there are no more prophets

[Azzure]

on this other site I frequent there are some people who are attacking my friend because he gave a prophecy of revival coming and this is the verse they used to try to disprove it Yes, the Bible says that the gifts of prophecy, tongues, and knowledge will e 1 Corinthians 13:8-10 Love never fails. But where there are prophecies, they will cease; where there are tongues, they will be stilled; where there is knowledge, it will pass away. ⁹ For we know in part and we prophesy in part, ¹⁰ but when completeness comes, what is in part disappears. ¹¹ When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me. ¹² For now we see only a reflection as in a mirror; then we shall see face to face. Now I know in part; then I shall know fully, even as I am fully known

well they say since the bible is complete and perfect there are no more prophets tongues or prophecies but I recieved the same message of revival four years ago and honestly I need clarification on this verse because theyt use it constantly the gifts of prophecy, tongues, and knowledge will end

[Walkingshrimp]

Let me bring in some missing parts of that verse. When we look at the missing parts it makes more sense. The speaker here, is not saying that these gifts will be taken away and never be again. He is talking about the temporary things of the gifts. What he was saying was that charity remains forever. He was not talking about and end to the gifts of God.

What you have is an example of 'twindling the word of God'. It's one reason we are supposed to look it up for ourself and read it. Plus, that, and, some people make mistakes.

So on this verse, we know that jesus spoke about something similar. He said where there be tongues (langauges) they shall pass away. Kingdoms shall come and passaway. But God's word will remain forever.

1 Corinthains KJV

{13:4} Charity suffereth long, [and] is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up, {13:5} Doth not behave itself
unseemly, seeketh not her own, is not easily provoked,
thinketh no evil; {13:6} Rejoiceth not in iniquity, but
rejoiceth in the truth; {13:7} Beareth all things, believeth all
things, hopeth all things, endureth all things. {13:8} Charity
never faileth: but whether [there be] prophecies, they shall
fail; whether [there be] tongues, they shall cease; whether
[there be] knowledge, it shall vanish away. {13:9} For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. {13:10} But when
that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall
be done away. {13:11} When I was a child, I spake as a
child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when
I became a man, I put away childish things. {13:12} For
now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face:
now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am
known. {13:13} And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these
three; but the greatest of these [is] charity.

[Deborah_]

Broadly speaking, there are some Christians who believe that most of the spiritual gifts were only for the apostolic age ("cessationists") and others who believe that they are for the whole of the church age including today ("continuationists"). 

The cessationists use this passage in I Corinthians as their Biblical "proof text". The continuationists interpret it quite differently!

Paul says that the gifts will cease "when completeness comes". The big question is, what did he mean? Cessationists say he was talking about the completeness of the New Testament, after which we won't need any more prophecies. Personally, I think that's illogical, because the spiritual gift of prophecy in the New Testament has nothing to do with written Scripture. We have some examples in the book of Acts - notably Agabus, who prophesied a famine in Acts 11 and Paul's arrest in Acts 21. I ask you, how does the "completeness" of the New Testament have any bearing on the need for this kind of prophecy?

Being a continuationist, I believe Paul's talking about the "completeness" of all things, i.e. when Jesus returns. We won't be needing any spiritual gifts then, that's for sure, because we'll see Him face to face.

[tatwo]

On 2/11/2025 at 5:15 PM, Azzure said:

I need clarification on this verse because theyt use it constantly the gifts of prophecy, tongues, and knowledge will end

Greetings @Azzure…

@Walkingshrimp did a nice job of explaining those passages to you and gave you a nice answer… “He was not talking about and end to the gifts of God.”

I have never heard it called “twindling the word of God” before…but I get it.

On to the prophecy of revival…I suppose everyone has their own definition of revival…I think of it in terms of the word itself first. The condition of being “revived” a "restoration" or “reawakening” and I suppose there will be “some” of that.

