Discerning Tongues Now

[damo1]

damo1

to poor in spirit

i am stil weighting on your responce to 1 corinthians 14 verse 37

if any one thinks himself to be a prophet or spiritual let him acknowledge that the things which i write to you are the commandmanst of the lord

which paul are you talking about poor in spirit as their is only one paul i know about and if the apostle paul him self wear typing from a computer from his very own home i feel he wil be doing more than what we are doing to you so please do not try to quote from the apostle paul as al you are doing hear is mocking a mighty man of god

you seem to think you are in the lions den hear by sevral posters at the start of your topic but i notice brother these that apluded what you said are not hear in the lions den with you i wonder why these people are not backing you up

lets hear it in your own words poor in spirit to 1 corinthians 14 verse 37 also poor in spirit my partner is a filapino pastor and the 7 pastors under her all her congregation the leaders the youth pastors and sunday school teachers and those that work in the orphanage that is attached to the main church and the youth plus her parents and young people with in the 5 churches that have been planted every single person speaks in tongues they all read the same gospel as me

you say the gospel has not been heard in some parts of the world well sir is every one in my partners country going to go to hel for beliving in the bible and asking the holy spirit to lead them in the gifts paul speaks about in 1 corinthians 14 ? are they al manipulated by an evil spirit are they al going to go to hel because you seem to hear from god ?

if you feel you are in the lions den brother you have no one to blame but your self

god bles from your brother in the lord damien stipic

[poorinspirit]

damo1,

i am stil weighting on your responce to 1 corinthians 14 verse 37

if any one thinks himself to be a prophet or spiritual let him acknowledge that the things which i write to you are the commandmanst of the lord

I am still waiting for you to acknowledge why Paul said it... women are not to speak in tongues because they can't. They are not even allowed to speak in church. You guys are the ones that have changed by not only departing from the faith but the instructions on the use of tongues in the assembly.

So why respond to what you are going to continue to deny?

[poorinspirit]

Psalm 12 was posted for all to read and discern.

It was not addressed to anyone.

So the personal attacks are by you only.

If you put that shoe on and it fits you, you applied it to yourself. I didn't.

I'm still hoping the Lord shall cause the increase as He enables me to warn and correct by the scriptures, but it is on Him to do it.

If you fail to see the significance of Psalm 12 in regards to the subject as a warning to take a step back and reconsider, then so be it.

But if any applied the Psalm 12 to yourself... you did it. Not me.

I still believe you all are my brothers and sisters. I just believe you do not have tongues and the tongues you got, you got it the wrong way by departing from the faith and thus the tongues you got is of the world because it is gibberish. All testimonies to the contrary os having a translation... I do not believe you because linguists have been invited to many many churches that claimed to have tongues with interpretation.. so the recordings show that the tongues are the same as the world's tongues and ... there is no interpretation,.. thus the interpretors were lying. So that is why I do not believe any accounts of tongues no matter if they say they have an interpretor.. let alone that they interpreted themselves as if scriptures might as well be thrown out the window now. I'll throw the accounts of people's out. By the grace of God, I shall not throw the scriptures out the door. You guys may have just to defend tongues, but you are not convincing me at all that tongues exist today. In fact, the feror in defending tongues without correcting patricia1 confirms that tongues are not present today because.... the Lord would have used tongues with interpretation to correct you on that point, but yet He has not because if you ignore the scriptures, you might commit the unpardonable sin by saying His audio rebuke be of the devil because you want to hold onto your tongues as it defines you as special... and I know the Lord loves you too much to have you commit that sin, so He is just waiting for you to be receptive to His sayings.. by taking a step back.. and come to Jesus in plain praying language to discern by the scriptures of the KJV Bible.

So.. it is on the Lord to cause the increase. Even if He does not deliver any that are deep into it because they are unwilling to depart from it, may He warn those that are wondering about tongues to remain resting in Jesus that they are saved... and that they need not seek a sign to know that they are when only an adulterous generation are the ones that seek after a sign. So... it is by coming to Jesus, we have received the promise of the Spirit.. and thus we have a rest in Jesus. The simplicity of the Gospel. Amen.

