Leonardo Von Posted June 22, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 1,265 Topics Per Day: 0.44 Content Count: 2,637 Content Per Day: 0.92 Reputation: 760 Days Won: 0 Joined: 07/06/2016 Status: Offline Birthday: 02/04/1972 Share Posted June 22, 2022 Based on the Holy Scripture, what is your conclusion? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdHoc Posted June 22, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,035 Content Per Day: 3.33 Reputation: 1,453 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/29/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted June 22, 2022 4 hours ago, Leonardo Von said: Based on the Holy Scripture, what is your conclusion? The Church. There is not a single scripture that alludes to Israel being Christ's Bride/Wife Eve is a picture of Christ's Bride (Eph.5:31-32) - the Church The Church is flesh and bone of Christ - they must have the same nature (Gen.2:23, Eph.5:30) The Church comes out of Christ at His death like Eve (Jn.12:24) Israel is Christ's "brethren according to the flesh". "Brethren" means brother, not Bride, by having the same Father The Church is "one Spirit with Jesus" in the context of being "one flesh" (1st Cor.6:15-17) The Church is espoused to Jesus, not Israel (2nd Cor.11:2) In the parable of the Wedding Feast (Matt.22:1-14), Israel, the original guests refused to come The saints who are raptured and in heaven in Revelation 19 are the Bride. Israel is still in unbelief at this time In Revelation 21:9 the Wife of Christ is the City. The City is the Tabernacle and Temple of God (v.3). Only the Church is the Temple of God. Israel serve the Temple but are not it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who me Posted June 23, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,300 Content Per Day: 1.72 Reputation: 1,685 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/27/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted June 23, 2022 18 hours ago, Leonardo Von said: Based on the Holy Scripture, what is your conclusion? We are saved by faith not by works, so unless the Jews like the gentiles accept Jesus as there saviour they are no longer part of Israel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiards Ball Posted June 23, 2022 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,502 Content Per Day: 0.66 Reputation: 662 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/05/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted June 23, 2022 God the Father is married to Israel! "Return O Israel, for I am a husband to you." And God HATES divorce and does whatever he wants, "Our God is in Heaven, He does whatever He pleases." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billiards Ball Posted June 23, 2022 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 3 Topic Count: 5 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 1,502 Content Per Day: 0.66 Reputation: 662 Days Won: 0 Joined: 02/05/2018 Status: Offline Share Posted June 23, 2022 1 hour ago, Who me said: We are saved by faith not by works, so unless the Jews like the gentiles accept Jesus as there saviour they are no longer part of Israel. We ARE saved by faith not works, unsaved Jews are ISRAEL and Christian Jews like me are the ISRAEL OF GOD. Thinking Jews aren't still Israel causes a lot of NT errors in interpretation. Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
other one Posted June 23, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 29 Topic Count: 598 Topics Per Day: 0.08 Content Count: 56,128 Content Per Day: 7.56 Reputation: 27,856 Days Won: 271 Joined: 12/29/2003 Status: Offline Share Posted June 23, 2022 Neither::: Quote Rev 21:9-11 9 And one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues, came and spoke with me, saying, "Come here, I shall show you the bride, the wife of the Lamb." 10 And he carried me away in the Spirit to a great and high mountain, and showed me the holy city, Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, NASB 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who me Posted June 24, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,300 Content Per Day: 1.72 Reputation: 1,685 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/27/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted June 24, 2022 On 6/23/2022 at 3:31 PM, Billiards Ball said: We ARE saved by faith not works, unsaved Jews are ISRAEL and Christian Jews like me are the ISRAEL OF GOD. Thinking Jews aren't still Israel causes a lot of NT errors in interpretation. Thanks. There are only two types of people in the world. Saved or unsaved. Calling a n unsaved people group Israel, is a meaningless name. In OT terms the unsaved Jews are like the kingdom of Israel, lost in idolitary and lost in exile from their land. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdHoc Posted June 25, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,035 Content Per Day: 3.33 Reputation: 1,453 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/29/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted June 25, 2022 On 6/23/2022 at 4:31 PM, Billiards Ball said: We ARE saved by faith not works, unsaved Jews are ISRAEL and Christian Jews like me are the ISRAEL OF GOD. Thinking Jews aren't still Israel causes a lot of NT errors in interpretation. Thanks. On 6/24/2022 at 7:24 PM, Who me said: There are only two types of people in the world. Saved or unsaved. Calling a n unsaved people group Israel, is a meaningless name. In OT terms the unsaved Jews are like the kingdom of Israel, lost in idolitary and lost in exile from their land. I'm glad you both published your understanding. I would like to publish mine and let the interested reader judge. This is not for conflict, but information (although I'm sure there might be some energetic discussion). I propose that there are THREE peoples on earth. What defines them is their BIRTH or ORIGIN. And none of these three can dissolve or disappear because God has dealings with them, including PROMISES. The Nations: From Adam to Nimrod there was one race