When did God create hell and paradise ?

[R. Hartono]

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation 20%3A14&version=KJV 

The Book of Genesis did not mention the creation of hell and paradise, such as mentioned in the story of Lazarus and the rich man. The rich was tortured and Lazarus is comforted at paradise part. 

Fallen angels are also jailed in prison.

https://www.bible.com/bible/1/JUD.1.6-7.KJV

When did God create it ?

 

Edited August 8, 2023 by R. Hartono

[Retrobyter]

8 hours ago, R. Hartono said:

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation 20%3A14&version=KJV 

The Book of Genesis did not mention the creation of hell and paradise, such as mentioned in the story of Lazarus and the rich man. The rich was tortured and Lazarus is comforted at paradise part. 

Fallen angels are also jailed in prison.

https://www.bible.com/bible/1/JUD.1.6-7.KJV

When did God create it ?

Shalom, R. Hartono.

The New Testament MUST be read in light of the Old Testament. Here is what Yhudah ("Jude") said:

Jude 1:5-7 (KJV)

5 I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not. 6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. 7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Doesn't it seem rather odd that verse 6 was put in between the Exodus and the cities of S'dowm and `Amorrah (Sodom and Gomorrha)?

Here's the three verses in the Greek:

5 Ὑπομνῆσαι δὲ ὑμᾶς βούλομαι, εἰδότας ὑμᾶς ἅπαξ τοῦτο, ὅτι ὁ Κύριος, λαὸν ἐκ γῆς Αἰγύπτου σώσας, τὸ δεύτερον τοὺς μὴ πιστεύσαντας ἀπώλεσεν. 6 ἀγγέλους τε τοὺς μὴ τηρήσαντας τὴν ἑαυτῶν ἀρχὴν, ἀλλὰ ἀπολιπόντας τὸ ἴδιον οἰκητήριον, εἰς κρίσιν μεγάλης ἡμέρας, δεσμοῖς ἀϊδίοις ὑπὸ ζόφον τετήρηκεν. 7 ὡς Σόδομα καὶ Γόμορρα, καὶ αἱ περὶ αὐτὰς πόλεις τὸν ὅμοιον τούτοις τρόπον ἐκπορνεύσασαι, καὶ ἀπελθοῦσαι ὀπίσω σαρκὸς ἑτέρας, πρόκεινται δεῖγμα, πυρὸς αἰωνίου δίκην ὑπέχουσαι.

A transliteration of these verses would be ...

5 Hupomneesai de humas boulomai, eidotas humas hapax touto, hoti ho Kurios, laon ek gees Aiguptou soosas, to deuteron tous mee pisteusantos apoolesen. 6 aggelous te tous mee teereesantas teen heautoon archeen, alla apolipontas to idion oikeeteerion, eis krisin megalees heemeras, desmois aidiois hupo zofon teteereeken. 7 hoos Sodoma kai Gomorra, kai hia peri autas poleis ton homoion toutois tropon ekporneusasai, kai apelthousai opisoo sarkos heteras, prokeintai deigma, puros aiooniou dikeen hupechousai.

A word-for-word translation of these verses would be ...

5 To-remind but you I-want, having-known you at-one-time all-these-things, that the Lord, a-people out of-Land of-Egypt having-saved, the second-[time] those not having-believed/trusted He-destroyed. 6 messengers both(OR) the-ones not having-guarded/ having-watched-over the their-own beginning/origin, but having-left-behind the their-own house, into judgment of-a-great day, in-chains everlasting under darkness He-keeps/guards/watches-over. 7 like Sodoma and Gomorra, and the around them cities/towns the-ones in-like manner with-them having-given-themselves-up-to-fornication, and having-followed after flesh strange, are-set-forth-as an-example, by-fire everlasting an-execution-of-sentence undergoing.

The middle verse is ABOUT Korah and his buddies who stood against Mosheh ("Moses"), thinking themselves "God's messengers":

Numbers 16:1-40 (KJV)

1 Now Korah, the son of Izhar, the son of Kohath, the son of Levi, and Dathan and Abiram, the sons of Eliab, and On, the son of Peleth, sons of Reuben, took men: 2 And they rose up before Moses, with certain of the children of Israel, two hundred and fifty princes of the assembly, famous in the congregation, men of renown: 3 And they gathered themselves together against Moses and against Aaron, and said unto them, 

"Ye take too much upon you, seeing all the congregation are holy, every one of them, and the LORD is among them: wherefore then lift ye up yourselves above the congregation of the LORD?"

