When was Jesus Christ born?

[WilliamL]

On 9/22/2022 at 1:23 PM, Spiros said:

This is another piece of information that lends credence to the September 12 3 BC theory.    

Josephus gives many precise historical details about the life of Herod, which show that he died in the spring of 4 BC. Even if one would give a year's leeway on that date, it would still mean that Herod died well before Sept. 3 BC. Which, according to the Bible, was not the case.

[Spiros]

On 9/26/2022 at 2:34 PM, WilliamL said:

Josephus gives many precise historical details about the life of Herod, which show that he died in the spring of 4 BC. Even if one would give a year's leeway on that date, it would still mean that Herod died well before Sept. 3 BC. Which, according to the Bible, was not the case.

My knowledge in history is  limited. When it comes to such a long period in the past there might be conflicting accounts of what happened. I will leave the research to the experts.

 

My understanding is that based on the combined September 12 3 BC, April 9 30 AD, model for the birth and resurrection of Jesus there rise interesting astronomical alignments that relate to the planets and the Egyptian - Giza pyramids. 

 

I will present another piece of evidence. This has to do with the celebration of Christmas on December 25. This is based on the notion that Jesus was born on December 25, 1 BC. The Romans used the Julian calendar so the year consisted of 365.25 days.

 

Jesus was crucified, and He was resurrected, and ascended to heaven at Jerusalem. This is the place also where the Holy Spirit  descended upon the Apostles and other followers of Jesus Christ.

 

We compute the Greek isopsephy value of Jerusalem as IEROYSALHM.

 

ΙΕΡΟΥΣΑΛΗΜ = 10+5+100+70+400+200+1+30+8+40 = 864

 

 This is a geodetically encoded word. If we take the square root of 864 and consider it represents an angle in degrees then we can assign it to a place on the globe. This place is in Egypt and it relates to pyramids. 

 

square root of (864) = 29.39388 => 29.39388 degrees

 

But in this analysis just like the previous cases I presented I will use the number of days in a year. Using the Julian calendar I multiply this number by 365.25 and express this in days:

 

29.39388 x 365.25 days = 10,736 days

 

https://i.postimg.cc/8CTpkr5b/Birth-to-Ascension-conventional.jpg

 

As we can see in the above image the time difference between December 25, 1 BC and May 18, 30 AD (the day Jesus ascended to heaven) is 10,736 days.

 

Edited October 10, 2022 by Spiros

[Jedi4Yahweh]

On 9/16/2022 at 7:42 PM, Spiros said:

Its possible that Herod did not die 4 BC. For example from:

 

https://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/people-cultures-in-the-bible/jesus-historical-jesus/herods-death-jesus-birth-and-a-lunar-eclipse/

 

 

This means that a date like September 12 3 BC or the birth of Jesus cannot be ruled out.

Herod was title that many Galilean rulers had.  Herod Antipas, Herod Philip, Herod Archelaus, all sons of Herod the Great.

[Anne2]

On 9/21/2022 at 8:21 PM, DeighAnn said:

It all gets reckoned from 

Luke 1:5 THERE was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.

Luke 1:6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

Luke 1:7 And they had no child, because that Elisabeth was barren, and they both were now well stricken in years.

Luke 1:8 And it came to pass, that while he executed the priest's office before God in the order of his course,

Luke 1:9 According to the custom of the priest's office, his lot was to burn incense when he went into the temple of the Lord.

Luke 1:10 And the whole multitude of the people were praying without at the time of incense.

Luke 1:11 And there appeared unto him an angel of the Lord standing on the right side of the altar of incense.

Luke 1:12 And when Zacharias saw him, he was troubled, and fear fell upon him.

Luke 1:13 But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for thy prayer is heard; and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John.


That John being John the Baptist

Who was 6 months older than Jesus.  

John conceived June 24 in  5 BC 23 Sivan
Jesus begotten Dec 25 5 BC 1 Tebeth
John born March 28 4 BC 7 Nisan
Jesus born Sept 29 4 BC  15 Tisri

The 'course of Abia'  the 8th priestly course has  very specific dates from which to work with.  Taking into consideration the traditions and travel times...


 

How do you know the dates of the courses. The courses did not agree with the weeks of the year. More weeks occurred than courses. Then when another month was periodically added to reconcile the calendar it was off even further.

[tim_from_pa]

3 hours ago, Anne2 said:

How do you know the dates of the courses. The courses did not agree with the weeks of the year. More weeks occurred than courses. Then when another month was periodically added to reconcile the calendar it was off even further.

You piqued my interest (again) in this and I found a link to one site's explanation of the priestly courses.  What I have heard over in the past was that they served on a weekly basis but all the priests were there for the feasts.  I have done a calculation myself awhile back and if we take the 48 weeks (24 x 2) plus the feast days it works out to very close to about a solar year (and about 12 lunar cycles).  However, I do not have an explanation for the years with a leap month.  However, some theologians seem to believe this makes the 8th course of Abijah fall at the same general time of the year.

It seems most others believe in the weekly cycle where they serve twice a year.  That would make the courses run around the calendar.  However, the historical reference to Abijah happening around Pentecost time frame (near the year our Lord was born) was a quote from Josephus.  I hope I piqued your interest to search and actually find this reference, but I would deem that more reliable than theories as to how the system worked.