on earth. Because of a conspiracy to thwart God, God divided the languages. This in turn caused cultures to vary and soon everybody was offended by somebody else. But in this time God made two Promises to Adam and his SEED. (1) The Seed of the woman would ultimately conquer the seed of the Serpent, and (2) God would not wipe out mankind again with water. Now, it is no good to say that the Nations will be summarily sent to hell and burned up with the old earth, for that deeply rejects what God has promised to do. God's honor is deeply connected with JUSTICE and BLESSING when it comes to the seed of Adam. The Nation of Israel: Still from Adam, but via Shem and Abraham, God chose for Himself a particular Nation which He named after Jacob, son of Abraham. With this particular People God made TWO Covenants, both ratified in blood. To Abraham were a number of Promises made and Abraham's side was to circumcise his sons. 430 years later, God made another Covenant with the flourishing Nation in which Israel had to keep a moral and ritual Law given by God, and God had to prolong Israel's time in their Land in health, wealth and safety. When a Covenant is broken is does not disappear. When a Contract is broken the PENALTIES contained in the contract come into force. God's honor is deeply bound up with these Covenants. On one side He must administer JUSTICE and on the other side He must administer BLESSING. The Church: Taking men and women from both the above companies, and applying a BIRTH effected by the Holy Spirit, God raised up this third company. Since their birth, or ORIGIN is not human, they are a totally new and exclusive company. To deal with the pollution of mankind by his behavior, God allows this company to have it origin in the DEATH of Jesus (Jn.12:24). This company, called the "New Man" has its old elements destroyed by the death of Jesus and is intrinsically a new creature with no past. Jesus is Seed of the woman and future Governor of this universe, particularly the earth. His role is to introduce a JUST Government on earth and govern in such a manner as to bring BLESSING on the creature. Since He and His disciples, the New Man are still bound with the seed of the woman, God engineers a clever plan that makes this New Man Seed of Abraham but not seed of Jacob. Though God, for His glory, took mostly the base men of this world for the New Man, His HONOR it tightly bound with it. Since God's honor is bound up with each company, expect to discover that each people has a destiny and a connection with God, and no group will dissolve or disappear. Even those of the Nations who land in the Lake of Fire fulfill God's purpose. They are a living monument to God's JUSTICE. Christ's sacrifice created the JUDICIAL grounds for God to extend mercy to whom He likes. Thus we find the Bible closing with The Church perfected and displaying the glory of God, Israel recovered and restored with God fulfilling Abraham's Covenant and Israel fulfilling a New Covenant of Law (Jer.31:31-33) for their BLESSING, and the Nations subdued and RULED by Christ and the New Man for JUSTICE and BLESSING on all families (not all men). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Who me Posted June 27, 2022 Group: Royal Member Followers: 5 Topic Count: 17 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,300 Content Per Day: 1.72 Reputation: 1,685 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/27/2019 Status: Offline Share Posted June 27, 2022 On 6/25/2022 at 10:45 PM, AdHoc said: God's honor is bound up with each company, And God will keep his honour intact, we do not protect it in this issue. Israel was promised blessing for obedience to the covernant, unfortunetly Israel has universily broken the covernant. They are called to believe, to trust God and in the one he would send Jesus. The OT looked forward to his coming, the sacrifical system was a picture of Jesus. He said if you don't believe my words believe the signs, they didn't believe either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdHoc Posted June 28, 2022 Group: Worthy Ministers Followers: 4 Topic Count: 10 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 3,035 Content Per Day: 3.33 Reputation: 1,453 Days Won: 0 Joined: 10/29/2021 Status: Offline Share Posted June 28, 2022 On 6/27/2022 at 9:04 AM, Who me said: And God will keep his honour intact, we do not protect it in this issue. Israel was promised blessing for obedience to the covernant, unfortunetly Israel has universily broken the covernant. They are called to believe, to trust God and in the one he would send Jesus. The OT looked forward to his coming, the sacrifical system was a picture of Jesus. He said if you don't believe my words believe the signs, they didn't believe either. Amen! All you have said is correct. But I would like to add a little. When you break a Covenant, it does not go away. What happens is the the full brunt of the penalties come into play. If you sign a contract for a new car and you don't keep your side of the deal, the contract does not go away. It sets out to punish you Israel was called to trust in God and embrace Messiah. This they did not. That is why Paul spends three Chapters in Romans on how they will be restored without believing. You see, Hebrews 11:1 defines faith. The hope of what is UNSEEN. The second that our Lord Jesus bursts through the clouds above the Mount Olives, he is SEEN and Israel can never fulfill the requirement of faith The OT looked forward to Jesus. The sacrificial system (i) covered sins (but did not remove them), and (ii) made the flesh ritually clean. According to Ezekiel and Luke 22:15-16, the sacrificial system will resume when Jesus returns. The reason is that while our Lord Jesus fulfilled the Law, Israel didn't. Also, with the nations flowing into Jerusalem during the millennium, they will need their flesh cleansed (Zech.14:16) The Jews believed nothing except the signs. But these they attributed to Beelzebub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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