Revelation 10

[DeighAnn]

5 hours ago, truth7t7 said:

The smoke of their torment will be "Eternal"!

It's not about what DeighaAnn thinks or feels, but what Gods word clearly states below

Revelation 14:9-11KJV

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

AND THE SMOKE....

[truth7t7]

26 minutes ago, Retrobyter said:

Shabbat shalom, truth7t7.

No, there is no "Hell." That piece of fiction comes from the Greek mythology incorporated into the "churches" in the late 100s to 300s A.D., that "Hades" is below our feet and is the domain of the god Hades, where he rules. The name "Hell" comes from Norse mythology, as one might realize watching movies, like Thor Ragnarok, where Thor's sister, "Hel," comes back to Asgard as the godess of death.

From this nonsense, comes the idea that Satan rules over Hell! HaSatan doesn't WANT to go to the Lake of Fire where He will endure eternal fire! He FEARS his destiny! So, it's ridiculous to think that he would rule over some burning "Hell" in this current time period.

There IS a "Lake of Fire burning with Brimstone" or a "Lake of Fire and Sulfur" or a "Lake of Burning Sulfur." THIS is where haSatan is going to go. (Revelation 20:10.) THIS is where the Beast and the False Prophet are going to go. (Revelation 19:20.) THIS is where the unjust people are going to go, after they first stand trial at the Great White Throne Judgment. (Revelation 20:11-15.) This much is READILY learned from Scripture.

In the meantime, death and decay come to all. However, the dead small and great, the just and the unjust, are going to STAND before the Throne! They shall have to be resurrected to stand trial, and this will fulfill Yeshua`s prophecy and promise:

John 5:25-29 (KJV)

25 "Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. 26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself; 27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man. 28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation."

So, because God the Word became a man, Yeshua` the Messiah of God and the Son of God, and became a true Human Being, a "Son of man," He has been given the authority to judge all at the Great White Throne Judgment. The just, or rather, those justified by God, will claim the blood of the Messiah and will go freely into His Father's Kingdom. However, the unjust, those who were never justified by God, the ungodly, will be punished in the Lake of Fire, which was the fate of the devil and his messengers.

Revelation 21:5-8 (KJV)

5 And he that sat upon the throne (God the Father) said,

"Behold, I make all things new."

And he said unto me,

"Write: for these words are true and faithful."

6 And he said unto me,

"It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely. 7 He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son. 

8 "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death."

Just a little additional information:

Another Greek word, that is really a transliteration of a Hebrew phrase, that was translated as "Hell," was "ge'enna" (spelled gamma-epsilon-epsilon-nu-nu-alpha) often written "gehenna," suggesting at one point it was two Greek words where the second word began with rough breathing. It comes from the Hebrew words "gei-Hinnowm," which means the "Valley of-Hinnowm." This is a VERY REAL PLACE, just outside of the Old City of Jerusalem, in the southeast corner close to where the trash used to be burned (and still is). Kings of old would set up their judgment seats within that valley, facing Jerusalem and the Temple, with the trash burnpit on the left and the Golden Gate, leading to the Temple, on the right. The accused would stand trial at the king's judgment seat and if found guilty of a capital crime, would be sentenced to stoning and burning on the left. Those acquitted would be set free to the right, and their duty was to immediately thank God for His mercies and forgiveness with a sacrifice.

This is also where the later kings of Judah set up an idol of Molech where they sacrificed their children to the fires set in his "belly."

It's a good bet to believe that Yeshua` will set up His Great White Throne for judgment in this same place, and those on the left will be consigned to the Lake of Fire.

Furthermore, a king is a judge, especially a king of Israel. So, it is not impossible for Yeshua` to be judging his people and the rest of the world from His throne in Israel throughout the Millennium, the FIRST 1,000 years of His Kingdom.

That burning place below Don't look like fiction to me, perhaps the Jehovah's Witnesses spent tooo much time at your front door?

The smoke of their torment will be "Eternal"!

It's not about what DeighaAnn thinks or feels, but what Gods word clearly states below

Revelation 14:9-11KJV

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

Edited January 22, 2022 by truth7t7

[DeighAnn]

24 minutes ago, Retrobyter said:

John 5:25-29 (KJV)

25 "Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. 26 For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself; 27 And hath given him authority to execute judgment also, because he is the Son of man. 28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, 29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation."

Matthew 27:52 AND THE GRAVES WERE OPENED  and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,

Matthew 27:53 And came out of the graves after His resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

[DeighAnn]

2 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

The smoke of their torment will be "Eternal"!

You said it yourself, THE SMOKE. 
Where does smoke come from? 
What becomes of smoke? 
Once something is CONSUMED does it exist any longer?   
 

[truth7t7]

1 minute ago, DeighAnn said:

You said it yourself, THE SMOKE. 
Where does smoke come from? 
What becomes of smoke? 
Once something is CONSUMED does it exist any longer?   
 