4 And when Moses heard it, he fell upon his face: 5 And he spake unto Korah and unto all his company, saying,

"Even to morrow the LORD will shew who are his, and who is holy; and will cause him to come near unto him: even him whom he hath chosen will he cause to come near unto him. 6 This do; Take you censers, Korah, and all his company; 7 And put fire therein, and put incense in them before the LORD to morrow: and it shall be that the man whom the LORD doth choose, he shall be holy: ye take too much upon you, ye sons of Levi."

8 And Moses said unto Korah,

"Hear, I pray you, ye sons of Levi: 9 Seemeth it but a small thing unto you, that the God of Israel hath separated you from the congregation of Israel, to bring you near to himself to do the service of the tabernacle of the LORD, and to stand before the congregation to minister unto them? 10 And he hath brought thee near to him, and all thy brethren the sons of Levi with thee: and seek ye the priesthood also? 11 For which cause both thou and all thy company are gathered together against the LORD: and what is Aaron, that ye murmur against him?"

12 And Moses sent to call Dathan and Abiram, the sons of Eliab: which said,

"We will not come up: 13 Is it a small thing that thou hast brought us up out of a land that floweth with milk and honey, to kill us in the wilderness, except thou make thyself altogether a prince over us? 14 Moreover thou hast not brought us into a land that floweth with milk and honey, or given us inheritance of fields and vineyards: wilt thou put out the eyes of these men? we will not come up."

15 And Moses was very wroth, and said unto the LORD,

"Respect not thou their offering: I have not taken one ass from them, neither have I hurt one of them!"

16 And Moses said unto Korah,

"Be thou and all thy company before the LORD, thou, and they, and Aaron, to morrow: 17 And take every man his censer, and put incense in them, and bring ye before the LORD every man his censer, two hundred and fifty censers; thou also, and Aaron, each of you his censer."

18 And they took every man his censer, and put fire in them, and laid incense thereon, and stood in the door of the tabernacle of the congregation with Moses and Aaron. 19 And Korah gathered all the congregation against them unto the door of the tabernacle of the congregation: and the glory of the LORD appeared unto all the congregation.

20 And the LORD spake unto Moses and unto Aaron, saying, 

21 "SEPARATE YOURSELVES FROM AMONG THIS CONGREGATION, THAT I MAY CONSUME THEM IN A MOMENT!" 

22 And they fell upon their faces, and said,

"O God, the God of the spirits of all flesh, shall one man sin, and wilt thou be wroth with all the congregation?!"

23 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 

24 "Speak unto the congregation, saying, 'Get you up from about the tabernacle of Korah, Dathan, and Abiram!'"

25 And Moses rose up and went unto Dathan and Abiram; and the elders of Israel followed him. 26 And he spake unto the congregation, saying,

"Depart, I pray you, from the tents of these wicked men, and touch nothing of theirs, lest ye be consumed in all their sins!"

27 So they gat up from the tabernacle of Korah, Dathan, and Abiram, on every side: and Dathan and Abiram came out, and stood in the door of their tents, and their wives, and their sons, and their little children. 28 And Moses said,

"Hereby ye shall know that the LORD hath sent me to do all these works; for I have not done them of mine own mind. 29 If these men die the common death of all men, or if they be visited after the visitation of all men; then the LORD hath not sent me. 30 But if the LORD make a new thing, and the earth open her mouth, and swallow them up, with all that appertain unto them, and they go down quick into the pit; then ye shall understand that these men have provoked the LORD."

31 And it came to pass, AS HE HAD MADE AN END OF SPEAKING ALL THESE WORDS, THAT THE GROUND CLAVE ASUNDER THAT WAS UNDER THEM: 32 AND THE EARTH OPENED HER MOUTH, AND SWALLOWED THEM UP, AND THEIR HOUSES, AND ALL THE MEN THAT APPERTAINED UNTO KORAH, AND ALL THEIR GOODS. 33 THEY, AND ALL THAT APPERTAINED TO THEM, WENT DOWN ALIVE INTO THE PIT, AND THE EARTH CLOSED UPON THEM: AND THEY PERISHED FROM AMONG THE CONGREGATION. 34 And all Israel that were round about them fled at the cry of them: for they said,

"Lest the earth swallow us up also!"

