Christian and Holy Spirit

[Kot]

People say, for many reasons, that they are Christians. However, to be a full Christian one must Believe in Jesus Christ, be baptized in water, and finally, receive the Holy Spirit (John 3: 5-8). These are the three things that certify one to be called a Christian. Many people believed in Jesus Christian and were baptized in water in the name of Jesus Christ but they did not receive the Holy Spirit. 

Now many of you out there can point out as many bible texts to say that we have received the Holy Spirit but I would like to bring a few texts together that support that we have not received the Holy Spirit thus we are yet to be confirmed as Christian. Now, some of you may disagree with me and I accept your opinion but please consider my views and the text that support the views. 

First of all, we must believe that Jesus Christ is our savior who saved us from our sins in our heart ( and they are much text that supports this). After believing in Jesus Christ, one must be baptized in water in the name of Jesus Christ ( also many text support this which I am not putting it up). Finally, one must receive the Holy Spirit to be called a full Christian ( John 3: 5-8).

 Jesus promised his disciples that he will send to them a helper which is the Holy Spirit (John 14: 16-17) and the people of the world can not receive it, know, and see. The disciples only will receive the Holy Spirit.

Before Jesus went up to heaven he asked his disciples to go to Jerusalem and stay there and they must not go out unless they receive Holy Spirit that he will send to them  (Luke 24: 49). This means after they receive the Holy Spirit they will go out otherwise they will not. 

Jesus sends to them the Holy Spirit (act 33: 3; act 1; 1-4 and act 2_ 1-4). 

From Jerusalem, the apostles heard that some of the people in Samaria believed in Jesus Christ so they sent Peter and John which means the apostles had already received the Holy Spirit thus they went out leaving Jerusalem, (Acts 8: 14).

Peter and John went out and prayed for the Samaritan believers to receive the Holy Spirit. This means that when Holy Spirit first came down the believers in Samaria did not receive the Holy Spirit. 

In verse 16 it says; "These people had been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus, but the Holy Spirit had not yet come down on any of them. This is why Peter and John prayed." this means that they heard the good news, they believed in Jesus Christ and they baptized in water but they did not receive the Holy Spirit when the holy spirit came down. 

Acts 8 verse 16 gives the full meaning of John 14 verses 16 to 17 which says people of the world will not know, see and receive the Holy Spirit but only the apostles will. verse 17 says only when the apostles prayed for them (people) did they receive the Holy Spirit. 

Paul did the same things in Ephesus as Peter and John. Paul asks the people that did they receive the Holy Spirit when they believe. The people replied and said they have not heard of the Holy Spirit. Then he asked them what baptism did they receive. They replied to Paul and said, John's baptism, which is the water baptism. This means that they had not received the Holy Spirit when the people heard the good news, believe in Jesus Christ, and Baptize in water. Only when the time the apostles prayed for the people they have received the Holy Spirit.

As indicated in the above scripture, the apostles were given the work of praying for the people so that they could receive the Holy Spirit as the Holy Spirit was only given to the Apostles and not everyone, (John 14: 16-17). However, when persecution spread (Acts 11: 19), most of the apostles have been killed, (acts 7: 57-60; Acts 8: 1-3).

In Antioch, people were arguing with the apostles ( acts 15: 1-18) and they decided to wrote letters, Acts 15: 19: "19 “So I think we should not make things hard for those who have turned to God from among the non-Jewish people. 20 Instead, we should send a letter telling them only the things they should not do:.". Paul, Peter, John, and other apostle hide and begin to write the letter which we now see in the Bible the letters they wrote which makes up the news testament. 

We do know the apostles died, however, the Good news spread to the world but the work of the Holy Spirit the apostles carry out did not spread.

Now in my opinion today, people in the world who heard the Good news, believe in Jesus Christ, and were baptized in water did not receive the Holy Spirit to fully become Christians and enter the Kingdome of God, (John 3: 5-8). therefore, some still ask questions about Holy Spirit and about becoming Christians. 

In my opinion, I believe that the work of the Holy Spirit will begin in the last days. However, before I go ahead and support my view with bible texts, I would like to receive your opinion.

