The Three Main Views of Hell

[Selah7]

7 minutes ago, Vine Abider said:

Death is the ceasing of life, therefore no ability to respond. To me, this aligns with being gone, no more, annihilation. 

But while I think annihilation has merits to consider, then there's this verse in Rev 20:15  "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire." (which was created for the devil and his angels) So some besides devil and angels go there . . . perhaps there are some we're not so aware of (pre-Adamic race perhaps?).

Yes, my understanding is that those who are not written in the book of life will join the devil and his fallen angels in the lake of fire and be no more.  That’s why there won’t be any tears in the eternity.

Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, "Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. "And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away." Then He who sat on the throne said, "Behold, I make all things new." And He said to me, "Write, for these words are true and faithful."

- Revelation 21:1-5 

 

[Vine Abider]

6 minutes ago, Selah7 said:

Yes, my understanding is that those who are not written in the book of life will join the devil and his fallen angels in the lake of fire and be no more.  That’s why there won’t be any tears in the eternity.

Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, "Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. "And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away." Then He who sat on the throne said, "Behold, I make all things new." And He said to me, "Write, for these words are true and faithful."

- Revelation 21:1-5 

 

Interesting - part of His final solution for sin.

[Mije]

Any thoughts on CS Lewis’ ideas in The Great Divorce, i.e. hell being a waiting period or even a chosen resting place of our own making, devoid of God, but a place where He is readily available should one want to choose Him still?

Many words confuse the issue for me so this picture Lewis paints is a strong one for me!

[Dennis1209]

1 hour ago, Selah7 said:

I vote for #2–annihilationism, and this is why:

As depicted in Dante's Inferno's legend, many Christians believe that an eternal searing hell fire already exists and that unsaved souls are sent there to suffer eternally.  

Funny thing is, even Satan himself is not being tormented in a searing hell, as he is about to be cast out of heaven and onto this planet, where he will pretend to be Jesus Christ.  We know this is the Antichrist (Rev. 12:7-9):

And war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels fought with the dragon; and the dragon and his angels fought, but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them in heaven any longer. So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

- Revelation 12:7-9 

I believe that the lake of fire appears at the end of the Great White Throne judgment and will last for but an instant when all that is wicked will perish, just as John 3:16 says. It will be the second death, the perishing of the soul.  Consider for a moment that the Bible says the “second death,” not the “second torture.”

Rev. 21:8 
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

 

I am not arguing, Selah; you could be correct. Consider birth and death: John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

This is two births, one physical and the second spiritual. Likewise, there are two deaths for all humanity, physical and spiritual (ruin), second death. Thus, our escape is John 3:16. Few pay attention to the verse leading up to John 3:16 with death and healing, John 3:14.

It is too long to delve into what Numbers 21:1-9 entails, what John 3:14 is referring to. But a study on Numbers 21:1-9 is enlightening to the most beloved Bible verse and understanding.

When the Bible states “forever and ever,” can it be reduced into years and a time, a certain event or date? Is that symbolic, a metaphor, or literal? All lexicons agree; it means without end.

Which one of the following verses do not literally mean without end?

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Revelation 22:5 And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.

The Greek words “forever and ever” are identical in both verses: 172 αἰών (aiōn), ῶνος (ōnos), ὁ (ho): n.masc.; ≡ DBLHebr 6409; Str 165; TDNT 1.197^[1]

1 Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (always, at all times, forever^[2])

If for ever and ever has an expiration date and is not literal, we have a problem facing eternity ourselves so that it would seem.

 

---

^[1] Swanson, James. Dictionary of Biblical Languages with Semantic Domains: Greek (New Testament) 1997: n. pag. Print.

^[2] Swanson, James. Dictionary of Biblical Languages with Semantic Domains: Greek (New Testament) 1997: n. pag. Print.

[Selah7]

51 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said:

I am not arguing, Selah; you could be correct. Consider birth and death: John 3:7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

Hey there, Dennis. . .

Actually, “born again” here means “born from above.”

56 minutes ago, Dennis1209 said:

Which one of the following verses do not literally mean without end?

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Revelation 22:5 And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.

The Greek words “forever and ever” are identical in both verses: 172 αἰών (aiōn), ῶνος (ōnos), ὁ (ho): n.masc.; ≡ DBLHebr 6409; Str 165; TDNT 1.197^[1]

1 Thessalonians 4:17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. (always, at all times, forever^[2])

If for ever and ever has an expiration date and is not literal, we have a problem facing eternity ourselves so that it would seem.