We are at the end of the age…where there is the playing out of “final things”…and as such Paul tells us in 2^nd Thessalonians 2...that we are going to see a “falling away” a departure, forsaking, apostasy…that will occur…so that prophetic word brought forth by “your friend” needs some work.

Tatwo…

[tatwo]

Greetings @Deborah_...

I agree with your view on the Cessationism...

22 hours ago, Deborah_ said:

Paul says that the gifts will cease "when completeness comes". The big question is, what did he mean?

He addresses that in Ephesians 4:11-16 specifically verses 13 & 15. From my experience there are very few who look at the answer to your question…from this definition Deborah.

22 hours ago, Deborah_ said:

Personally, I think that's illogical, because the spiritual gift of prophecy in the New Testament has nothing to do with written Scripture.

Interesting…to say the least…I don’t believe that what you posted here is correct? At the same time I am thinking that you worded what you want to say in a less than effective manner? Perhaps you can explain in a more “specific and detailed” way?

22 hours ago, Deborah_ said:

We have some examples in the book of Acts - notably Agabus, who prophesied a famine in Acts 11 and Paul's arrest in Acts 21. I ask you, how does the "completeness" of the New Testament have any bearing on the need for this kind of prophecy?

Again…this seems awkward because you cited two passages that are indeed in the New Testament Scriptures. I am not sure what you are asking here Deborah…your ideas however…are interesting.

Tatwo...:)

[Azzure]

thank you all for your insightful replies I have heard of tempory gifts but the completeness to me was interpreted as when all things are fulfilled but tjese other people try to make the scriptures say something they are not and so I have been wondering why they are so adamant about it but now I know thank you @Deborah_for c;arifying that for me and also @Walkingshrimp very well said you explained it perfectly in my book

 

[Who me]

On 2/11/2025 at 11:15 PM, Azzure said:

on this other site I frequent there are some people who are attacking my friend because he gave a prophecy of revival coming

My 1uestion is different.

Why didn't  your friend get his ' prophecy  ' looked over, check3d, discussed by his minister?

If he has no church, minister etc who have oversight of his prophetic messages, who is checking them to see they do actually happen and who will apply  discipline  to him if he is found to be blaspheming God with made up messages.

Deut 18:21 You may say to yourselves, “How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the Lord?” 22 If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the Lord does not take place or come true, that is a message the Lord has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously, so do not be alarmed.

 

 

[Deborah_]

6 hours ago, tatwo said:

Greetings @Deborah_...

I agree with your view on the Cessationism...

He addresses that in Ephesians 4:11-16 specifically verses 13 & 15. From my experience there are very few who look at the answer to your question…from this definition Deborah.

Interesting…to say the least…I don’t believe that what you posted here is correct? At the same time I am thinking that you worded what you want to say in a less than effective manner? Perhaps you can explain in a more “specific and detailed” way?

Again…this seems awkward because you cited two passages that are indeed in the New Testament Scriptures. I am not sure what you are asking here Deborah…your ideas however…are interesting.

Tatwo...:)

I'm not "asking" anything but trying to give an answer to my own question.

Scripture records the prophecies of Agabus. It also mentions other New Testament prophets (such as the daughters of Philip, Acts 21:9). My point is, that none of these prophets wrote Scripture. The messages of people like Agabus were not for the whole church for all time, but for individuals and individual churches on specific occasions. Some prophecies (and the response to them) are  recorded for our instruction - but the prophecies themselves don't apply to us! 

Scripture, however complete, can't replace this kind of prophecy.

Personally, I don't think Paul is talking about the same thing in Ephesians 4. Did he really mean that spiritual gifts will no longer be necessary when we are mature in the faith? If so, why did he still speak in tongues? (I Corinthians 14:18) And even if you and I are mature Christians, there will always (we hope) be new believers coming into our churches, so they will need the gifts and ministries that he mentions.

[Azzure]

2 hours ago, Who me said:

My 1uestion is different.

Why didn't  your friend get his ' prophecy  ' looked over, check3d, discussed by his minister?