Before you give your opinion, you may try to give many explaining to convince me or the audience that we have received the Holy Spirit despite the above text and views that I have laid out, but I have gone through all the bible text that you will provide from Geneses to Revelation over and over. I have also used many Christian blogs and google searches to search individual words such as Christina and Holy Spirit over and over and I understanding them. You may give your best explanation from many different angles but I have gone through all of them and I refer to the above views that I have provided.

 Thank you. 

Edited July 20, 2021 by Kot

[R. Hartono]

test

[missmuffet]

13 hours ago, Kot said:

People say, for many reasons, that they are Christians. However, to be a full Christian one must Believe in Jesus Christ, be baptized in water, and finally, receive the Holy Spirit (John 3: 5-8). These are the three things that certify one to be called a Christian. Many people believed in Jesus Christian and were baptized in water in the name of Jesus Christ but they did not receive the Holy Spirit. 

Now many of you out there can point out as many bible texts to say that we have received the Holy Spirit but I would like to bring a few texts together that support that we have not received the Holy Spirit thus we are yet to be confirmed as Christian. Now, some of you may disagree with me and I accept your opinion but please consider my views and the text that support the views. 

First of all, we must believe that Jesus Christ is our savior who saved us from our sins in our heart ( and they are much text that supports this). After believing in Jesus Christ, one must be baptized in water in the name of Jesus Christ ( also many text support this which I am not putting it up). Finally, one must receive the Holy Spirit to be called a full Christian ( John 3: 5-8).

 Jesus promised his disciples that he will send to them a helper which is the Holy Spirit (John 14: 16-17) and the people of the world can not receive it, know, and see. The disciples only will receive the Holy Spirit.

Before Jesus went up to heaven he asked his disciples to go to Jerusalem and stay there and they must not go out unless they receive Holy Spirit that he will send to them  (Luke 24: 49). This means after they receive the Holy Spirit they will go out otherwise they will not. 

Jesus sends to them the Holy Spirit (act 33: 3; act 1; 1-4 and act 2_ 1-4). 

From Jerusalem, the apostles heard that some of the people in Samaria believed in Jesus Christ so they sent Peter and John which means the apostles had already received the Holy Spirit thus they went out leaving Jerusalem, (Acts 8: 14).

Peter and John went out and prayed for the Samaritan believers to receive the Holy Spirit. This means that when Holy Spirit first came down the believers in Samaria did not receive the Holy Spirit. 

In verse 16 it says; "These people had been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus, but the Holy Spirit had not yet come down on any of them. This is why Peter and John prayed." this means that they heard the good news, they believed in Jesus Christ and they baptized in water but they did not receive the Holy Spirit when the holy spirit came down. 

Acts 8 verse 16 gives the full meaning of John 14 verses 16 to 17 which says people of the world will not know, see and receive the Holy Spirit but only the apostles will. verse 17 says only when the apostles prayed for them (people) did they receive the Holy Spirit. 

Paul did the same things in Ephesus as Peter and John. Paul asks the people that did they receive the Holy Spirit when they believe. The people replied and said they have not heard of the Holy Spirit. Then he asked them what baptism did they receive. They replied to Paul and said, John's baptism, which is the water baptism. This means that they had not received the Holy Spirit when the people heard the good news, believe in Jesus Christ, and Baptize in water. Only when the time the apostles prayed for the people they have received the Holy Spirit.

As indicated in the above scripture, the apostles were given the work of praying for the people so that they could receive the Holy Spirit as the Holy Spirit was only given to the Apostles and not everyone, (John 14: 16-17). However, when persecution spread (Acts 11: 19), most of the apostles have been killed, (acts 7: 57-60; Acts 8: 1-3).

In Antioch, people were arguing with the apostles ( acts 15: 1-18) and they decided to wrote letters, Acts 15: 19: "19 “So I think we should not make things hard for those who have turned to God from among the non-Jewish people. 20 Instead, we should send a letter telling them only the things they should not do:.". Paul, Peter, John, and other apostle hide and begin to write the letter which we now see in the Bible the letters they wrote which makes up the news testament. 

We do know the apostles died, however, the Good news spread to the world but the work of the Holy Spirit the apostles carry out did not spread.

Now in my opinion today, people in the world who heard the Good news, believe in Jesus Christ, and were baptized in water did not receive the Holy Spirit to fully become Christians and enter the Kingdome of God, (John 3: 5-8). therefore, some still ask questions about Holy Spirit and about becoming Christians. 

