The Last Days?

[Starise]

16 hours ago, tatwo said:

I am not completely clear as to what you are defining as the “two main camps”...would you mind defining them for me?

As it pertains to many discussions here, it’s differing views on the sequence.

16 hours ago, tatwo said:

this discussion once again becomes an argument of “ones subjective opinion against another’s”...what will be the gain? The answer is...worse than “nothing”...it will continue to divide the house. Is the Lord not glorified enough to reveal all that we need? Of course He is...is He not speaking to His sons on the earth today? Of course He is...will He not tell us all that we need to know? Of course He will.

Well I think we need to be open to it first. I won’t let division happen on my watch. My intent was just to show how current global events are taking us places. Those who know, see it, but neither do they read more into it than what is there, which is easy to do.

17 hours ago, tatwo said:

“But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come.” John 16:13 NASB

If we believe that Yahshua meant what He said then...we can know anything He wants show us and that which we require...He is our provider and protector. Some will get this and others will not...some will agree to agree...while opposition is always available...that was by God’s own design.

I have some thoughts...and questions...

I totally get your jist here. When we get that truth should we share it? I am of the opinion this is not always wise. Since God gives truth directly maybe because we asked for it, it could be for us, or He could be telling  us to share it.

We also only see some stuff “ as through a glass darkly”. I am reluctant to share anything I only know partially unless I’ve been told to share it.

Opposition is never hatched in the Spirit.

17 hours ago, tatwo said:

would say that your assessment is spot on bro...and I think that some of the responses on this forum, alone would explain this patently. Things like “all is quiet”...”wait a while longer”...”nobody can understand”...”we occupy”...and I am not criticizing nor confronting these attitudes...here...really.

These are however some of the words used by some of the “brothers” that you have referenced in this forum @Starise. I just do not see a lot of interest towards understanding the “last days” in those words and attitudes. For those of you who posses this mindset...so be it...as you wish of course.

Additionally, other brothers have said the following in response to your inquiry...” I reside in a similar environment and view it as the deceitfulness of sin.”...“the following of witchcraft is more common today than at any other point in history”...“The Bible is very clear that there will be Church but it will only be a form of Godliness and no longer the real thing.”...“39 and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be.”...“Northeast of this city lies a placid suburbia-ville. Everything is peaceful there, and the police are swift to respond to calls. That's where most churches are located.”...“There is no emphasis on fellowshipping with the one who is in the midst,”

Again I am not being critical of these words either...I am only trying to bring front and center the reasons for a sensed “discomfort” Starise. And it may not be discomfort due to the subject matter alone. It is possible that in part...the discomfort lies in dealing with the vast degree of disparity between those who have responded to you here...and the attitudes of the personages involved?

Some may feel like...“what’s the point of the discussion if we are not working to a common spiritual truth”...which is where the Lord will be found. We have had great and laborious dialogues concerning this matter of the “last days” many times...what more is there to say when we once again find ourselves at the same impasse? I can assure you of this...that behavior is not likely what the Lord is leading His family through here in these “last days.”

Well maybe you noticed, but I don’t like clashes especially between brothers. Even disagreements can carry passive aggressive traits. Sometimes these exchanges of ideas are necessary as we are fighting that invisible force behind some if it.

If you are completely  convinced through the Spirit in your own heart, then there is no reason to ever see an impasse except as it concerns relaying such thoughts to others who may not be so receptive. All kinds of people here. Young believers, older believers, people who signed in here who might not even have a firm grasp of anything yet. 
And yet I can summarize by saying I see the birth pangs. Many who read end times, if not most will agree with that. Now the level of care there might vary all the way from none at all to vague concern. Some even worry about it. Some deal with what they see as impending trouble with diversion or denial. Comfortable denial.

The harvesters in the field are trying to help as many as we can. If the storm is coming you gather the crop as fast as you can. Thinking about the storm can be a kind of diversion. Make sense?

17 hours ago, tatwo said:

If...“agreeing to disagree” is “a” measure of “maturity” what are we to do with Paul’s words from Ephesians 4...where he says we are to...“attain to the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a mature man, to the measure of the stature which belongs to the fullness of Christ...? Isn’t a primary mandate in the Kingdom of God...“speaking the truth in love, we are to grow up in all aspects into Him who is the head, even Christ?”

Where do we see the Christ making or leaving room for “agreeing to disagree” when it comes to His instruction for His Body and this...directly in regards to our understanding of the last days? If these are the last days...and I tend to think that this is so...if it shakes out like Yahshua said it will...I am convinced of no other possibility. One either agrees with His desire or they are mistaken in their judgment. Where does He compromise? Oh I understand how mankind is into compromises...but not the Christ.

