In the name of the Father, Son, Holy Spirit

[littlejoe]

My friend I know lutherans also sign themselves, I had the privilige to offer the blessing before our volunteer dinner given to us by the hospital we work in.Before I started the prayer I asked that those whose tradition is to sign themselves before they begin their prayers to do so now,that we may be one spirit,onemind and one voice to the Glory of God and Him only. And I firmily believe that anyonewho added thier Amen to mine it was also their prayer I was just the voice. I am not offended by the sign of The Cross,it is a great picture of my salvation. Love in Christ littlejoe

[Guest man]

Does not scripture also give us examples where Jesus tells to to do things in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit?

Where?

[Leonard]

Does not scripture also give us examples where Jesus tells to to do things in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit?

Where?

Are you familiar with Matthew 28:19?

[Guest man]

Does not scripture also give us examples where Jesus tells to to do things in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit?

Where?

Are you familiar with Matthew 28:19?

What does baptizing have to do with praying?

[darski]

While I do believe that it is a Catholic thing to do I also believe that it can be a witnessing tool. When a catholic takes the time to say grace and ends with the sign of the cross, it tells others in a restaurant etc that someone is talking to God. it can't hurt.

This is one of the things where you ask, "Is anyone harmed by this?"

My answer has to be no and so I get on with working out my own salvation with fear and trembling.

[Floatingaxe]

While I do believe that it is a Catholic thing to do I also believe that it can be a witnessing tool. When a catholic takes the time to say grace and ends with the sign of the cross, it tells others in a restaurant etc that someone is talking to God. it can't hurt.

This is one of the things where you ask, "Is anyone harmed by this?"

My answer has to be no and so I get on with working out my own salvation with fear and trembling.

In a restaurant, we bow our heads and speak to Jesus, in a soft voice, saying thanks over our food. No other "gesture" is required.

[John R Nolan]

This is a question for those who believe in the Trinity. If you don't believe in the Trinity please don't respond.

As part of our Catholic Faith we often start and end our prayers with the sign of the cross and pray in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. Why is this a Catholic symbol? If you are from a different denomination does this give you pause to end a prayer this way. If so, why? I really am curious about this, I don't understand how this became a Catholic thing. It seem to me that this should be a Christian thing.

Please don't turn this into an anti-Catholic thread, we have all been down that road far too many times.

Thanks,

Kansas Dad

God bless you, bro.

To avoid an anti Roman Catholic attitude is difficult, 'she' being identified in Rev.12 as the great whore, of whom all denominations are descendants, 'the mother of harlots" Rev.17:5

What is esential is our understanding that those who are caught in the religious systems, be they R.C. or any other, are not responsible for what they have been taught, or, what they have been denied access to

It is the system which has put man at the head of the CHURCH instead of Christ which provides other intercessors, subjugates the laity to doctrines of man instead of the WORD of GOD, which is corrupt.

Speaking as an ex.R.C., who went right through their education system, in boarding schools; was an alter boy, who could recite the mass in Latin, etc., I can only praise the Lord for pulling me out of their evil ranks

It is not the congregations, the laity, who are at fault, I am sure there are sincere, GOD fearing and loving Christians in every denomination, it is the priest hood who will answer to GOD for not or incorrectly 'feeding' His sheep

I would encourage you, brother, to get a copy of Alexander Hyslop's book, "THE TWO BABYLONS" and in it you will find the answer you need re the sign of the cross

Rev.18:4 instructs GOD'S children to "Come out of HER, My people, and be not partakers of HER sin"

In Scripture the 'churches' are alwayse typed in the feminine

This writing is to encourage Christians to get back into HIM, the WORD made manifest, Jn.1:1&14 and to encourage you to search the Scriptures, for in them alone is LIFE

[John R Nolan]

This is a question for those who believe in the Trinity. If you don't believe in the Trinity please don't respond.

As part of our Catholic Faith we often start and end our prayers with the sign of the cross and pray in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. Why is this a Catholic symbol? If you are from a different denomination does this give you pause to end a prayer this way. If so, why? I really am curious about this, I don't understand how this became a Catholic thing. It seem to me that this should be a Christian thing.

Please don't turn this into an anti-Catholic thread, we have all been down that road far too many times.

Thanks,

Kansas Dad

Here is information I have found on the "sign of the cross":

Origins of the sign of the cross

The Christian custom of gesturing the sign of the cross was originally with the right hand's thumb only and across the forehead only. (St. John Chrys., Hom. ad pop. Antioch. xi; St. Jerome, Ep. ad Eustochium.) The custom originated during the second century.

Vestiges of this earliest gesture still exist when Catholics sign a cross on their forehead to hear the Gospels during mass, when their foreheads are marked with ash on Ash Wednesday, when applying the holy oil (called chrism) on the forehead for the sacrament of Confirmation, and so on. Around year 200 in Carthage (modern Tunisia, Africa), Tertullian says: "We Christians wear out our foreheads with the sign of the cross" (Latin: "Frontem crucis signaculo terimus") (De Cor. mil. 3). The second century Christians signed the cross on their forehead before taking any risk, such as embarking on a journey, and so on.

Ravenna mosaic, 6th c.: Jesus is portrayed gesturing a sign of the cross like a Christian priest with his right hand facing outward, at the position of et FiliiTertullian points out that the sign of the cross is not commanded in any Holy Scripture. It is only from Christian cultural tradition. A search for a scriptual prooftext for the sign of the cross has required loose interpretations. For examples: "Go throughout the city of Jerusalem and put a mark [of ash?] on the foreheads of those who grieve and lament over all the detestable [idolatries] that are done in it" (Ezekiel 9:4). "Do not harm the land or the sea or the trees until we put a seal [with holy oil?] on the foreheads of the servants of our God." (Revelation 7:3). And so on. Of course, none of these biblical prooftexts prescribe a motion of a cross, but their location on the forehead probably informed the early Christian custom.

By the fourth century, the sign of the cross involved other parts of the body beyond the forehead. (St. Ambrose, De Isaac et anim

Edited November 7, 2006 by John R Nolan

[georgesbluegirl]

a) the Catholic Church is NOT the "great harlot," and i'm sick of people saying it is. Catholics consciously reject Satan in yearly renewal of baptismal vows. get over it.

b) i'm stunned that an innocent gesture of faith can be attacked with such malice. Thanks to darski and littlejoe for having the right idea...

however you pray, you are PRAYING.

[Kansasdad]

This is a question for those who believe in the Trinity. If you don't believe in the Trinity please don't respond.

As part of our Catholic Faith we often start and end our prayers with the sign of the cross and pray in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit. Why is this a Catholic symbol? If you are from a different denomination does this give you pause to end a prayer this way. If so, why? I really am curious about this, I don't understand how this became a Catholic thing. It seem to me that this should be a Christian thing.

Please don't turn this into an anti-Catholic thread, we have all been down that road far too many times.

Thanks,

Kansas Dad

God bless you, bro.

To avoid an anti Roman Catholic attitude is difficult,

No it is not, you just have to take personal responsibility for what you write. You made a choice to ignore my request. Hey it is a free country you can do as you please. However I would request that you take it to a different thread, and I would also request that other posters not respond to this kind of post. Thank you to the other poster for your dialogue, I know that Floatingaxe and Man have very strong opinions about the Catholic church, but they have managed to engage in the discussion without heading down that same old road. GeorgiaBlueGirl, thank you for being a part of this forum!

Now back on subject please.

Kansas Dad