In my opinion, I believe that the work of the Holy Spirit will begin in the last days. However, before I go ahead and support my view with bible texts, I would like to receive your opinion.

Before you give your opinion, you may try to give many explaining to convince me or the audience that we have received the Holy Spirit despite the above text and views that I have laid out, but I have gone through all the bible text that you will provide from Geneses to Revelation over and over. I have also used many Christian blogs and google searches to search individual words such as Christina and Holy Spirit over and over and I understanding them. You may give your best explanation from many different angles but I have gone through all of them and I refer to the above views that I have provided.

 Thank you. 

You do not need to be baptized in order to go to heaven. It is not a salvation issue. 

[Jayne]

"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved."

Baptism does not save.  It just gets you wet.  Why do we baptize then?  Because it is imitating Christ and it is a picture of our being dead, buried, and risen IN him.  God asked us to not TO save but because we are saved.  It is our first public testimony.

The Holy Spirit is given to the Christian upon their salvation.

To say that you believe in Jesus, but upon some future date, you must receive the Holy Spirit to BE saved is an inerrant teaching.  To say that belief in Christ does not save until you are dunked in the water and at some future time indwelled by the Holy Spirit, one is saying untruthfully that Jesus Christ cannot and does not save.  One is saying the water saves and the Holy Spirit, beyond the blood of Christ saves.  See - untrue.

From  Ephesians 1: = "In him you also, when you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and believed in him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of his glory."

This CLEARLY state that when you believed in Jesus Christ immediately the Holy Spirit sealed you.

[Riverwalker]

13 hours ago, Kot said:

People say, for many reasons, that they are Christians. However, to be a full Christian one must Believe in Jesus Christ, be baptized in water, and finally, receive the Holy Spirit (John 3: 5-8). These are the three things that certify one to be called a Christian. Many people believed in Jesus Christian and were baptized in water in the name of Jesus Christ but they did not receive the Holy Spirit. 

Now many of you out there can point out as many bible texts to say that we have received the Holy Spirit but I would like to bring a few texts together that support that we have not received the Holy Spirit thus we are yet to be confirmed as Christian. Now, some of you may disagree with me and I accept your opinion but please consider my views and the text that support the views. 

First of all, we must believe that Jesus Christ is our savior who saved us from our sins in our heart ( and they are much text that supports this). After believing in Jesus Christ, one must be baptized in water in the name of Jesus Christ ( also many text support this which I am not putting it up). Finally, one must receive the Holy Spirit to be called a full Christian ( John 3: 5-8).

 Jesus promised his disciples that he will send to them a helper which is the Holy Spirit (John 14: 16-17) and the people of the world can not receive it, know, and see. The disciples only will receive the Holy Spirit.

Before Jesus went up to heaven he asked his disciples to go to Jerusalem and stay there and they must not go out unless they receive Holy Spirit that he will send to them  (Luke 24: 49). This means after they receive the Holy Spirit they will go out otherwise they will not. 

Jesus sends to them the Holy Spirit (act 33: 3; act 1; 1-4 and act 2_ 1-4). 

From Jerusalem, the apostles heard that some of the people in Samaria believed in Jesus Christ so they sent Peter and John which means the apostles had already received the Holy Spirit thus they went out leaving Jerusalem, (Acts 8: 14).

Peter and John went out and prayed for the Samaritan believers to receive the Holy Spirit. This means that when Holy Spirit first came down the believers in Samaria did not receive the Holy Spirit. 

In verse 16 it says; "These people had been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus, but the Holy Spirit had not yet come down on any of them. This is why Peter and John prayed." this means that they heard the good news, they believed in Jesus Christ and they baptized in water but they did not receive the Holy Spirit when the holy spirit came down. 

Acts 8 verse 16 gives the full meaning of John 14 verses 16 to 17 which says people of the world will not know, see and receive the Holy Spirit but only the apostles will. verse 17 says only when the apostles prayed for them (people) did they receive the Holy Spirit. 

Paul did the same things in Ephesus as Peter and John. Paul asks the people that did they receive the Holy Spirit when they believe. The people replied and said they have not heard of the Holy Spirit. Then he asked them what baptism did they receive. They replied to Paul and said, John's baptism, which is the water baptism. This means that they had not received the Holy Spirit when the people heard the good news, believe in Jesus Christ, and Baptize in water. Only when the time the apostles prayed for the people they have received the Holy Spirit.

