not going on here on the board. No wonder Paul says we cause the gentiles (pagans) to blaspheme.

I am a postribber but my first view was that of the pretrib position. I've been on both sides of the fence, so I understand why each group holds so tenaciously to their view.

It's good to stand by your convictions, but it is bad to slander others who don't believe as you do. I think we all may be missing some part of the truth of endtimes, for Paul says "we all see thru a glass darkly". I don't believe this text has ever been revoked.

I believe Jesus is more concerned with how we share these views rather than the view itself. If it was all cut and dry, then we would all believe the same. But that is not the case. Then tell, why are there so many views? One Holy Spirit, and He it is who "shows us things to come".

I can hold my own with the best of them, but if it isn't done in Agape, I am a tinkling symbol.

Well though I have not read all the posts here, I read enough to see that there is a lot of sounding brass and tinkling symbols here.

Please take this rebuke in the spirit it is intended.......Love one another as I have loved you".

Period. We all need to wash each other's feet to understand how important it is to Jesus that we apply His words to love.

We should all agree to disagree agreeably.

In essentials.....Unity (Jesus saves etc.)

In non essentials......liberality (pre/post/mid etc)

But in all things.......Charity (LOVE)

Just think....The great commission is to go into all the world and preach the gospel etc.

What if I was an unbeliever who was given this link by a friend who was a believer?

What do think this unbeliever would believe about Christianity?????????

Christians arguing over doctrine. How pathetic. You have become inclusive instead of exclusive.

I can share why I now believe in the post instead of pre without trying to convince my hearor that I am right and he is wrong. (example)I believe this and such and such because of this text added to this text etc etc. But I dare not put a "Thus saith the Lord" to my view nor do I think any of you would either.

Well, enough of the admonishing. Please be encouraged by my words here. I am not judging or condemning. I'm asking you all to search your hearts and ask if Jesus is pleased with some of the things you have posted. If you agree He is not, then reterun to your first love...Jesus first and then your brothers and sisters, no matter what camp of eschatology they fall into.

AMEN??

YBIC,

FRANK

[Nero's Fiddle]

Bravo, choobaca!

You wrote exactly what I would have, had I not been so afraid of having my head bitten off yet again.

I came to this board having spent a good deal of time at secular boards. I was quite used to arguments and debates turned personal attacks on those sites. However, I was certainly not expecting to find such behavior here.

The timing of the Rapture is NOT an essential point of doctrine. The knowledge that the Holy Spirit of God indwells each of us, making us brothers and sisters through our rebirths in God, is.

The lack of grace shown by many of the posters involved in this argument frightens and saddens me, and I daresay grieves the Holy Spirit.

"By this all men shall know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another."

I would cite more Scripture, but merely opening a Bible to the New Testament yields an overwhelming supply. We should all confess our sins, and turn to God's word with renewed love and dedication to our Lord.

God bless you all.

All the love I have through Christ,

Nero's Fiddle

[RGR]

Bravo, choobaca!

You wrote exactly what I would have, had I not been so afraid of having my head bitten off yet again.

I came to this board having spent a good deal of time at secular boards. I was quite used to arguments and debates turned personal attacks on those sites. However, I was certainly not expecting to find such behavior here.

The timing of the Rapture is NOT an essential point of doctrine. The knowledge that the Holy Spirit of God indwells each of us, making us brothers and sisters through our rebirths in God, is.

The lack of grace shown by many of the posters involved in this argument frightens and saddens me, and I daresay grieves the Holy Spirit.

"By this all men shall know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another."

I would cite more Scripture, but merely opening a Bible to the New Testament yields an overwhelming supply. We should all confess our sins, and turn to God's word with renewed love and dedication to our Lord.

God bless you all.

All the love I have through Christ,

Nero's Fiddle

Right on-spoken in wisdom!!!

[ginakay]

Thanks Choobaca, your voice of reason and love is welcome. I had been reading at this thread to try to understand where the post-trib folk are coming from and was disappointed to be reading the mud slinging etc. I want to hear all the opinions and the scriptures that back the opinions. I don't have a closed mind.

On the other hand I don't think those who believe pre-trib will be suckers and fall for the anti-Christ if the rapture does not take place before the tribulation. The same Holy Spirit who brought them to the faith will guide them and lead them in the right way.

As was pointed out--no one has absolutely clear vision and understanding on the end time events ! (some think they do but...)