Revelation 20:10  And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

This is probably Dante’s favorite verse, where there is agony and torment forever and ever.  Does anyone think our heavenly Father would act in such a way? "Forever and ever" might be an idiom; I don’t know.  We must take into account the entirety of God’s Word. It is repeatedly stated that the wicked will perish, experience the second death, and eventually cease to exist.  It is written in Matthew 10:28:  “And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.”

Let's take a look at another description of Satan's final doom found in Ezekiel chapter 28. This is how he dies. 

Ezekiel 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

Furthermore, according to Hebrews 12, our Father is a consuming fire. Satan will be destroyed and reduced to ashes by Him.  Does that imply he will burn eternally?  No, not even Satan is tortured endlessly.

19  All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

 

[Waggles]

Why do people believe that the lake of fire - the final judgement - is made of real  physical fire and heat ??

When the dead are raised up they will have bodies and if their names are not written in the Books of Life then they are cast into the lake of fire.

This is a spiritual fire that burns without consuming - something akin to being outside on a hot summer's day and feeling the discomfort of direct sunlight. Desiring shade and relief but none is to be had.

I believe in scripture we have several clues to this -

Exodus 3:2  And the angel of the LORD appeared to him in a flame of fire out of the midst of a bush. He looked, and behold, the bush was burning, yet it was not consumed. 
3  And Moses said, “I will turn aside to see this great sight, why the bush is not burned.”

Isaiah 66:22  “For as the new heavens and the new earth that I make shall remain before me, says the LORD, so shall your offspring and your name remain. 
23  From new moon to new moon, and from Sabbath to Sabbath, all flesh shall come to worship before me, declares the LORD. 
24  “And they shall go out and look on the dead bodies of the men who have rebelled against me. For their worm shall not die, their fire shall not be quenched, and they shall be an abhorrence to all flesh.”

referenced by Jesus in Mark 9

If scripture allegedly infers that eternal punishment is not eternal then how can we have confidence in scripture promising eternal life as being eternal ??

[Dennis1209]

11 hours ago, Selah7 said:

Hey there, Dennis. . .

Actually, “born again” here means “born from above.”

Revelation 20:10  And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

This is probably Dante’s favorite verse, where there is agony and torment forever and ever.  Does anyone think our heavenly Father would act in such a way? "Forever and ever" might be an idiom; I don’t know.  We must take into account the entirety of God’s Word. It is repeatedly stated that the wicked will perish, experience the second death, and eventually cease to exist.  It is written in Matthew 10:28:  “And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.”

Let's take a look at another description of Satan's final doom found in Ezekiel chapter 28. This is how he dies. 

Ezekiel 28:18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.

Furthermore, according to Hebrews 12, our Father is a consuming fire. Satan will be destroyed and reduced to ashes by Him.  Does that imply he will burn eternally?  No, not even Satan is tortured endlessly.

19  All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.

 

Yep, a couple of view are there.

[Wayne222]

One must remember there are degrees of punishment at the last judgment. Jesus said it will be more tolerable for Sodom then for the Pharisees. Now if all get put into the lake of fire and cease to exist. Then how would it be more tolerable for some ? I believe people will exist after the judgment. But different punishment. Lake of fire can be used as a picture of God's judgement. They all are cast into God's judgement. 

[Starise]

Probably the most concerning thing about the subject is those who are going there don't realize the gravity of their situation not seeming to care while those who aren't going there study it most.

[TrueFollowerOfChrist]

I have not seen the Youtube video or read the other responses on this thread. My view based on my reading of scripture is that Hell is a literal place of torment where people will consciously suffer for all eternity with no hope of relief. Universalism makes no sense and negates holy living, evangelism, and needing to come to Christ at all. Annihilationism also makes no sense because there is no mention in scripture about Hell being temporary. Scripture seems to indicate that people are eternal, not just the ones in Heaven, but All people. In fact I believe that annihilationism would be unjust because it would allow those who spent their lives rejecting Christ to basically "get away with it". We see in Revelation that Satan, the Beast, and the false prophet are STILL in the lake of fire after 1,000 years. So even if annihilationism were true, it would mean people still suffer for at least 1,000 years.