35 AND THERE CAME OUT A FIRE FROM THE LORD, AND CONSUMED THE TWO HUNDRED AND FIFTY MEN THAT OFFERED INCENSE.

36 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 

37 "Speak unto Eleazar the son of Aaron the priest, that he take up the censers out of the burning, and scatter thou the fire yonder; for they are hallowed. 38 The censers of THESE SINNERS AGAINST THEIR OWN SOULS, let them make them broad plates for a covering of the altar: for they offered them before the LORD, therefore they are hallowed: and they shall be a sign unto the children of Israel."

39 And Eleazar the priest took the brasen censers, wherewith they that were burnt had offered; and they were made broad plates for a covering of the altar: 40 To be a memorial unto the children of Israel, that no stranger, which is not of the seed of Aaron, come near to offer incense before the LORD; that he be not as Korah, and as his company: as the LORD said to him by the hand of Moses.

And, now these "modern" BONEHEADS who call themselves "scientists" and "evolutionists", thinking they're so "sophisticated," have the nerve to say, "There is NO GOD"?!!! THEIR DAY IS COMING ... JUST AS SURELY!!!

Anyway, these are the "messengers" who stood against Mosheh. THIS is the Lake of Fire, created on that day as a "new thing!" It shall be opened again, and it will STAY OPEN!

Isaiah 66:15-24 (KJV)

15 FOR, BEHOLD, THE LORD WILL COME WITH FIRE, AND WITH HIS CHARIOTS LIKE A WHIRLWIND, TO RENDER HIS ANGER WITH FURY, AND HIS REBUKE WITH FLAMES OF FIRE.

16 For BY FIRE AND BY HIS SWORD WILL THE LORD PLEAD WITH ALL FLESH: AND THE SLAIN OF THE LORD SHALL BE MANY.

17 "They that sanctify themselves, and purify themselves in the gardens behind one tree in the midst, eating swine's flesh, and the abomination, and the mouse, shall be consumed together," saith the LORD.

18 "For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory. 19 And I will set a sign among them, and I will send those that escape of them unto the nations, to Tarshish, Pul, and Lud, that draw the bow, to Tubal, and Javan, to the isles afar off, that have not heard my fame, neither have seen my glory; and they shall declare my glory among the Gentiles. 20 And they shall bring all your brethren for an offering unto the LORD out of all nations upon horses, and in chariots, and in litters, and upon mules, and upon swift beasts, to my holy mountain Jerusalem," saith the LORD, "as the children of Israel bring an offering in a clean vessel into the house of the LORD. 21 And I will also take of them for priests and for Levites," saith the LORD.

22 "For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me," saith the LORD, "so shall your seed and your name remain. 23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me," saith the LORD.

24 "AND THEY SHALL GO FORTH, AND LOOK UPON THE CARCASES OF THE MEN THAT HAVE TRANSGRESSED AGAINST ME: FOR THEIR WORM SHALL NOT DIE, NEITHER SHALL THEIR FIRE BE QUENCHED; AND THEY SHALL BE AN ABHORRING UNTO ALL FLESH."

As far as "paradise" goes, the word is transliterated from the Greek word "paradeisos" ("παράδεισος") 

3857 paradeisos παράδεισος, ου, ὁ (par-ad'-i-sos). Of Oriental origin (compare pardeec); a park, i.e. (specially), an Eden (place of future happiness, "paradise"):
-- paradise.

6508 pardeec (pardes) פַרְדֵּס (par-dace'). Of foreign origin; a park:
-- forest, orchard.

Since it has been rendered as a "forest" or an "orchard," it is a "park OF TREES!" John used the word in Revelation 2:

Revelation 2:7 (KJV)

7 "He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God."

And, the "tree of life" is found later in the same book when the New Jerusalem is being described:

Revelation 22:1-5 (KJV)

1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb. 2 In the midst of the street of it (the city), and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations. 3 And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him: 4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads. 5 And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.

So, originally, the "paradise" or the "park" was the GARDEN of Eden. Now, it has been "transplanted," so to speak, into the New Jerusalem that will descend upon the New Earth.