That all said, I believe there's an  symbolic verse that states this directly and that's what I go by.  However, the division of Abijah IMO adds circumstantial evidence to support the timing. In other words, if there are other mentions that seem to take place at the same time, then it adds to the evidence that it is the correct timing.  I never pursued the Abijah theory as my primary means to arrive at the date, so I did not do detailed study. It's more of a historical thing as opposed to astronomical, the calendar and gemetria:  Purely mathematics.

Edited October 11, 2022 by tim_from_pa

[Anne2]

1 minute ago, tim_from_pa said:

You pegged my interest (again) in this and I found a link to one site's explanation of the priestly courses.  What I have heard over in the past was that they served on a weekly basis but all the priests were there for the feasts. 

The courses continued each week feast or not. In other words when ones course fell during the feasts they still served. No courses were skipped or repeated because of it. 

 

6 minutes ago, tim_from_pa said:

I have done a calculation myself awhile back and if we take the 48 weeks (24 x 2) plus the feast days it works out to very close to about a solar year (and about 12 lunar cycles).  However, I do not have an explanation for the years with a leap month.  However, some theologians seem to believe this makes the 8th course of Abijah fall at the same general time of the year.

I am not sure I am reading you correctly , but the courses were week to week feasts nor no feasts. We read about the festival sacrifices, being offered after the morning sacrifices. The morning and evening daily were continuous. The course serving that morning and evening, had all the prists help after their morning sacrifices, in slaughtering the festival offerings.

 

12 minutes ago, tim_from_pa said:

It seems most others believe in the weekly cycle where they serve twice a year.  That would make the courses run around the calendar.  However, the historical reference to Abijah happening around Pentecost time frame (near the year our Lord was born) was a quote from Josephus

I did not know it was ALSO, in Josephus. But it is in the Gospel

Lu 1:5   There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.

What reference would you like me to look at? Thanks, for putting up with me lol

[DeighAnn]

4 hours ago, Anne2 said:

How do you know the dates of the courses. The courses did not agree with the weeks of the year. More weeks occurred than courses. Then when another month was periodically added to reconcile the calendar it was off even further.

Ezekiel 45:21 In the first month, in the fourteenth day of the month, ye shall have the passover, a feast of seven days; unleavened bread shall be eaten.

[Anne2]

14 minutes ago, DeighAnn said:

Ezekiel 45:21 In the first month, in the fourteenth day of the month, ye shall have the passover, a feast of seven days; unleavened bread shall be eaten.

This doesn't answer the question I asked.

[DeighAnn]

37 minutes ago, Anne2 said:

This doesn't answer the question I asked.

You seemed to know a lot about the courses already, so maybe I misunderstood.  WHAT exactly are you asking?  How do they know the first day of the New Year that begins in spring is with the spring equinox? or that is is of equal day and night?  Or the passover 14 days later?  Or the 2 courses the priests serve every year along with the feasts?  

I am sure the internet has good information on the courses of all the priests, and when they fell so, it you take that with 

Luke 1:5 THERE was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.

The course of Abia, gives us a SPECIFIC date or 2

We know that at 6 months John leapt when Mary came having just begotten Emmanuel.  We know the season He was born so we can eliminate one of them...


Luke 1:6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

Luke 1:7 And they had no child, because that Elisabeth was barren, and they both were now well stricken in years.

Luke 1:8 And it came to pass, that while he executed the priest's office before God in the order of his course,

Luke 1:9 According to the custom of the priest's office, his lot was to burn incense when he went into the temple of the Lord.

Luke 1:10 And the whole multitude of the people were praying without at the time of incense.

Luke 1:11 And there appeared unto him an angel of the Lord standing on the right side of the altar of incense.

Luke 1:12 And when Zacharias saw him, he was troubled, and fear fell upon him.

Luke 1:13 But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: for thy prayer is heard; and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John.

Luke 1:14 And thou shalt have joy and gladness; and many shall rejoice at his birth.

Luke 1:15 For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and shall drink neither wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Ghost, even from his mother's womb.

Luke 1:16 And many of the children of Israel shall he turn to the Lord their God.

Luke 1:17 And he shall go before him in the spirit and power of Elias, to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people prepared for the Lord.

Luke 1:18 And Zacharias said unto the angel, Whereby shall I know this? for I am an old man, and my wife well stricken in years.

Luke 1:19 And the angel answering said unto him, I am Gabriel, that stand in the presence of God; and am sent to speak unto thee, and to shew thee these glad tidings.

Luke 1:20 And, behold, thou shalt be dumb, and not able to speak, until the day that these things shall be performed, because thou believest not my words, which shall be fulfilled in their season.

Luke 1:21 And the people waited for Zacharias, and marvelled that he tarried so long in the temple.

Luke 1:22 And when he came out, he could not speak unto them: and they perceived that he had seen a vision in the temple: for he beckoned unto them, and remained speechless.

Luke 1:23 And it came to pass, that, as soon as the days of his ministration were accomplished, he departed to his own house.

Luke 1:24 And after those days his wife Elisabeth conceived, and hid herself five months, saying,

From there it is just finding out the priests courses...Hope this helps you on your journey

[Omegaman 3.0]

I am just curious if it matters?