In order for any agreement or even a realistic discussion on the matter...someone has got to know the mind of the Lord at least in part...for the last days that lead to the end of this age. I am sure we could do that...but that is where true maturity would have to be put on display. The “me against you” reality I often see here in the Worthy Forum adds a layer of complication on top of the fact that many people have not actually encountered each other personally...which I understand.

They have built an “online presence & relational persona” amongst themselves and they value them. However we must admit that...ones image can be managed to anything one desires...and no one will ever know the difference. There is actually little person to person accountability here on these forums in general. Sometimes that is so disappointing because without accountability to each other...there is virtually no accountability to the Lord either.

This in part is what leads to the “angst, discomfort and disagreement” of which you speak. It would seem to me that it is difficult maybe impossible in an environment that lacks any real “hermano a hermano” spiritual accountability...for there to also be a pureness of humility amongst the brethren?

Without accountability, humility...and a pure loving of the Christ in each other...what are you left with in terms of the Kingdom of God? Well whatever it is...it will not be Christ.

I would like to share about something’s I have learned in regards to the end of the age...but I would be hard pressed to do so in such a hostile and divided environment. That does not mean I wouldn’t...but in that environment it feels like unnecessary pain.

No I am not so jaded as to think everyone will or must agree on everything...however the spiritual and scriptural indications are...that the Body of Christ will unify...this is the work of the Holy Spirit. Wherever we see that unity the Holy Spirit is at work among the family...everything else is anti-christ.

I get what you’re saying here. What I was saying is that sometimes we just walk away from anything not condusive to advancement if the discussion. Walking away is not really agreeing, and sometimes we press on in love to help. 
Wars are never won with words. 
If agreement is the goal we will be sorely disappointed.

Men among men minus God won’t end well. Men Among men with God as a reference has possibilities. God changes men’s hearts. Only God.

No matter what you share here and no matter how correct it is, My expectation would never be 100% agreement although it happens. This is a place where anyone can come. I know, I don’t think that this is really what any of us wants to hear.

We can say we have scripture A and B and it correlates with current or impending events. Skeptics are going to rake over it. Those in agreement might say nothing or you might get an emo. Facts don’t necessarily ever require agreement although that would be the goal.

Best,

Tim
 

 

[Starise]

17 hours ago, tatwo said:

Does the “we” in your “we are”...agree...as to what it is that constitutes “doing the work of the Lord?” 

 “we are still to be doing the work of the Lord”...what do you mean @Starise? Care to elaborate in a specific way perhaps? What does the Body under its glorious Head look like to you...and what is He doing on the earth...today?

Whatever God wants you to do. Reaching the lost is important.

17 hours ago, tatwo said:

Great points...I too have listed these points and others like them...numerous times. With few exceptions not to many “believers” seem to be concerned about these issues and issues like them.

Not everyone is on the same page. I tend to like subjects that bore others.

17 hours ago, tatwo said:

I agree...things will get progressively worse...to use your words...exactly as the Lord said. No you’re not being pessimistic...this truth just bothers some folks around here that’s all...the continual and increasing destruction of the “human existence” is a prevailing reality today Starise.

It is an invisible spiritual and progressive decline...a skillful deception...only those who can see this...can see this...the rest are not worried.

The question I have for you @Starise is...how deep into the descent of darkness are you prepared to go?

For some people it might be better for them to just go about their day for mental health. It isn’t a subject that bodes well for day to day activity. As believers we will be protected, unless called on as martyrs, and we wouldn’t be the first. If the receptiveness isn’t there what’s the point?

The Bible says a lot of things about the progression into the new kingdom. One of the things it says is that the world is under the great deceiver. By default I think we know what that means and we can see it in real time, not that people haven’t always been deceived. If you dig to any depth in that rabbit hole a person will see it isn’t only deceptive but pure evil. 
The good news in this case is we are not under that. We are liberated, free. We have the eyes to see praise God. We are part of the new kingdom coming. We won’t suffer anything intended for them. 
They say the present doesn’t exist. It’s either looking to the next second or looking back. When you say you’re in the now you really aren’t. We are in a progressing system where God inevitably determines the final outcomes. Gods hardens hearts for His purposes ie Pharoah. So he allows it to progress something He planned eons ago.

Best,

Tim

 

[1to3]

On 5/19/2025 at 7:10 AM, Starise said:

It's the in between stuff that can show us things, or not.

 

 

On 5/20/2025 at 7:58 AM, Starise said:

I’m talking globally here. The reasons they give for doing what they do don’t add up for most thinking people.

@irs68 said:

" We have truly reached a point where good is seen as evil and evil as good." 

"As a person that studied Religion and especially ancient Religions the following of witchcraft is more common today than at any other point in history. " 

"The Last Days are connected to people that are selfish and no lo.nger desire to help those in need.   It's not just the average person in the USA but sadly many Churches have fallen into this category."

