Oh Christmas Tree, Oh Christmas Tree

[Vickilynn]

I'm hoping you and I are talking about a different kind of Holy.

15 just as he who called you is holy, so be holy in all you do; 16 for it is written: "Be holy for I am holy." (1 Peter 1:15-16) It had nothing to do with traditions or celebrations, or works. We are holy because we have the Holy Spirit. We can only understand it because He gives us understanding. Holiness is not something that one can display in a church. It flows from their life.

Shalom Bib,

As a Jew and a born-again Christian, I must agree with you! Amen and amen.

[artsylady]

I feel sorry for Christians that don't celebrate Christmas. I haven't bothered with the dates because I think it's irrelevant.

I think we have to ask ourselves, is God upset with us for celebrating the birth of Jesus? We answer to Him and Him alone. Is He upset because we have the date wrong?

I do think that Santa is a clear diversion from Christmas and that's one reason I don't like the idea of teaching it to our kids. Let's be honest, those who were raised to believe in Santa, self included. As a kid, were you more excited about Santa or Jesus? Myself, I'd have to say Santa. How sad is that? I just changed my mind on the whole santa thing last year actually for this reason, plus more that I won't mention right now.

And, if all Christians decided to do away with celebrating Christmas, what would become of this holiday? It would become even more commercial, more santa claus oriented, more secular etc than it already is. At least nonbelievers go to church this time of year! At least we can still hear in some stores the mention of Jesus in songs at this time of year! At least secular radio stations play songs that carry the name of Jesus! At least children who are raised in secular environments can still see nativity scenes this time of year and ask questions! Why would we as Christians, want to give it up and give it all away to santa or back to pagan origins? For dating technicalities? Very hard for me to comprehend.

I believe it's the Christians duty to, as they say "keep Christ" in Christmas. And I don't think God's upset with us that we may have the date wrong.

[Vickilynn]

I feel sorry for Christians that don't celebrate Christmas. I haven't bothered with the dates because I think it's irrelevant.

I think we have to ask ourselves, is God upset with us for celebrating the birth of Jesus? We answer to Him and Him alone. Is He upset because we have the date wrong?

I do think that Santa is a clear diversion from Christmas and that's one reason I don't like the idea of teaching it to our kids. Let's be honest, those who were raised to believe in Santa, self included. As a kid, were you more excited about Santa or Jesus? Myself, I'd have to say Santa. How sad is that? I just changed my mind on the whole santa thing last year actually for this reason, plus more that I won't mention right now.

And, if all Christians decided to do away with celebrating Christmas, what would become of this holiday? It would become even more commercial, more santa claus oriented, more secular etc than it already is. At least nonbelievers go to church this time of year! At least we can still hear in some stores the mention of Jesus in songs at this time of year! At least secular radio stations play songs that carry the name of Jesus! At least children who are raised in secular environments can still see nativity scenes this time of year and ask questions! Why would we as Christians, want to give it up and give it all away to santa or back to pagan origins? For dating technicalities? Very hard for me to comprehend.

I believe it's the Christians duty to, as they say "keep Christ" in Christmas. And I don't think God's upset with us that we may have the date wrong.

Shalom Artsylady,

Amen! Great points!!!

[Emily~Anne]

I feel sorry for Christians that don't celebrate Christmas. I haven't bothered with the dates because I think it's irrelevant.

I think we have to ask ourselves, is God upset with us for celebrating the birth of Jesus? We answer to Him and Him alone. Is He upset because we have the date wrong?

I do think that Santa is a clear diversion from Christmas and that's one reason I don't like the idea of teaching it to our kids. Let's be honest, those who were raised to believe in Santa, self included. As a kid, were you more excited about Santa or Jesus? Myself, I'd have to say Santa. How sad is that? I just changed my mind on the whole santa thing last year actually for this reason, plus more that I won't mention right now.

