The Revelation of Jesus Christ

[Selah7]

8 minutes ago, Alive said:

Roy…please, lets not this. Of course I understand the Day of the Lord being that last day when All things are consummated, but John was not on that day. He was in the first century.

 

The experiment please.

You say, "please, lets not this."  

Let's not do this?  You mean let's not put down what scripture says?  

I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet, 

Revelation 1:10 (KJV)

John was taken to...where?  The LORD'S DAY!  

FUTURE!

[Alive]

Ok….I am asking a mod to close this OP.

Please close it. It is a failure, but it did illustrate what I intended, so not a total loss.

Folks are not capable of escaping from preconceived doctrine even for a simple honest experiment. Remember, this is eschatology and there are as many honest God fearing views as Carter has liver pills. Not all can be correct, but all can be wrong.

Humility and a willingness to admit, we may be wrong. It is possible, ya know.

Close the OP, please.

[OneLight]

@Alive ... you do realize that you are asking people to forget what has been shown to them, right?  When God shows you something, how easy is it for you to ignore what He has said?  Some people have spent years reading Revelation and you expect them to drop all the Holy Spirit has shown them for an experiment.  Sounds to me like the idea is a failure, not the people who refuse to let go.  One of the scariest things I've heard come from the pulpit is being told to forget all you know about a portion of scripture so the speaker can show you something new.  I've heard that more than once.

[Selah7]

1 hour ago, Alive said:

Ok….I am asking a mod to close this OP.

Please close it. It is a failure, but it did illustrate what I intended, so not a total loss.

Folks are not capable of escaping from preconceived doctrine even for a simple honest experiment. Remember, this is eschatology and there are as many honest God fearing views as Carter has liver pills. Not all can be correct, but all can be wrong.

Humility and a willingness to admit, we may be wrong. It is possible, ya know.

Close the OP, please.

But the Word of God (Scripture) is never wrong….

And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.

- John 8:32 (KJV)

[Alive]

15 minutes ago, OneLight said:

@Alive ... you do realize that you are asking people to forget what has been shown to them, right?  When God shows you something, how easy is it for you to ignore what He has said?  Some people have spent years reading Revelation and you expect them to drop all the Holy Spirit has shown them for an experiment.  Sounds to me like the idea is a failure, not the people who refuse to let go.  One of the scariest things I've heard come from the pulpit is being told to forget all you know about a portion of scripture so the speaker can show you something new.  I've heard that more than once.

This is a mischaracterization of what this OP is all about.

Its almost laughable, actually. Ya don't have to forget anything, just place yourself for a moment in the place I have suggested.

Having said this, I suspect no man alive today understands the letter.

Look--I ask again--how many interpretations of the letter are proposed by saints convinced it is the Holy Spirit that has shown them. All are different--wildly so. All cannot be right, but all can be wrong.

C'mon, man. Get real brother. Not all spiritual on me. This is eschatology.

:-)

[Selah7]

12 minutes ago, Alive said:

This is a mischaracterization of what this OP is all about.

Its almost laughable, actually. Ya don't have to forget anything, just place yourself for a moment in the place I have suggested.

Having said this, I suspect no man alive today understands the letter.

Look--I ask again--how many interpretations of the letter are proposed by saints convinced it is the Holy Spirit that has shown them. All are different--wildly so. All cannot be right, but all can be wrong.

C'mon, man. Get real brother. Not all spiritual on me. This is eschatology.

:-)

eschatology:
noun

“The part of theology concerned with death, judgment, and the final destiny of the soul and of humankind.”

Christian hope is concerned with eschatology: death, judgment, and the final destiny of the soul and of humankind.  

No experiments needed; no fooling around.

Just the Truth of God’s Word.  

[OneLight]

31 minutes ago, Alive said:

This is a mischaracterization of what this OP is all about.

Its almost laughable, actually. Ya don't have to forget anything, just place yourself for a moment in the place I have suggested.

Having said this, I suspect no man alive today understands the letter.

Look--I ask again--how many interpretations of the letter are proposed by saints convinced it is the Holy Spirit that has shown them. All are different--wildly so. All cannot be right, but all can be wrong.

Reality ... you have admitted that you stay away from the book of  Revelation because you just can't grasp it, that it is confusing to you.  Because of this, you seem to assume many are like you and have just as much of a hard time with the prophecy as you do.  When I have a hard time with something, I don't assume everyone does and defend my inability to understand when someone else tells me what they think. 