"The Bible is very clear that there will be Church but it will only be a form of Godliness and no longer the real thing."

"I haven't seen a preacher, Deacon, Lay person heal a cough in 20 years.  But there are true Churches where God is moving and lives are changing and miracles are normal to see but it used to be in many Churches but today they are just a form of Godliness."

"I could go on and on here but the truth be told we are not only mirroring the Days of Noah and Lot but have made them appear less evil when compared to the Days of Today right now."

 @grumix8 said:

"I assure you family is worth it and God wants you to do. It is hard I pray for you to make it. God will help ya. Please pray for others ! God will help ! "

@tatwo said:

"what more is there to say when we once again find ourselves at the same impasse? I can assure you of this...that behavior is not likely what the Lord is leading His family through here in these “last days.”"

 

@Starisesaid:

I totally get your jist here. When we get that truth should we share it? I am of the opinion this is not always wise. Since God gives truth directly maybe because we asked for it, it could be for us, or He could be telling  us to share it.

"If you are completely  convinced through the Spirit in your own heart, then there is no reason to ever see an impasse except as it concerns relaying such thoughts to others who may not be so receptive. All kinds of people here. Young believers, older believers, people who signed in here who might not even have a firm grasp of anything yet. 
And yet I can summarize by saying I see the birth pangs. Many who read end times, if not most will agree with that. Now the level of care there might vary all the way from none at all to vague concern. Some even worry about it. Some deal with what they see as impending trouble with diversion or denial. Comfortable denial. "

"No matter what you share here and no matter how correct it is, My expectation would never be 100% agreement although it happens. This is a place where anyone can come. I know, I don’t think that this is really what any of us wants to hear.

"We can say we have scripture A and B and it correlates with current or impending events. Skeptics are going to rake over it. Those in agreement might say nothing or you might get an emo. Facts don’t necessarily ever require agreement although that would be the goal."

"Whatever God wants you to do. Reaching the lost is important. "

 

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Posted 1 hour ago

20 hours ago, tatwo said:

Does the “we” in your “we are”...agree...as to what it is that constitutes “doing the work of the Lord?” 

 “we are still to be doing the work of the Lord”...what do you mean @Starise? Care to elaborate in a specific way perhaps? What does the Body under its glorious Head look like to you...and what is He doing on the earth...today?

Whatever God wants you to do. Reaching the lost is important.

20 hours ago, tatwo said:

Great points...I too have listed these points and others like them...numerous times. With few exceptions not to many “believers” seem to be concerned about these issues and issues like them.

Not everyone is on the same page. I tend to like subjects that bore others.

20 hours ago, tatwo said:

I agree...things will get progressively worse...to use your words...exactly as the Lord said. No you’re not being pessimistic...this truth just bothers some folks around here that’s all...the continual and increasing destruction of the “human existence” is a prevailing reality today Starise.

It is an invisible spiritual and progressive decline...a skillful deception...only those who can see this...can see this...the rest are not worried.

The question I have for you @Starise is...how deep into the descent of darkness are you prepared to go?

Expand  

For some people it might be better for them to just go about their day for mental health. It isn’t a subject that bodes well for day to day activity. As believers we will be protected, unless called on as martyrs, and we wouldn’t be the first. If the receptiveness isn’t there what’s the point?

The Bible says a lot of things about the progression into the new kingdom. One of the things it says is that the world is under the great deceiver. By default I think we know what that means and we can see it in real time, not that people haven’t always been deceived. If you dig to any depth in that rabbit hole a person will see it isn’t only deceptive but pure evil. 
The good news in this case is we are not under that. We are liberated, free. We have the eyes to see praise God. We are part of the new kingdom coming. We won’t suffer anything intended for them. 
They say the present doesn’t exist. It’s either looking to the next second or looking back. When you say you’re in the now you really aren’t. We are in a progressing system where God inevitably determines the final outcomes. Gods hardens hearts for His purposes ie Pharoah. So he allows it to progress something He planned eons ago."

Things I picked up from this thread...

 

 

 

[Cyoder]

Some news I've seen lately that is promising:  Around 2,000 people were baptized in Jacksonville in the Atlantic Ocean the other week.  There is also a 22% increase in the sale of Bibles since October of 2024.  Many are younger first-time buyers.  I also notice so many more famous and powerful people talking about being Christian.  Even Joe Rogan has made some recent comments about Jesus.  He used to be more of a higher power kind of guy.  Things have changed quite a bit since January, and I think towards God.  At least in the USA.  

[1to3]

I thank God for His remnant

For those good saints truly helping by sharing Gods Word, by warning others of the dangers at hand. May God  through His Only begotten Son Christ Jesus bless you !

                                   

Thank you to those who are not afraid to speak up to a world and churches in the world that in many cases have become: Comfortably numb.