Its states tormented with fire and brimstone, its states for ever and ever, how long is that?

Revelation 14:9-11KJV

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

[DeighAnn]

5 minutes ago, truth7t7 said:

That burning place below Don't look like fiction to me, perhaps the Jehovah's Witnesses spent tooo much time at your front door?

The smoke of their torment will be "Eternal"!

It's not about what DeighaAnn thinks or feels, but what Gods word clearly states below

Revelation 14:9-11KJV

9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,

10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:

11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

Read it as if you weren't a Christian.  

Drink the wrath
Tormented in fire in presence of angels and Lamb
Smoke ascendeth forever.  

WHO IS OUR REST? OUR LORD AND SAVIOUR
 
THEY NEVER HAVE REST NEITHER DAY NOR NIGHT BECAUSE THEY DON'T EXIST.  

You have to leave the FLESH body OF THOUGHT and think in the spiritual LIFE  BEING PROMISED 

There we are living in a place to wonderful for words and GOD is dwelling amongst us.  It is beautiful and perfect and there is nothing that offends.  It is all about being holy and righteous and loving God and everyone.  

And there is the lake of fire with your family and friends that didn't 'believe' screaming in a fire that never ends.  How do you think that would MAKE LIFE BETTER for GOD or us?  

Eternal torture goes against who GOD is.  Vengeance is one thing but God is seeking RIGHTEOUSNESS FROM US so He Himself can not act UN RIGHTEOUSLY.  

GOD isn't looking for anyone to say they 'love' Him because the alternative is so bad that it is the only way out.  THAT isn't love that is just settling for something not horrible.  Would you want anyone around you if that was the only reason they were there?  

 

[truth7t7]

49 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

 THEY NEVER HAVE REST NEITHER DAY NOR NIGHT BECAUSE THEY DON'T EXIST.  

You have to leave the FLESH body OF THOUGHT and think in the spiritual LIFE  BEING PROMISED 

There we are living in a place to wonderful for words and GOD is dwelling amongst us.  It is beautiful and perfect and there is nothing that offends.  It is all about being holy and righteous and loving God and everyone.  

And there is the lake of fire with your family and friends that didn't 'believe' screaming in a fire that never ends.  How do you think that would MAKE LIFE BETTER for GOD or us?  

Eternal torture goes against who GOD is.  Vengeance is one thing but God is seeking RIGHTEOUSNESS FROM US so He Himself can not act UN RIGHTEOUSLY.  

GOD isn't looking for anyone to say they 'love' Him because the alternative is so bad that it is the only way out.  THAT isn't love that is just settling for something not horrible.  Would you want anyone around you if that was the only reason they were there?  

 

Once they die they don't exist?

As I thought, Jehovah's Witness, 7th Day Adventism Annihilationism

[Retrobyter]

19 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Matthew 27:52 AND THE GRAVES WERE OPENED  and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,

Matthew 27:53 And came out of the graves after His resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many.

Shabbat shalom, DeighAnn.

Yeah, but they will arise as bodies that have been CHANGED in the General Resurrection of the Just! You don't know this because you're stuck on thinking that we get our "new bodies" when we go to "Heaven" when we die.

But, that's not what the Scriptures say. Paul said in 1 Corinthians 15:

1 Corinthians 15:35-57 (KJV)

35 But some man will say,

"How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?"

36 Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die: 37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain: 38 But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body. 

 

[Think about this for a moment: We have a physical seed that is placed in the ground, and the seed coat dies, then the germ of the seed grows rapidly and bursts out of the ground as a physical PLANT! The change in what it looked like before it went into the ground and after it comes out of the ground is monumental! It's like the difference between the caterpillar before it goes into the chrysalis and the monarch that emerges out of the chrysalis! Both are physical, but both are significantly altered!]

 

39 All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds. 40 There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.

 

[Here are FIVE types of physical flesh! There are...

1. The flesh of men - these are examples of a terrestrial body = sooma psuchikon,
2. The flesh of beasts - these are examples of a terrestrial body = sooma psuchikon,
3. The flesh of fishes - these are examples of a terrestrial body = sooma psuchikon,
4. The flesh of birds - these are examples of a terrestrial body = sooma psuchikon, & 
5. The celestial body = sooma pneumatikon.

And, some examples of a sooma pneumatikon are "the sun, the moon, and the stars."

 

41 There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory.

42 So also is the resurrection of the dead.
It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption: 
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory:
it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power: 
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body.

There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body. 45 And so it is written,

"The (first) man - Aadaam - was made a living soul (air-breather)"; (Genesis 2:7.)

the last Adam was made a quickening spirit (life-giving air-blaster). 46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual (air-blasting), but that which is natural (air-breathing); and afterward that which is spiritual (air-blasting). 47 The first man is of the earth (soil), earthy (soil-like): the second man is the Lord from heaven (the sky). 48 As is the earthy (soil-like), such are they also that are earthy (soil-like): and as is the heavenly (above-the-sky-like), such are they also that are heavenly (above-the-sky-like). 49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy (soil-like), we shall also bear the image of the heavenly (above-the-sky-like).