BYW ... I find you comments about the teaching from the Holy Spirit into a persons life disdainful. 

31 minutes ago, Alive said:

C'mon, man. Get real brother. Not all spiritual on me. This is eschatology.

:-)

Sorry Joe, I disagree.  I am real, even if you can't or refuse to see it.

[missmuffet]

6 minutes ago, OneLight said:

Reality ... you have admitted that you stay away from the book of  Revelation because you just can't grasp it, that it is confusing to you.  Because of this, you seem to assume many are like you and have just as much of a hard time with the prophecy as you do.  When I have a hard time with something, I don't assume everyone does and defend my inability to understand when someone else tells me what they think. 

BYW ... I find you comments about the teaching from the Holy Spirit into a persons life disdainful. 

Sorry Joe, I disagree.  I am real, even if you can't or refuse to see it.

I also had a difficult time grasping and understanding some of the play on words in the book of Revelation. I didn't ignore it I got a really good study of the book written by Bible scholars that I trusted and studied the book. 

 

 

[OneLight]

17 minutes ago, missmuffet said:

I also had a difficult time grasping and understanding some of the play on words in the book of Revelation. I didn't ignore it I got a really good study of the book written by Bible scholars that I trusted and studied the book.

Don't get me wrong, I also agree that the probability of finding one person in History, or today. that fully understands this prophecy is so close to zero we might as well use zero.  You will, however, find those who claim they do, but that is between them and God.  Always take what others tell you and place it beside scripture to see if it lines up, or if the pieces are somehow forced together, making an unclear picture.  I know I don't have a full understanding of Revelation, but I'm not going to ignore what He has shown me, just like I will not stand up and say anyone who disagrees with me is wrong.

[Alive]

25 minutes ago, OneLight said:

Reality ... you have admitted that you stay away from the book of  Revelation because you just can't grasp it, that it is confusing to you.  Because of this, you seem to assume many are like you and have just as much of a hard time with the prophecy as you do.  When I have a hard time with something, I don't assume everyone does and defend my inability to understand when someone else tells me what they think. 

BYW ... I find you comments about the teaching from the Holy Spirit into a persons life disdainful. 

Sorry Joe, I disagree.  I am real, even if you can't or refuse to see it.

I have been dutifully, before our Lord, studying scripture longer than most here and doing so while also studying voraciously what my brethren over the centuries have had to say. I have read more books on scripture and eschatolgy than I can count. This year alone 6 books on eschatology from various POV--with bible open or rather the miriad resources in my bible study software.

The Holy Spirit has taught me a great deal about Himself and our common Salvation and Life in Him on this earth and even a bit afterwards. I speak as a fool, now. 

He has directed me to people and places speaking to me directly and things panned out as He indicated. Souls saved, demons castout--the Lord revealing Himself in miraculous ways. Go here, son--I have something to show you and something for you to do. Half the people here don't even think a one on one personal relationship with our Lord is possible anymore. THAT is a mystery to me.

I say this to express that He has never actually shed light for me on Revelation---perhaps that means nothing and I am fine with that. Each member of the Body is different and functions differently, but I do know that should He desire to show me, He would and could--and I have asked. I believe some Light has recently been shown, but not interpretations of the letter.

Anyway, when I consider the above, along with the 'fact' that so many of my brethren claim the Lord has shown them the correct interpretation and yet are wildly different---I must ask myself how can this be.

I conclude once again....not all can be correct, but all may very well be wrong.

It is bewildering to me, why this reality can't be faced square on and then from there have honest Truth seeking conversations starting from that point.

How can it be. The Lord is not the author of confusion, my brethren.

Actually I am near certain, I understand why this is as it is, from both a natural perspective and a spiritual one.

Many of us have erected high towers and for various reasons. These things are not salvation related.

Do you know the world of the not yet saved, looks on this and shakes a collective head and says---these people all read the same bible and yet differ so much and are viciously divided by it.

All I have tried to do is suggest having an openness to a great deal being wrong.

I also suggest being about His business--expressing Christ-- in word and in deed.

He will return in due time--it matters not when. What matters is Love. Love for God and Love for our neighbors.

Maranatha--since I was a babe.

To recap--when someone in the OP posts that the Holy Spirit has taught them this stuff and other brothers say the same? And yet they differ? What are you to think about that?

Take it to the Lord--ask Him. He may answer. Is He Lord? Or is some construct.