[poorinspirit]

The defense that God does not change to validate the continuing use of tongues is a not an excuse to continue practising tongues with no interpretation and out of order.

God doesn't change, but conditions regarding us do change.

Before the Flood, man and animals were vegetarians. After the Flood, that changed. Noticed that God decreed it os before the Flood and decreed differemtly after the Flood.

Genesis 1: 27So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. 28And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. 29And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat. 30And to every beast of the earth, and to every fowl of the air, and to every thing that creepeth upon the earth, wherein there is life, I have given every green herb for meat: and it was so.

Then after the Flood:

Genesis 9: 1And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth. 2And the fear of you and the dread of you shall be upon every beast of the earth, and upon every fowl of the air, upon all that moveth upon the earth, and upon all the fishes of the sea; into your hand are they delivered. 3Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things.

Now.. note the decree God gave to Noah and his sons. No one else. We know that God decreed them specifically to multiply and replenish the earth, because they were the only ones there. Note the commandments later given when God changed the decrees because the conditions regarding the first decree was now different in Leviticus 18 for there were more people that it would be a sin to marry within the family. Note all that was decreed as an abomination from that point on.

Leviticus 18: 1And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, 2Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, I am the LORD your God. 3After the doings of the land of Egypt, wherein ye dwelt, shall ye not do: and after the doings of the land of Canaan, whither I bring you, shall ye not do: neither shall ye walk in their ordinances. 4Ye shall do my judgments, and keep mine ordinances, to walk therein: I am the LORD your God.5Ye shall therefore keep my statutes, and my judgments: which if a man do, he shall live in them: I am the LORD. 6None of you shall approach to any that is near of kin to him, to uncover their nakedness: I am the LORD.....9The nakedness of thy sister, the daughter of thy father, or daughter of thy mother, whether she be born at home, or born abroad, even their nakedness thou shalt not uncover.

BUT before Leviticus 18 was decreed, what did Abraham do?

Genesis 20: 11And Abraham said, Because I thought, Surely the fear of God is not in this place; and they will slay me for my wife's sake. 12And yet indeed she is my sister; she is the daughter of my father, but not the daughter of my mother; and she became my wife.

Abraham did not commit incest because the conditions for the decree in Leviticus 18 had not been reached yet for there were yet not enough people to give it yet. Out of the land of Egypt, the Israelites came as a multitude.. a people.. a nation. Thus the decree was not issued not to marry within the family as described in Leviticus chapters 6 thru 18.

God also made this drecree:

Genesis 9: 12And God said, This is the token of the covenant which I make between me and you and every living creature that is with you, for perpetual generations: 13I do set my bow in the cloud, and it shall be for a token of a covenant between me and the earth. 14And it shall come to pass, when I bring a cloud over the earth, that the bow shall be seen in the cloud: 15And I will remember my covenant, which is between me and you and every living creature of all flesh; and the waters shall no more become a flood to destroy all flesh. 16And the bow shall be in the cloud; and I will look upon it, that I may remember the everlasting covenant between God and every living creature of all flesh that is upon the earth. 17And God said unto Noah, This is the token of the covenant, which I have established between me and all flesh that is upon the earth.

We still have floods world-wide to even tsunamis, but His decree still stands as there is no world-wide flood since the decree.

The point? Saying God does not change in regards to the use of tongues is not a validation that tongues are continuing. If we are edified by the Word, and tongues were given as a sign for the unbelievers for them to hear the Word understood, and tongues in the assembly is to be accompanied by an interpretor as all manifestations of the Spirit are given to profit the body withal thus tongues alone is fruitless without understanding, and with the KJV Bible right there for us to seek the scriptures to learn of Him, as prophesy is to be sought over tongues, then the use of tongues has ceased because the conditions for them has ceased.

[Jorge S]

Poor In Spirit,

I was led to Jesus by witnessing the prayer of a Christian woman who suddenly started speaking in an unknown tongue while praying. An unexpected 'force' took control over my body and made me whirl around my own leaving me utterly astonished. I did not fall or faint, I did not feel possessed or out of my physical self. I was just the spectator of something happening in my own body for which I did not have any credit nor control. I don't know how it happened but it did. I also witnessed miracles in another one or two occasions of her speaking in tongues while praying.