If he has no church, minister etc who have oversight of his prophetic messages, who is checking them to see they do actually happen and who will apply  discipline  to him if he is found to be blaspheming God with made up messages.

Deut 18:21 You may say to yourselves, “How can we know when a message has not been spoken by the Lord?” 22 If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the Lord does not take place or come true, that is a message the Lord has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously, so do not be alarmed.

 

 

That would be me I have been steering him on the right path to go and I recieved the same message a few years back as well so when I heard his prophecy something clicked in my spirit the spirit speaks to the spirit.

But the timing is not for us to know Abraham waited for many years before the promise of his son came the temple being broken and torn down spoken of by Jesus didn't happen for a long time the flood with noah didn't happen for years either a prophecy or event spoken of by God normally does not happen right away or soon as we consider soon however considering the times we live in and considering others have also recieved the same message of a revival I think soon might actually mean soon.

 

 

[Dennis1209]

On 2/12/2025 at 9:22 AM, Deborah_ said:

Broadly speaking, there are some Christians who believe that most of the spiritual gifts were only for the apostolic age ("cessationists") and others who believe that they are for the whole of the church age including today ("continuationists"). 

The cessationists use this passage in I Corinthians as their Biblical "proof text". The continuationists interpret it quite differently!

Paul says that the gifts will cease "when completeness comes". The big question is, what did he mean? Cessationists say he was talking about the completeness of the New Testament, after which we won't need any more prophecies. Personally, I think that's illogical, because the spiritual gift of prophecy in the New Testament has nothing to do with written Scripture. We have some examples in the book of Acts - notably Agabus, who prophesied a famine in Acts 11 and Paul's arrest in Acts 21. I ask you, how does the "completeness" of the New Testament have any bearing on the need for this kind of prophecy?

Being a continuationist, I believe Paul's talking about the "completeness" of all things, i.e. when Jesus returns. We won't be needing any spiritual gifts then, that's for sure, because we'll see Him face to face.

Hi Deborah,

I am not disparaging either view; it is only a personal opinion.

Reading this thread recalled a bad experience my wife had at a Pentecostal Church when she was young and impressionable. In short, everyone was getting up and running around with their hands in the air, babbling gibberish (tongues); she thought they were demonic and never went to church again for decades.

It also reminds me east of where I live, snake-handling churches and the pastors maimed for life and died by venom. Not to mention, there is a variety of public faith healing shows if anyone has ever seen the show. That is by no means to say God does not miraculously cure according to His will and purposes.

A careful reading of Mark 16:13-20, determining who the they’s and them’s are, makes me lean toward cessationist, as defined by:

A cessationist is someone who believes that certain miraculous spiritual gifts ceased to exist after the apostles died and Scripture was completed[1][2]. This view holds that while God can still perform miracles today, the Holy Spirit no longer uses individuals to perform miraculous signs[3]. Cessationists argue that in the biblical record, miracles occurred during specific periods to authenticate new messages from God, such as during the ministries of Moses, Elijah, and the apostles[3]. They believe that with the completion of foundational revelation and the apostles' role as witnesses, the apostles and associated "word gifts" like prophecy and tongues are no longer active in the church[4]. However, it's important to note that cessationists still affirm the powerful and dynamic work of the Holy Spirit in believers today, and they do not deny that God can perform miracles in response to prayer[4].

[1] Wayne A. Grudem, Systematic Theology: An Introduction to Biblical Doctrine (Leicester, England; Grand Rapids, MI: Inter-Varsity Press; Zondervan Pub. House, 2004), 1237.
[2] Wayne Grudem, Systematic Theology: An Introduction to Biblical Doctrine, Second Edition (Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan Academic, 2020), 1502.
[3] Got Questions Ministries, Got Questions? Bible Questions Answered, vol. 2 (Bellingham, WA: Faithlife, 2014–2021).
[4] Chris Green, The Message of the Church: Assemble the People before Me, ed. Derek Tidball, The Bible Speaks Today: Bible Themes Series (Nottingham, England: Inter-Varsity Press, 2013), 231.