As indicated in the above scripture, the apostles were given the work of praying for the people so that they could receive the Holy Spirit as the Holy Spirit was only given to the Apostles and not everyone, (John 14: 16-17). However, when persecution spread (Acts 11: 19), most of the apostles have been killed, (acts 7: 57-60; Acts 8: 1-3).

In Antioch, people were arguing with the apostles ( acts 15: 1-18) and they decided to wrote letters, Acts 15: 19: "19 “So I think we should not make things hard for those who have turned to God from among the non-Jewish people. 20 Instead, we should send a letter telling them only the things they should not do:.". Paul, Peter, John, and other apostle hide and begin to write the letter which we now see in the Bible the letters they wrote which makes up the news testament. 

We do know the apostles died, however, the Good news spread to the world but the work of the Holy Spirit the apostles carry out did not spread.

Now in my opinion today, people in the world who heard the Good news, believe in Jesus Christ, and were baptized in water did not receive the Holy Spirit to fully become Christians and enter the Kingdome of God, (John 3: 5-8). therefore, some still ask questions about Holy Spirit and about becoming Christians. 

In my opinion, I believe that the work of the Holy Spirit will begin in the last days. However, before I go ahead and support my view with bible texts, I would like to receive your opinion.

Before you give your opinion, you may try to give many explaining to convince me or the audience that we have received the Holy Spirit despite the above text and views that I have laid out, but I have gone through all the bible text that you will provide from Geneses to Revelation over and over. I have also used many Christian blogs and google searches to search individual words such as Christina and Holy Spirit over and over and I understanding them. You may give your best explanation from many different angles but I have gone through all of them and I refer to the above views that I have provided.

 Thank you. 

Do not confuse the Baptism of the Holy Spirit (Acts 2) for the power to minister which is given to some

and the Presence of the Holy Spirit which is given to all

[Alive]

Yes--its vitally important that this consversation plays out.

There is only one 'kind of christian'--and that is one that the Father has placed into Christ, so that such a one shared the history of the Cross, Resurrection and Ascension having died and then raised once again in NEW LIFE---Born from above.

Period! We must have a consensus on this! This is vital. Each of us are 'sealed' with the Holy Spirit instantaneously at the moment of this born from above. What I have described is NOT a sequence---it all happens as a transcendant act of God.

I will stop here for now---but it is vitally important that we get these things right.

[Kot]

8 hours ago, Jayne said:

"Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved."

Baptism does not save.  It just gets you wet.  Why do we baptize then?  Because it is imitating Christ and it is a picture of our being dead, buried, and risen IN him.  God asked us to not TO save but because we are saved.  It is our first public testimony.

Johan 3: 5

⁵ Jesus answered, “Believe me when I say that everyone must be born from water and the Spirit. Anyone who is not born from water and the Spirit cannot enter God’s kingdom.

[Kot]

8 hours ago, Jayne said:

To say that you believe in Jesus, but upon some future date, you must receive the Holy Spirit to BE saved is an inerrant teaching.  To say that belief in Christ does not save until you are dunked in the water and at some future time indwelled by the Holy Spirit, one is saying untruthfully that Jesus Christ cannot and does not save.  One is saying the water saves and the Holy Spirit, beyond the blood of Christ saves.  See - untrue.

John 14:16-17

6 I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper[a] to be with you forever. 17 The Helper is the Spirit of truth. The people of the world cannot accept him, because they don’t see him or know him. But you know him. He lives with you, and he will be in you.

Luke 24: 49

49 Remember that I will send you the one my Father promised. Stay in the city until you are given that power from heaven.”

Act 8: 14-16

14 The apostles in Jerusalem heard that the people of Samaria had accepted the word of God. So they sent Peter and John to the people in Samaria. 15 When Peter and John arrived, they prayed for the Samaritan believers to receive the Holy Spirit. 16 These people had been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus, but the Holy Spirit had not yet come down on any of them. This is why Peter and John prayed. 17 When the two apostles laid their hands on the people, they received the Holy Spirit.

Act 19: 1-9

While Apollos was in the city of Corinth, Paul was visiting some places on his way to Ephesus. In Ephesus he found some other followers of the Lord. 2 He asked them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?”