For a time I grew increasingly negative about this gift because it did not 'feel' genuine with certain people but then I had a closer look at Paul's teachings and at Jesus saying: "Therefore I say to you, All kinds of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven to men, but the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit shall not be forgiven to men." (Matt. 12:31) That's why I have withdrawn judgement about it. If it is genuine it comes from God; if it is not God's God Himself will take care of the imposters.

I don't have this gift and I don't crave for it. Neither I value more or less the Christian status of those who possess it or lack it. My only conviction is that it should come spontaneously by God's Will and not by focused training as some congregations do.

Blessings.

[Guest Greg Davies]

I just discoverd this topic and in the OP it was asserted that the unknown tongue was "gibberish".

Here's what I Cor. 14:2 (NKJV) says about that: "For he who speaks in a tongue does not speak to men but to God, for no one understands him: however, in the spirit he speaks mysteries."

So we would be speaking mysteries to God. Wow, sounds pretty cool to me. Why someone would denigrate this ability is beyond me.

Many in Christianity have not been taught that there is a difference between the "genos" tongue, the gift of "divers kinds" of tongues, talked about in I Cor 12 and the "unknown" tongue talked about in I Cor 14. The "genos" tongue is seen operating in Acts 2:6-11. The "unknown" tongue is, as previously described, not understandable by any man. It is a prayer language or heavenly language understandable by God. It is allowed in a church service if there is someone with the gift of interpretation so the church members can understand and be edified.

This isn't complicated and the only reasons to mock it or discount it is either ignorance or unbelief. You chose.

Greg.

Edited December 6, 2007 by Greg Davies

[damo1]

damo1,

i am stil weighting on your responce to 1 corinthians 14 verse 37

if any one thinks himself to be a prophet or spiritual let him acknowledge that the things which i write to you are the commandmanst of the lord

I am still waiting for you to acknowledge why Paul said it... women are not to speak in tongues because they can't. They are not even allowed to speak in church. You guys are the ones that have changed by not only departing from the faith but the instructions on the use of tongues in the assembly.

So why respond to what you are going to continue to deny?

damo1

to poor in spirit

again i am on my day off i work on the weekend and i am seeing you are way of line hear and you poor in spirit need to think hard what you are saying hear as i said to you poor in spirit please do not mock the apostle paul or throw verses from corinthians as you my friend are on a path that is going to bring gods wrath on you

wel you are saying i have not answerd you i have given you scripture passages to back up what i am saying and i feel if the apostle paul wear to be typing away in some part of the world he wil challange you and he wil openly rebuke you poor in spirit

i hear in your latest two posts that you are trying to correct us by saying its all giberish just because you had a bad experiance poor in spirit as i remember you saying this in hymnals and in the other topics you your self bought up

i also saved that very topic wear you opend up

so by you know saying wear does it say that paul ever said it was ok for a women to seek this gift or speak in tongues i can give you this passage but i know if i give you scripture to back this up you wil just ignore the bible i have and only listen to the kings james bible

how dare you judge and sit in judgment on those that do use this gift in their churches are you boldly going to tell me hear that you are the only true christian on worthy who has the right to sit in on judgment on us that have been honest and open to you ?

agian i am going to say this and please do not run poor in spirit as if i see you going to another person like one light or patricia or any one i wil jump in on those that you try to correct until i get an honest responce from you

people like your self love to use pslam 12 a lot when confronted and this psalm you did use to get at us that wear sharing to you you seem to be stuck in the past poor in spirit and i feel you wil get openly challanged and rebuked as a man and a man who fears god and takes all the warnings that are based in gods word seriouse i wil not have some one like you looking down on any of the sisters hear that have openly shared to you and also i wil not have you looking down on the people in my partners church in the philippines or say openly that my partner should respect what is said in 1 corinthians 14 jesus broke that law when he was nailed to the cross today women have the freedom to move in these gifts today women can lead a church just like my partner leads the 5 churches that have been planted in her country

i have also rebuked guys like your self that have openly attacked my partner she has 7 pastors under her and they all work as a team and do not sift threw the bible how dare you sit in on judgment on those who openly cry out to god

1 corinthians 14 new spirit filled life bible

36 did the word of god come origonally from you or was it you only that it reached ? wel poor in spirit answer me honestly did the word of god settle down on you and are you the only man on this earth that has this right to sit in on judgment on me and on my partner as i said i am not ashamed to say jesus is lord over my life and i am not ashamed to say openly i speak in tongues does this mean i am being possed by a lose demon ? for you to throw psalm 12 ?