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption. 51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but WE SHALL ALL BE CHANGED, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised INCORRUPTIBLE, and WE SHALL BE CHANGED. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written,

"Death is swallowed up in victory!" (Hosea 13:14.)

55 [Ha! Ha!] O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory? 56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law. 57 But thanks be to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ (our Master Yeshua` the Messiah)!

[truth7t7]

19 minutes ago, Josheb said:

Be fair. 

Annihilationism has always existed in Christian thought. It existed in Jewish thought before Christ incarnate. Just because it has been associated in modern times with those two cults does not mean the point of view is wrong. That is guilt by association. Guilt by association is a logical fallacy. Shall we call all Dispensational Premillennialist liars because there have been so many repeated false teachers within that theology? No! Of course not. 

 

 

.

I'm not calling anybody a liar as you falsely suggest

The doctrine of Annihilationism is way out in left field, unscriptural

Do you also deny conscious torment of the wicked in Hell/The Lake of Fire?

Edited January 22, 2022 by truth7t7

[DeighAnn]

1 hour ago, truth7t7 said:

Once they die they don't exist?

As I thought, Jehovah's Witness, 7th Day Adventism Annihilationism

I don't know what Jehovah's Witness nor 7th Day Adventism nor Annihilationism stands for or against or means so all that is wasted space putting forth the words of man and not speaking to the words of God.  We can be a part of the solution or a part of the problem.  Time is short and soon there will be almost no truth to be found anywhere.  Men know more about what other men have told them rather than where the Holy Spirit  leads.  

What I have said that isn't written?  Does it offend you that THEIR TORMENT GOES UP IN SMOKE FOREVER AND EVER?  Does it bother you that CONSUMED means there is an end?   WHY get mad at me?  I didn't write it and I am not the one teaching falsely.  

Maybe CONSUMED doesn't mean consumed at all.  IF IT INDEED doesn't mean that then PLEASE ENLIGHTEN ME.  If 'the smoke of their torment' isn't what goes on forever and ever then PLEASE ENLIGHTEN ME.  I have this huge problem in which I take what is written as a literal happening.  Sometimes what is happening is given to me in terms of symbols to help me UNDERSTAND more completely what is being told me.  Sometimes figures of speech are used to make me STOP and say HEY, what is up here, what am I supposed to be noticing that I would have just read over like it was nothing had it not been put for in a figure of speech.  

Tormented by fire, in the presence of angels and the Lamb, AND THE SMOKE goes forever.  

NOW you tell me what does that mean IF WHAT IS WRITTEN IS NOT WHAT IS MEANT.  

I read 'what is written' and take that to BE GODS TRUTH, no matter no matter who has said WHAT before me. 

I will neither endorse nor reject ANYTHING I read in GODS WORDS because someone before me had a thought on it.  

I ABSOLUTELY BELIEVE THAT SATAN HAS TRIED TO POLLUTE GODS WORDS in everyway possible over the past 2000 years.  I think the subjects with the HIGHEST amount of debate ARE SPECIFICALLY because Satan doesn't want those TRUTHs to be known.  

So LABEL away if you must, but ask yourself who and what does it serve.  I will gladly go word for word with GODS words to get to the truth but will not discuss how 'men' down through the years have divided and labeled everything. That certainly isn't at Gods hands.  

ANY and EVERY single teaching that in anyway suggests that the Bible is not to be studied more intensely than ever and it isn't more important that at any other time in the past, GOES AGAINST GODS TRUTH.   A mill, pre trib, OSAS, gentile church, OT is for Jews, EVERY single one of them has been given a label to which the LABEL IS DISCUSSED rather than Gods Words. 

THE FAMINE IN THE END TIMES IS FOR ?  How do you think that is accomplished?  WE ARE LIVING IT.

Amos 8:7 The LORD hath sworn by the excellency of Jacob, Surely I will never forget any of their works.

Amos 8:8 Shall not the land tremble for this, and every one mourn that dwelleth therein? and it shall rise up wholly as a flood; and it shall be cast out and drowned, as by the flood of Egypt.

Amos 8:9 And it shall come to pass in that day, saith the Lord GOD, that I will cause the sun to go down at noon, and I will darken the earth in the clear day:

Amos 8:10 And I will turn your feasts into mourning, and all your songs into lamentation; and I will bring up sackcloth upon all loins, and baldness upon every head; and I will make it as the mourning of an only son, and the end thereof as a bitter day.

Amos 8:11 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord GOD, that I will send a famine in the land, not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the LORD

Amos 8:12 And they shall wander from sea to sea, and from the north even to the east, they shall run to and fro to seek the word of the LORD, and shall not find it.

HERE WE ARE.  I put forth EXACTLY what is written and what do I receive?