These followers said to him, “We have never even heard of a Holy Spirit!”

3 Paul asked them, “So what kind of baptism did you have?”

They said, “It was the baptism that John taught.”

4 Paul said, “John told people to be baptized to show they wanted to change their lives. He told people to believe in the one who would come after him, and that one is Jesus.”

5 When these followers heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 Then Paul laid his hands on them, and the Holy Spirit came on them. They began speaking different languages and prophesying. 7 There were about twelve men in this group.

 

 

[Kot]

7 hours ago, Josheb said:

Hmmm...... 

What exactly is intended by the use of the term, "full Christian"? Can someone be a partial Christian? Where would I find such a thing as a "partial Christian" in scripture? If there's no such thing as a "full" Christian then either 1) clarify and explain exactly what is meant, or 2) discard that nonsense. 

Did the repentant thief hanging next to Jesus on the cross become a Christian? If so then water baptism is not a "must". 

Is it possible for someone not having received to be a Christian? Where in the Bible might I find someone not having received the Holy Spirit being called a "Christian"? If there is no such scripture then either 1) clarify and explain exactly what is meant when saying "receive the Holy Spirit" or 2) discard that nonsense. 

Is the difference between 1) regeneration and 2) the "gift of the Spirit" acknowledged? Is that difference understood? Is it possible for a person to become a Christian without having been regenerated by God? Do you think regeneration is something different than being "born again," or "born anew from above" (Gk.: "gennēthē anōthen")? Do you think the believers  who believed in Jesus Christ the resurrected Son of God mentioned in Acts 19 were regenerate? They clearly had not received the "baptism" of the Holy Spirit, but were they regenerate, born again or born anew believers? 

• If they believed in Jesus, then they did so solely in their own flesh? 
• Was their belief mere intellectual assent? 
• Scripture says no one can confess Christ as Lord except via the Holy Spirit. Does that mean at a minimum they ad enough Spirit to confess Christ?
• Had the Acts 19 believers in Jesus who had only the baptism of John been regenerated by the Spirit? 
• Having been regenerated by the Holy Spirit they were clearly in need of the Spirit's baptism. Had one of them died before being baptized would they have gone to heaven?  

Do you think God normally regenerates a person without also indwelling them with His Spirit? Where in scripture might I find that is the normal, ordinary, routine practice of God?

 

I mean no disrespect but I do mean to speak plainly and directly: There is a lot of bad pneumatology (doctrine of the Spirit) and until you, me, and everyone else here can answer these questions AND answer them correctly we have no business telling anyone else what and how to believe, and we most definitely should make every precaution not to suggest, imply, or insinuate someone is not a Christian because they haven't received the Spirit the way we think they should. 

Hmmm...... Let me make sure I understand all this correctly. This op occurs in a Christian discussion board filled with already-regenerate Christians in hopes of a discussion with other already-regenerate Christians about what it means to be a Spirit-indwelt Christian...... based on your opinions; your opinions about scripture? Is that what I am supposed to understand from this op?

Let's start with this line in which the following is stated: "In my opinion, I believe that the work of the Holy Spirit will begin in the last days." Are you aware the "last days" began in the New Testament era? I can not only evidence that fact; I can PROVE the last days began in the New Testament era, and I can do so with several plainly stated scriptures and not a scintilla of added interpretation or opinion on my part. I read the word "will" being used as in "will begin" as if the "work of the Holy Spirit" is a future, yet to be realized, hasn't yet happened event because you believe it will happen in the last days. Do I understand that correctly?

If I have misunderstood your view of the Holy Spirit working in the last days then please do clarify and explain what you mean because scripture does in fact undeniably and irrefutably state the last days were occurring in the New Testament. If I made a mistake then I will gladly acknowledge it and delete this portion of the post. 

If the last days began in the New Testament era then the Holy Spirit has already begun its work. 

If it is being suggested none of us are "full Christians" because we need to receive the Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit hasn't yet begun its work because it will do so only in the last days and those days have not yet arrived that's a problem - for many reasons.

If I can prove the last days began long ago then the op's content about the Holy Spirit's work in the last days and our not being "full Christians" warrants correction. 