1 corinthians 14 new spirit filled life bible

37 if anyone thinks himself to be a prophet or spiritual let him acknowledge that the things which i wirte to you

are the commandments of the lord

this is wear i see you have lost it and do not understand what paul was saying hear as if you understood this you wil not be sitting on your high horse judging us that do use these gifts

1 corinthians 14 new spirit filled life bible

34 let your women keep silent in the churches for they are not permitted to speak but they are to be submissive as the law also says

35 and if they want to learn something let them ask their own husbands at home for it is shamefull for women to speak in church

also this is what the apostle paul says and i have given you this scripture

39 theirfor brethren desire earnestly to prophesy and do not forbid to speak with tongues

how many times is this verse going to be given to you poor in spirit we live in 2007 we do not live in the time the apostle paul was alive and walking this earth things wear diffrent yet today as i said women are more active with in the body why simple my friend jesus broke that law when he was nailed to the cross

thos that use this today bring in gods wrath on their own head and those that ignore what jesus did wil suffer just like those who follow satan and mark them selves with the mark of the beast

are you brave enough poor in spirit to tel god to his face on judgment day why you decided to sit in on judgment on his people ? as what you do know and what you say he wil bring this to the surface

nothing is left everything wil be bought to the surface poor in spirit and you wil have to give account so please keep your false doctrine to your self you are a very ignorant man poor in spirit and as paul says hear in 1 corinthians 14

38 but if anyone is ignorant let him be ignorant

this is how i see you poor in spirit very ignorant so i have given you verses wear paul instructed the men and wear paul said to the women how they should behave in gods house if they want to learn anything pauls says they should ask their husbands paul did not say that women should not seek these gifts that us men wear encouraged to seek 1 corinthians 14 was open to all males and to all females

also the apostle paul said this poor in spirit

1 corinthians 14 new spirit filled life bible verse 18 i thank my god i speak with tongues more than you all

are you going to tell me openly hear poor in spirit that the apostle paul had a demon in him and he needed to repent and be rebuked

know answer 1 corinthians 14 verse 37 if anyone thinks himself to be a prophet or spiritual let him acknowledge

that the things which i write to you are the commandments of the lord

if you can not do this poor in spirit do not give me your false doctrine as i wil see you as an unstable man who is just ignorant

god bles from your brother in the lord damien stipic

[OneLight]

Psalm 12 was posted for all to read and discern.

It was not addressed to anyone.

So the personal attacks are by you only.

If you put that shoe on and it fits you, you applied it to yourself. I didn't.

I'm still hoping the Lord shall cause the increase as He enables me to warn and correct by the scriptures, but it is on Him to do it.

If you fail to see the significance of Psalm 12 in regards to the subject as a warning to take a step back and reconsider, then so be it.

But if any applied the Psalm 12 to yourself... you did it. Not me.

Please, who are you trying to fool. You meant it to all who oppose you and for you not to stand up and admit it shows weakness on your part.

I still believe you all are my brothers and sisters. I just believe you do not have tongues and the tongues you got, you got it the wrong way by departing from the faith and thus the tongues you got is of the world because it is gibberish. All testimonies to the contrary os having a translation... I do not believe you because linguists have been invited to many many churches that claimed to have tongues with interpretation.. so the recordings show that the tongues are the same as the world's tongues and ... there is no interpretation,.. thus the interpretors were lying. So that is why I do not believe any accounts of tongues no matter if they say they have an interpretor.. let alone that they interpreted themselves as if scriptures might as well be thrown out the window now. I'll throw the accounts of people's out. By the grace of God, I shall not throw the scriptures out the door. You guys may have just to defend tongues, but you are not convincing me at all that tongues exist today.

