How do you become a pastor?

[Floatingaxe]

I want to save people and start a little society outside major citys where i and my church will get armed and await the end days.

Whoa! YIKES!

[Marnie]

Not many of you should presume to be teachers, my brothers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly.

James 3:1

If you are at the judgement seat of Christ, and you see me standing in front of you, you might want to change lines. As a teacher, I will take longer

EricH dear, I hope you don't think this was directed at you, or anybody in particular. The Church in James' day was full of people who thought themselves teachers and tried to take over pulpits, hence James' teaching on the tongue. From what I read here, you more than qualify as a teacher. As to how long you will take you in front of the Lord, I guarantee I got you beat. They'll be selling fold-a-ways to people in my line.

[Arash_the_archer]

I want to save people and start a little society outside major citys where i and my church will get armed and await the end days.

Whoa! YIKES!

Why is that so strange? what about it?

[Floatingaxe]

I want to save people and start a little society outside major citys where i and my church will get armed and await the end days.

Whoa! YIKES!

Why is that so strange? what about it?

We are already in the end days. Nowhere in scripture are we told to form a little society and separate from the world, bearing arms. Do you know you resemble a fanatical Koresh-type when you talk like that?

I think you do need some Bible School training after all, and maybe some growing in the Lord and His Word before you embark on your Fantastic Voyage.

Being a leader means serving, being lesser, not greater.

[stevehut]

Arash, you seem very insightful, and your aims are noble.

You seem to believe that you need to go out and start a new church of your own. Do I understand this correctly?

Steve

[RedeemedByHim]

Just as long as we keep in mind the difference between an overseer of a congregation and a ministry, they are not the same.

There is an aptitude needed for both and people who can do one cannot always do the other. A congregational pastor has to be able to work with a budget, to understand organization, to understand some elements of counseling and human psychology, the need to understand aging and death and how to deal with sick people and their families, and of course preach the Gospel, it is a hard job, it is about taking care of a group of Christians and their souls.

If someone is called to be a congregational pastor, they will have been given by God these aptitudes and abilities. I don't understand why anyone who has this calling would not want to go through formal training, why would that be resisted? There are no shortcuts this is a lifelong calling, not something you get fired up and go do for a couple of months. I do see that as a problem, new believers on fire for Christ and let us be clear that this is a GOOD thing, but they suddenly believe that they are called to minister, but don't want to do any of the work to prepare. But that in itself would be a sign that they are not called to be a congregational pastor, but maybe some other type of ministry.

It's funny how many experts there are here! I am wondering how many would be as confident of their knowledge if they just hired some yahoo, who claimed "the call," yet had no formal training or education, but who had charm, personality, said all the right things, and could sing (and his wife played the piano!), but later you found out he was a mile wide but an inch deep! As one who has their "terminal degree" in Theological studies, I still after 21 years of pulpit ministry feel woefully inadequate. I found the more I learned the more I needed to learn because the less I actually knew. There are some things you cannot learn on your own, I don't care how spiritual you are or much time you spend on your knees. There is great value in being educated "at the feet" of learned men of God who have been where you are going. Especially, given the fact that the average person in the pew is far more educated today than even 20 years ago; it is vital for the pastor to be able to navigate the troubled waters of not only Church polity and law, but also Biblical interpretation.

The call to pastor is unique, and in today's world the pastor is expected to be part administrator, part doctor, part lawyer, part teacher and everybody's spiritual guide, all for a paycheck nobody on the board would work for! The fact is, there are no real guidelines in the Bible for hiring a pastor, beyond the qualifications listed by Paul for elders and deacons. It was humorous reading a post earlier on where somebody quoted a bunch of verses that had nothing whatsoever to do with the office of Pastor. When the Bible is silent on a matter, it's up to us to be as "wise as serpents," to quote our Lord, and to exercise discernment and, most of all, function with the mind of Christ. I have sat in front of many a pastoral search committee in my day. Some were not in the least bit interested in my education, others were. Some were keenly interested in my counseling credentials, others were captivated by articles I had written. But at the end of the interview, each and every search committee prayed with me and prayed together, asking for Divine guidance.

Every church is different, and some churches have no use for a candidate like me, a Dr. so-and-so, to be be their pastor, they may need a man who is good at visitation because their congregation is older. Other churches, like Marnie's, are populated by doctors, educators and professional types who need solid teaching from an educated, Spirit filled pastor. These people don't want him to visit them, they want and need to be taught.