So is the request for people's personal opinions sincere? Is there a sincere desire for scripture over personal opinion? Scripture plainly read as written? Once having read God's as written for what it actually states will you bow to scripture's authority over personal opinions, or is this entire op just an exercise in competing personal opinions? Just let me know because I've no interest in personal opinions that different from what is plainly stated in scripture, especially not from those purposing to tell others how to view their life in Christ based on those opinions. There are many places where God's word leaves room for diverse understanding but this is not one of them.

Just let me know.   

 

Think about this. While you're doing so I will assemble the many scriptures that tell us the last days began in the NT era. Each of us must bow to them as the Spirit inclines (assuming we've received the Holy Spirit ). 

 

 

And for the readers inclined to complain about my directness with this op I ask that just a little patience be extended so how this plays out can be observed because we know how a person responds to God's plainly stated Word is informative. 

John 3: 5

5 Jesus answered, “Believe me when I say that everyone must be born from water and the Spirit. Anyone who is not born from water and the Spirit cannot enter God’s kingdom.

John 14:16-17

6 I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper[a] to be with you forever. 17 The Helper is the Spirit of truth. The people of the world cannot accept him, because they don’t see him or know him. But you know him. He lives with you, and he will be in you.

Luke 24: 49

49 Remember that I will send you the one my Father promised. Stay in the city until you are given that power from heaven.”

Act 8: 14-16

14 The apostles in Jerusalem heard that the people of Samaria had accepted the word of God. So they sent Peter and John to the people in Samaria. 15 When Peter and John arrived, they prayed for the Samaritan believers to receive the Holy Spirit. 16 These people had been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus, but the Holy Spirit had not yet come down on any of them. This is why Peter and John prayed. 17 When the two apostles laid their hands on the people, they received the Holy Spirit.

Act 19: 1-9

While Apollos was in the city of Corinth, Paul was visiting some places on his way to Ephesus. In Ephesus he found some other followers of the Lord. 2 He asked them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?”

These followers said to him, “We have never even heard of a Holy Spirit!”

3 Paul asked them, “So what kind of baptism did you have?”

They said, “It was the baptism that John taught.”

4 Paul said, “John told people to be baptized to show they wanted to change their lives. He told people to believe in the one who would come after him, and that one is Jesus.”

5 When these followers heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 Then Paul laid his hands on them, and the Holy Spirit came on them. They began speaking different languages and prophesying. 7 There were about twelve men in this group.

[Kot]

7 hours ago, Josheb said:

Hmmm...... 

What exactly is intended by the use of the term, "full Christian"? Can someone be a partial Christian? Where would I find such a thing as a "partial Christian" in scripture? If there's no such thing as a "full" Christian then either 1) clarify and explain exactly what is meant, or 2) discard that nonsense. 

Did the repentant thief hanging next to Jesus on the cross become a Christian? If so then water baptism is not a "must". 

Is it possible for someone not having received to be a Christian? Where in the Bible might I find someone not having received the Holy Spirit being called a "Christian"? If there is no such scripture then either 1) clarify and explain exactly what is meant when saying "receive the Holy Spirit" or 2) discard that nonsense. 

Is the difference between 1) regeneration and 2) the "gift of the Spirit" acknowledged? Is that difference understood? Is it possible for a person to become a Christian without having been regenerated by God? Do you think regeneration is something different than being "born again," or "born anew from above" (Gk.: "gennēthē anōthen")? Do you think the believers  who believed in Jesus Christ the resurrected Son of God mentioned in Acts 19 were regenerate? They clearly had not received the "baptism" of the Holy Spirit, but were they regenerate, born again or born anew believers? 

• If they believed in Jesus, then they did so solely in their own flesh? 
• Was their belief mere intellectual assent? 
• Scripture says no one can confess Christ as Lord except via the Holy Spirit. Does that mean at a minimum they ad enough Spirit to confess Christ?
• Had the Acts 19 believers in Jesus who had only the baptism of John been regenerated by the Spirit? 
• Having been regenerated by the Holy Spirit they were clearly in need of the Spirit's baptism. Had one of them died before being baptized would they have gone to heaven?  

Do you think God normally regenerates a person without also indwelling them with His Spirit? Where in scripture might I find that is the normal, ordinary, routine practice of God?