And, if all Christians decided to do away with celebrating Christmas, what would become of this holiday? It would become even more commercial, more santa claus oriented, more secular etc than it already is. At least nonbelievers go to church this time of year! At least we can still hear in some stores the mention of Jesus in songs at this time of year! At least secular radio stations play songs that carry the name of Jesus! At least children who are raised in secular environments can still see nativity scenes this time of year and ask questions! Why would we as Christians, want to give it up and give it all away to santa or back to pagan origins? For dating technicalities? Very hard for me to comprehend.

I believe it's the Christians duty to, as they say "keep Christ" in Christmas. And I don't think God's upset with us that we may have the date wrong.

Shalom Artsylady,

Amen! Great points!!!

Ditto!

[Vickilynn]

Shalom Emily Anne,

Good to see you back! I've missed you!

[Hypathia]

It's interesting that we have to guess at the birthdate of Jesus. You'd think that the early christians would have absolutely known the actual date. James the brother of Jesus would have most certainly known it and shared that information ..... unless God didn't want us to mark or recognize the date for some reason known only to Him. And now we have assigned Jesus' birthday to that of pagan gods.....and everybody is just fine with that but when you think about it it's kind of insulting.

artsylady, I was reading your quotes, Thomas Paine wasn't an atheist and he did not "recant" on his deathbed and that was exposed shortly after this fake story was spread. There's been a lot of "fake quotes" put out over the years especially in the last 20 and these fake quotes are circulated for public consumption and people repeat them thinking they're true. You might want to double check your other quotes there and try verifying them before posting them as a signature.

[EricH]

Someone in my church has been asking questions about the origins of Christmas and how we should respond to it. Here was my answer

My name is Eric. I am one of the pastors on staff. I have been asked to dialogue with you in terms of some questions you have regarding Christmas. From reading your email, I see your questions as being the following:

1. Does the celebration of Christmas, as practiced today, have any pagan roots?

2. What are the implications of any such roots for us today?

As I have researched the topic, there is no question that some of what we currently refer to as

[Guest Biblicist]

AMEN! EricH.

[Vickilynn]

It's interesting that we have to guess at the birthdate of Jesus. You'd think that the early christians would have absolutely known the actual date.

Shalom,

Perhaps, perhaps not. They wouldn't necessarily have known His birth date, they weren't around when He was born.

James the brother of Jesus would have most certainly known it and shared that information

Again, James wasn't there at Yeshua's birth.

..... unless God didn't want us to mark or recognize the date for some reason known only to Him.

Well, that's your opinion, not G-d's. You can't support that Scripturally, as G-d does not say NOT to mark the date or recognize the date. So, it's your theory, not necessarily the truth.

And now we have assigned Jesus' birthday to that of pagan gods

No, again, you are mistaken. We worship, glorify and honor MESSIAH, not pagans.

.

....and everybody is just fine with that but when you think about it it's kind of insulting.

Actually, it's more insulting for you to continually accuse you brothers and sisters of worshiping pagans when they are worshiping Messiah. It is a judgment you cannot make, yet you continue.

Stick to the Scriptures. Look at MY siggy and you'll see MUCH rejoicing at the birth of Messiah. So, to celebrate His incarnation and birth are VERY Scriptural.

[Hypathia]

Whether to celebrate or not is all opinion. Mine is no less valid than anyone else's and I do try and provide some reasoning. James might not have been there but surely being Jesus' brother he would have known his birthday. I know my sibling's birthdays and they're just people. James brother was God, all the more reason to know and remember his birthdate and tell the whole world when it was, especially the other christians and converts of that era. Scripturally speaking the birthdate isn't mentioned and we are not told to "pick one" and celebrate it every year with pagan traditions and customs. You say God doesn't say "NOT" to and that's really a very weak argument when you think about it. It is an ancient pagan holiday, you can celebrate Jesus' birth on it if you want to, I'm just pointing out that this holiday has been around a long, long, time before it was ever christianized by the Catholic Church.

I hope this whole thing isn't some big test from God to see if we're willing to "give up" a human holiday for Him the way He gave up his life for us. If it is we're all gonna flunk I think. I sure hope I don't find myself in eternal hell for being "weak" and going with the flow.

btw Vicki - I'm not acusing anyone here of worshipping pagan gods. I don't think any of us here have ever done that.