Just some observations from one who has been around the proverbial pulpit a few times in his life.

Thank you for sharing...I enjoyed reading your post and thoughts..

[RedeemedByHim]

I have gotten sick of the Swedish christianity, the state church "the church of Sweden" was founded in the 12th century as the swedish branch of the catholic church, in the 16th century the swedish king trasformed it into a protestant church. It was good untill latter days. Now it says that there is no hell nor satan, and tey deny the end days. There are other churches to like quakers and other even more liberal ones, too liberal ones.

How do i become a genuine pastor? I want to save people and start a little society outside major citys where i and my church will get armed and await the end days.

You become a pastor by pastoring. Plain and simple. As you fulfill the Great Commission, you will find yourself doing just that! Reach the lost and disciple them, and make disciples and disciplers of them. Start with a home-based church, but do not form any "church"-like group unless you have a strong mentor behind you to assist you and to cover you with prayer. As you are obedient, God will move you into it further and further. Just seek first the kingdom of God and He will add all you need to you. He will educate you. If you decide that later you need some formal book-learning, then do it.

I agree...because a college can give you all the head knowlege in the world...whereas going through discipleship also builds your character. I think both are important...but I think discipleship would be even more important than a college education...Unfortunately in our day and age...you need a college degree to even speak in most churches...

of course I like what I heard someone say once...They went to the U of HK...(University of hard knocks...)

To be honest, I'd actually say that they're equally important. I mean, in highschool, I had a lot of passion and a lot of discipleship...but I wasn't very educated in the Bible. Granted, there's only so much one can learn in a couple years of being a Christian, but BOY do I wish I'd known the things I know now. Would've stopped me from saying a lot of things based on rather unfounded impressions and overall ignorance. Not saying people without a BIble College education are ignorant, either...but you'd be surprised at the things you learn there, and I think a lot of them are things pastors NEED to know.

Besides...Bible College itself is a great place for finding discipleship.

Maybe you are right...I have been to Bible college and seen no discipleship taking place...I am being discipled now by my pastors and I have learned a GREAT deal of truth. I have learned to read the Bible myself. I do learn alot about the Bible through discipleship and also through my classes....I am a very big believer that the church today should be modeled completely after the way Jesus discipled His disciples and the New Testament church...some of those ministers didn't even go through the pharisees teaching...however, some did. I am in Bible college now...no, it is not a real huge college. My training takes place through my church, and that is just fine with me...

Oh, man, that's really unfortunate that your Bible College didn't offer much in the way of discipleship...maybe you could bring it up with the college's Student Union? I really think discipleship should be a HUGE part of Bible College.

I totally agree...but I am not a student there anymore...I don't even live near the place...I love where I am at now...the sad thing..the college I attended has started going downhill...I had a friend who went there when I did and she visited last month and said you cant really tell the difference between a secular college and Christian college...but thank God He got me in a good place now...

[ted]

Wow.

I'm surprised no one has posted these verses yet. Let's see what God's Word has to say on the subject:

1Ti 3:1 This is a true saying, If a man desire the office of a bishop, he desireth a good work.

1Ti 3:2 A bishop then must be blameless, the husband of one wife, vigilant, sober, of good behavior, given to hospitality, apt to teach;

1Ti 3:3 Not given to wine, no striker, not greedy of filthy lucre; but patient, not a brawler, not covetous;

1Ti 3:4 One that ruleth well his own house, having his children in subjection with all gravity;

1Ti 3:5 (For if a man know not how to rule his own house, how shall he take care of the church of God?)

1Ti 3:6 Not a novice, lest being lifted up with pride he fall into the condemnation of the devil.

1Ti 3:7 Moreover he must have a good report of them which are without; lest he fall into reproach and the snare of the devil.

1Ti 3:8 Likewise must the deacons be grave, not doubletongued, not given to much wine, not greedy of filthy lucre;

1Ti 3:9 Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience.

1Ti 3:10 And let these also first be proved; then let them use the office of a deacon, being found blameless.

1Ti 3:11 Even so must their wives be grave, not slanderers, sober, faithful in all things.

1Ti 3:12 Let the deacons be the husbands of one wife, ruling their children and their own houses well.

1Ti 3:13 For they that have used the office of a deacon well purchase to themselves a good degree, and great boldness in the faith which is in Christ Jesus.

And these...

2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.

2Ti 2:20 But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honor, and some to dishonor.

2Ti 2:21 If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honor, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.