[garee]

On 8/7/2023 at 7:29 PM, R. Hartono said:

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Revelation 20%3A14&version=KJV 

The Book of Genesis did not mention the creation of hell and paradise, such as mentioned in the story of Lazarus and the rich man. The rich was tortured and Lazarus is comforted at paradise part. 

Fallen angels are also jailed in prison.

https://www.bible.com/bible/1/JUD.1.6-7.KJV

When did God create it ?

 

God creates and evil by lifting his hand of mercy.  Hell is not a place it is a evil suffering dying . . the wage of sin  as in you will surely die.. 

The parable of the two teaching masters in Luke a parable  in a series of parables one after another hiding the understanding .Beginning the previous chapter 15 (no man can serve two) .

It is not to be taken literally, the spiritual gospel understanding must be search out.The thirst is for the gospel it is not offered to the dead. Many make  the mistake of literalizing it. . . missing out on the understanding as it is written (sola scriptura)  Faith(unseen)  to faith as as a law  represented by Moses   . . "Let there be" amd witness by the prophets "It was good" 

The idea of God speaking with the dead(necromancy) that still has a literal tongue and thirst for H20  is not a description of hell its one teaching authority against another.

 Two masters .

(#1)  Mammon "lust of money" worldly riches (worldly wisdom) 

(2#)  All things writen in the law and prophets or saying the same thing Moses and prophets (sola scriptura) the true riches 

Luke 16:13 No servant can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God (prophecy) and mammon. . . . . . .(worldly wisdom) 

Luke 16:16 The law and (or with) the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it.

Luke 16:29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them.

Luke 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets,(the Bible)  neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

Isaiah 8 the foundation of necromancy witnessed in Luke 16. helping us to understand the creative law of Christ faith ."Let there be" and it (the power of God was good. . . by the witness of things seen 

necromancy =  disembodied worker with a familiar spirits that peep in the night is the subject . they have no tongue or need of h20 .

Isiah 8:19-20 And when they shall say unto you, Seek unto them that have familiar spirits, and unto wizards that peep, and that mutter: should not a people seek unto their God? for the living to the dead To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

The word seek like a two sided coin "Darash "is used in seeking God through his word one side and seeking after a legion of gods through the oral traditons of dying man the dark side. .Traditions that clearly make the word of God (sola scriptura) without effect.In the end showing there is no light of the gospel in thier tunnel . . . Its a steam locomotive at 80/90 mph . .should of went on the soul train the glory way .Don't need no ticket just leap on board and thank the lord . LOL   

 

[Who me]

On 8/8/2023 at 1:29 AM, R. Hartono said:

When did God create it ?

Hea en is where God is.

As God has always existed so heaven has always existed. 

He'll is where God is not. He consciously  withdrew  his presence from the area where hell is.

 

C.s. Lewes pictured hell as being g smaller than an atom, in that compared to love hate is nothing.

[WilliamL]

On 8/7/2023 at 6:29 PM, R. Hartono said:

The Book of Genesis did not mention the creation of hell and paradise, such as mentioned in the story of Lazarus and the rich man.

Eden, which God made (Gen. 2:8) was a paradise. Hell (Sheol/Hades), the place of those souls of the dead that are separated from God (as Who me pointed out), is essentially man-made.

[Know Jah]

Rich man and Lazarus is a parable just like many of Jesus examples. God didn't create Hell and Paradise was the Garden of Eden

[R. Hartono]

8 hours ago, Know Jah said:

Rich man and Lazarus is a parable just like many of Jesus examples. God didn't create Hell and Paradise was the Garden of Eden

God would not make useless parable without any meaning.

[Desopixi Seilynam]

"And if any man will hurt them,
fire proceeds out of their mouth, and devours their enemies"
"the beast... shall make war against them... and kill them"
Revelation 11:5,7

"And the beast was taken and with him the false prophet..
these both were cast into a lake of fire burning with brimstone"

"And the rest were slain with the sword of Him that sat upon the horse
which sword proceeded from His mouth"
Revelation 19:20-21

"...Gog and Magog... a fire came down from God out of the sky and devoured them"
Revelation 20:8-9

"the sky shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat,
the land and all the works therein shall be burned up" 2 Peter 3:10-12

"And I saw a new sky and a new land, for the first sky and land had passed away,
and there was no more sea" Revelation 21:1