Now, this is more like it. You are speaking what you personally believe and not attacking anyone. Praise God! I accept this type of communication from a Brother, which I do believe you are. We can believe in different interpretation of His Word, but still accept Christ as our savior and be saved. What I have objected to all along is when you claim that you hold the only truth and that the rest, who do not accept your doctrines, are condemned to hell.

In fact, the feror in defending tongues without correcting patricia1 confirms that tongues are not present today because.... the Lord would have used tongues with interpretation to correct you on that point, but yet He has not because if you ignore the scriptures, you might commit the unpardonable sin by saying His audio rebuke be of the devil because you want to hold onto your tongues as it defines you as special... and I know the Lord loves you too much to have you commit that sin, so He is just waiting for you to be receptive to His sayings.. by taking a step back.. and come to Jesus in plain praying language to discern by the scriptures of the KJV Bible.

So.. it is on the Lord to cause the increase. Even if He does not deliver any that are deep into it because they are unwilling to depart from it, may He warn those that are wondering about tongues to remain resting in Jesus that they are saved... and that they need not seek a sign to know that they are when only an adulterous generation are the ones that seek after a sign. So... it is by coming to Jesus, we have received the promise of the Spirit.. and thus we have a rest in Jesus. The simplicity of the Gospel. Amen.

Brother, again, you place yourself on a pedestal. I never claim to be special and I really don't know where you got the idea that I thought I was. Believe me, Christ has spoken to me and I did listen. He told me "I Am Alive". I know that if He ever spoke to me again, He would have my undivided attention.

Brother, it is you who has decided that the Holy Spirit does not give the gift of tongues, or that He does not pray in intercession for us. You have accepted man over the word of God and the Holy Spirit by agreeing with the linguists. The Holy Spirit will teach each person who seeks the truth, it is one of His missions.

Your Brother In Christ,

OneLight

[patricia1]

The issue of Paul has been dealt with. Whether you like the explanation or not is of no consequence here for Women still speak in tongues which comes from the spirit of God in which Paul would have never quenched... but yelling across the pews" Hey , What is he talking about" in hebrew was a diversion. The Spirit of God does not discrimnate against genders, once again I say this.

The Holy Spirt Of God being God is subject to all biblical things and does not change either.

Acts 5: 3, 4 " butpeter said, Ananias, why has Satan fill your heart to lie to the Holy Spirit, and to keep back some of the price of the land? At the bottom half of verse 4 " You have not lied to man but to God."

The Holy spirit is omnipotent

ominipresent

creator

speaks, teaches,comforts, helps us in our weaknesses, is grieved,

renews, convicts

Christ was concieved by, Miracles are performed by

one is anointed by

Filled with and by

regenerates, guides, empowers.

bears witness

gives joy

gives discernment

bears fruit

give gifts

illuminates the mind, Reveals things of God our Father

Speaking in tongues is not a condition it is a gift, and the gifts of God are without repentence. That is why people stand at the door and try to reason with God to let them in...Haven't we raised the dead in your name. They are told go away I never knew you. They were christians and their oil was not in thier lamps. The relationship had fallen by the wayside..The Holy Spirit did the work not them anyway.

I understanding about God changing Laws...Peter complained about that too when he was to eat unclean things.

Jesus came to fulfill the law and not to abolish it.

You have quoted from Genis but eluded something most do.

In Genesis 5:2 of the king James it reads Male and Female created he them; and blessed them, and called THEIR name Adam, in the day they were created.

Adam gave Eve her name. God did not. He called them both Adam. Made in His Image. The father ,Son and Holy Spirit. Did God himself make a distinction....no! The word Adam means ruddy, from the earth. So Our father, although eve was taken from Adams rib, made know distinction in his creation.( in name) That remains. It is man, that seperated the names, seperated us that which God made one.

God remains unchanging, He states it , I believe it. Yes circumstances do change...But not who Our father is,nor What he does, nor where he is. His attributes remain the same. So your argument is futile...You cannot compare God with circumstance which always changes. Amen brother? It is a matter of faith. You cannot grow beyond what your measure of faith is. And according to Jesus we all have very little of it., But if any of you lack...just ask patricia1

[OneLight]

Allow me to ask, who is it that would fear tongues the most in the spirit realm?

OneLight