 

I mean no disrespect but I do mean to speak plainly and directly: There is a lot of bad pneumatology (doctrine of the Spirit) and until you, me, and everyone else here can answer these questions AND answer them correctly we have no business telling anyone else what and how to believe, and we most definitely should make every precaution not to suggest, imply, or insinuate someone is not a Christian because they haven't received the Spirit the way we think they should. 

Hmmm...... Let me make sure I understand all this correctly. This op occurs in a Christian discussion board filled with already-regenerate Christians in hopes of a discussion with other already-regenerate Christians about what it means to be a Spirit-indwelt Christian...... based on your opinions; your opinions about scripture? Is that what I am supposed to understand from this op?

Let's start with this line in which the following is stated: "In my opinion, I believe that the work of the Holy Spirit will begin in the last days." Are you aware the "last days" began in the New Testament era? I can not only evidence that fact; I can PROVE the last days began in the New Testament era, and I can do so with several plainly stated scriptures and not a scintilla of added interpretation or opinion on my part. I read the word "will" being used as in "will begin" as if the "work of the Holy Spirit" is a future, yet to be realized, hasn't yet happened event because you believe it will happen in the last days. Do I understand that correctly?

If I have misunderstood your view of the Holy Spirit working in the last days then please do clarify and explain what you mean because scripture does in fact undeniably and irrefutably state the last days were occurring in the New Testament. If I made a mistake then I will gladly acknowledge it and delete this portion of the post. 

If the last days began in the New Testament era then the Holy Spirit has already begun its work. 

If it is being suggested none of us are "full Christians" because we need to receive the Holy Spirit and the Holy Spirit hasn't yet begun its work because it will do so only in the last days and those days have not yet arrived that's a problem - for many reasons.

If I can prove the last days began long ago then the op's content about the Holy Spirit's work in the last days and our not being "full Christians" warrants correction. 

So is the request for people's personal opinions sincere? Is there a sincere desire for scripture over personal opinion? Scripture plainly read as written? Once having read God's as written for what it actually states will you bow to scripture's authority over personal opinions, or is this entire op just an exercise in competing personal opinions? Just let me know because I've no interest in personal opinions that different from what is plainly stated in scripture, especially not from those purposing to tell others how to view their life in Christ based on those opinions. There are many places where God's word leaves room for diverse understanding but this is not one of them.

Just let me know.   

 

Think about this. While you're doing so I will assemble the many scriptures that tell us the last days began in the NT era. Each of us must bow to them as the Spirit inclines (assuming we've received the Holy Spirit ). 

 

 

And for the readers inclined to complain about my directness with this op I ask that just a little patience be extended so how this plays out can be observed because we know how a person responds to God's plainly stated Word is informative. 

John 3: 5

5 Jesus answered, “Believe me when I say that everyone must be born from water and the Spirit. Anyone who is not born from water and the Spirit cannot enter God’s kingdom.

John 14:16-17

6 I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper[a] to be with you forever. 17 The Helper is the Spirit of truth. The people of the world cannot accept him, because they don’t see him or know him. But you know him. He lives with you, and he will be in you.

Luke 24: 49

49 Remember that I will send you the one my Father promised. Stay in the city until you are given that power from heaven.”

Act 8: 14-16

14 The apostles in Jerusalem heard that the people of Samaria had accepted the word of God. So they sent Peter and John to the people in Samaria. 15 When Peter and John arrived, they prayed for the Samaritan believers to receive the Holy Spirit. 16 These people had been baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus, but the Holy Spirit had not yet come down on any of them. This is why Peter and John prayed. 17 When the two apostles laid their hands on the people, they received the Holy Spirit.

Act 19: 1-9

While Apollos was in the city of Corinth, Paul was visiting some places on his way to Ephesus. In Ephesus he found some other followers of the Lord. 2 He asked them, “Did you receive the Holy Spirit when you believed?”

These followers said to him, “We have never even heard of a Holy Spirit!”

3 Paul asked them, “So what kind of baptism did you have?”

They said, “It was the baptism that John taught.”

4 Paul said, “John told people to be baptized to show they wanted to change their lives. He told people to believe in the one who would come after him, and that one is Jesus.”

5 When these followers heard this, they were baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus. 6 Then Paul laid his hands on them, and the Holy Spirit came on them. They began speaking different languages and prophesying. 7 There were about twelve men in this group.