2Ti 2:22 Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

2Ti 2:23 But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do engender strifes.

2Ti 2:24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,

2Ti 2:25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;

2Ti 2:26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

And these...

2Ti 4:1 I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;

2Ti 4:2 Preach the word; be instant in season, out of season; reprove, rebuke, exhort with all longsuffering and doctrine.

2Ti 4:3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;

2Ti 4:4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables.

2Ti 4:5 But watch thou in all things, endure afflictions, do the work of an evangelist, make full proof of thy ministry.

And these...

Tit 1:7 For a bishop must be blameless, as the steward of God; not self-willed, not soon angry, not given to wine, no striker, not given to filthy lucre;

Tit 1:8 But a lover of hospitality, a lover of good men, sober, just, holy, temperate;

Tit 1:9 Holding fast the faithful word as he hath been taught, that he may be able by sound doctrine both to exhort and to convince the gainsayers.

Tit 1:10 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, especially they of the circumcision:

Tit 1:11 Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake.

Tit 1:12 One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians are always liars, evil beasts, slow bellies.

Tit 1:13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;

Tit 1:14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth.

Tit 1:15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled.

Tit 1:16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

And these, too...

Tit 3:1 Put them in mind to be subject to principalities and powers, to obey magistrates, to be ready to every good work,

Tit 3:2 To speak evil of no man, to be no brawlers, but gentle, showing all meekness unto all men.

Tit 3:3 For we ourselves also were sometimes foolish, disobedient, deceived, serving divers lusts and pleasures, living in malice and envy, hateful, and hating one another.

Tit 3:4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Savior toward man appeared,

Tit 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Tit 3:6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior;

Tit 3:7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Tit 3:8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.

Tit 3:9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain.

Not all of these represent the hard and fast rules concerning a Pastoral role, but some of them are directly applicable. There was, of course, no reference to any Bible Colleges then, because there were no Bible Colleges at the time Paul wrote this. There was, however, an insistence on knowing God's Word, at the minimum, as well as other considerations which Paul laid out in some of these verses.

Search yourself, Arash, and do the works of God as called. Be mindful of what God's Word says about your position as a Pastor, and feed your flock.

Peace,

t.

[HAZARD]

Hi.

I did I Bible college thing, passed with flying colours but it meant nothing. It was full of errors. Depending on which college one is accepted into. Which religion they teach/preach. Thats what one is taught. The hardest thing to do I have found is to get rid of wrong teaching so that we can take in correct teaching.

Christ comands us to "Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are which testify of me" (John 5:39).

Jesus also told us in John 6:44, "No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day."

If one drawn to Christ and would like to teach/preach, then the first thing one must do is to "Search the Scriptures," like a bloodhound on a scent trail. Be well versed, (not talking about the ability of quoting verse), on every doctrin taking in the big picture, the entire plan of God for man from beginning to end believing with a humble heart what one learns. After more than three years of the most simple teaching by the greatest of all teachers, the disciples had to be rebuked by their teacher for their unbelief and hardness of heart. This was not because they could, or did not understand, but because they did not believe what Christ taught them. He said to them, "O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken" (Luke 24:25-27). Even after Christ had appeared and manifested Himself to them in various ways, they still refused to believe until He "upbraided them for their unbelief and hardness of heart" (Mark 16:13-14).

Many teachers today think they know all there is to know, and because of their high education set themselves up as "experts" in Bible doctrin, and simply refuse to be corrected even if Scripture proves beyond any doubt that they are wrong on a particular doctrin. They just refuse to believe the Scripture and they torture it untill it says what they want it to say. We have all met preachers like this at one time in our lives. Jesus once said, "I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and Earth, Because thou hast hidden these things from the wise and prudent and hast revealed them unto babes. Even so, Father: for it seemed good in they sight" (Matt. 11:25-27).

I am not saying all well educated ministers are in this catagory, no way, but there are far too many to be ignored. Jesus said of people like these, "This peoples heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their HEART, and should be converted, and I should heal them" (Matt. 13:10-17). It is all important therefore that ministers be simple and humble in their attitude. They should take the place of a disciple and accept at its face value anything and everything God says on any subject, wether it harmonized with our own personal theories, or those of our former teachers. All study must be done with an open heart, and open mind, and a humble acceptance to all that God says, and be honest to lay old theories aside for the plain, literal, and simple Word of God on all points.

[AnotherTraveler]

I agree with Hazard