The song by Pink Floyd - Comfortably Numb (Lyrics) comes to mind.

Hello? (Hello, hello, hello)
Is there anybody in there?
Just nod if you can hear me
Is there anyone home?
Come on (Come on, come on), now
I hear you're feeling down
Well, I can ease your pain
And get you on your feet again
Relax (Relax, relax, relax)
I'll need some information first
Just the basic facts
Can you show me where it hurts?


There is no pain,you are receding
A distant ship, smoke on the horizon
You are only coming through in waves
Your lips move, but I can't hear what you're saying
When I was a child, I had a fever
My hands felt just like two balloons
Now I've got that feeling once again
I can't explain, you would not understand
This is not how I am

I have become comfortably numb

I have become comfortably numb

OK Ok Ok
Just a little pinprick
There'll be no more
But you may feel a little sick
Can you stand up? (Stand up, stand up)
I do believe it's working, good
That'll keep you going through the show
Come on, it's time to go


There is no pain, you are receding
A distant ship, smoke on the horizon
You are only coming through in waves
Your lips move, but I can't hear what you're saying
When I was a child, I caught a fleeting glimpse
Out of the corner of my eye
I turned to look, but it was gone
I cannot put my finger on it now
The child is grown, the dream is gone

 

I have become comfortably numb

 

---------------------------

Lets pray to not let us or others become so comfortably numb that we can no longer find help or help others through Gods plan of Mercy & Grace through His only begotten Son Christ Jesus.

[jswauto]

Couldn't we divide up into pre and post-trib camps. And we could combine for a brief time to belittle the mid-trib and non-millennial believers since they're outcasts and don't count. Then we could separate apart and resume our quibbling.

It doesn't matter what the Lord's doing or if the Temple is rebuilt, or the antichrist has appeared, believers raptured, we'll keep track who's ahead in the end-time debate contest.

And when we go to heaven, if that were possible, we'll have our own sections up there to continue the debate.

Edited yesterday at 12:15 AM by jswauto

[jswauto]

When we look at end-time scenarios we are in disagreement on the details.

Are there certain items we can come to agreement on:

1. The book of Revelation is not chronological.

2. The tribulation is the 7 trumpet judgments.

3. The 3 angels must fly early in the tribulation.

4. Mystery Babylon must happen early in the tribulation.

5. Ez 38/39 ts the battle of Armageddon.

6. There's 2 battles against Gog, Armageddon and the end.

7. The bowl judgment are separate and after the tribulation.

8. After the battle of Armageddon there is no one left to rejuvenate the earth except the 144,000.

9. The outpouring of evil, during this time, will sweep us all away, lest we focus on the Lord.

10. The outpouring of the Spirit will be of magnitude never seen before! 

11. The Rapture and the 2 witnesses go to heaven at the same time (the 7th trumpet).

12. The bowls of wrath and the Marriage Supper happen at the same time.

13. When Heaven is full, the end will come.

Edited Monday at 02:49 AM by jswauto

[Your closest friendnt]

3 hours ago, jswauto said:

When we look at end-time scenarios we are in disagreement on the details.

Are there certain items we can come to agreement on:

1. The book of Revelation is not chronological.

2. The tribulation is the 7 trumpet judgments.

3. The 3 angels must fly early in the tribulation.

4. Mystery Babylon must happen early in the tribulation.

5. Ez 38/39 ts the battle of Armageddon.

6. There's 2 battles against Gog, Armageddon and the end.

7. The bowl judgment are separate and after the tribulation.

8. After the battle of Armageddon there is no one left to rejuvenate the earth except the 144,000.

9. The outpouring of evil, during this time, will sweep us all away, lest we focus on the Lord.

10. The outpouring of the Spirit will be of magnitude never seen before! 

11. The Rapture and the 2 witnesses go to heaven at the same time (the 7th trumpet).

12. The bowls of wrath and the Marriage Supper happen at the same time.

13. When Heaven is full, the end will come.

Every believer is rapture when he dies.

If not what else your Pastor says. 

My Pastor said he will donate his body to science. 

[tatwo]

9 hours ago, jswauto said:

Couldn't we divide up into pre and post-trib camps. And we could combine for a brief time to belittle the mid-trib and non-millennial believers since they're outcasts and don't count. Then we could separate apart and resume our quibbling.

It doesn't matter what the Lord's doing or if the Temple is rebuilt, or the antichrist has appeared, believers raptured, we'll keep track who's ahead in the end-time debate contest.

Brother...I am not familiar with "your style" but I am learning. 

This post made me LoL...please don't be offended...I wish I could have put it so neat and succinctly...with a touch of humor...unless I missed you then forgive me.

Tatwo...:)

[Marathoner]

The last days began when the Word made flesh walked among us. Refer to Hebrews 1:1-2.