"stephen ministers"

[sweetycakes]

Personally, God gives me the words to say to those who are in pain and grieving, through His Spirit. All it costs me is love.

May the Lord bless you mightily, as you seek to serve Him, for the glory of His Name

[OneLight]

onelight, YES! exactly! although the purpose of the stephen ministry (or something similar) would be more of a long-term thing... essentially the "stephen leaders" assign each "stephen minister" to basically mentor an individual through the entire grief process for whatever they're going through... basically they commit to being the person's confidante and encourager for approximately a year, sometimes more, sometimes less. so it's actually a little more involved than letting the Holy Spirit lead you in what to say to a person when you just happen to run into them at church or elsewhere.

Still, it seems much from what you say you got from it. If you got ZILCH in 4 hours @ $15. how much more do you expect to get in 1 week for over $1000? Did they say if you have to send them a percentage of the $50 you would have to charge for those you teach when you get back, and do they have material each person has to purchase? I guess what I am trying to say is that it sounds more like a business deal then a ministry. I could be totally wrong ...

[Guest man]

I guess what I am trying to say is that it sounds more like a business deal then a ministry. I could be totally wrong ...

It's a scam....you can say it.

If these people were really lead by God, it would be free.

In the christian world, anything pertaining to God should be free.

Christ gave His life for us........who are we to make a nickel off of that?

[pamiam]

Ok, my friends, I'm having multiple reactions here. As far as, "all it costs me is love," goes, that is a naive and uninformed statement. What good does it get me to spend three years and zillions of hours seeing clients getting a Master's degree, if all I need is love? Love may be sufficient in some cases, but does additional training not profit at all? Of course it does.

I spent a few years away back in time traveling with Florence Littauer and it was an unbelievable experience. She and her husband went in the hole financially for every seminar. Is that the burden of Christian ministry? Shouldn't be. Her seminars cost money but not enough to cover costs. We have friends who bought a motorhome and traveled the country for nearly two years before they ran out of money, trying to get churches to create programs to support caregivers. They finally gave up and got jobs. Not that they didn't learn huge lessons in God's love and provision, but they experienced over and over the idea that Christians should give themselves away, not charge, trust in God, etc. Of course there are two sides to every position but they were wonderful, kind-hearted, loving and generous people who got slammed by the belief that ministry should be free. Their problem, and Florence's, was that they weren't under the umbrella of a church that supported them.

I have a friend now who has spent thousands of dollars and nearly three years getting training in Bend, OR, at the Sacred Art of Living Center, training that equips her to be "with" someone as they go through the dying process. People, it costs money to fund projects. I want to say something about there ain't no such thing as a free lunch, but I don't know if it fits.

Anyway, I'm sure the Stephen Ministries could have done a better job with this seminar but lets be real careful about blanket condemnation of these groups who offer programs outside the local church. Most of them are done with hopeful and helping hearts.

[Guest LadyC]

Did they say if you have to send them a percentage of the $50 you would have to charge for those you teach when you get back, and do they have material each person has to purchase?

in answer to the question, the $50 per "minister" covers the cost of two thick manuals...

pamiam, i hear what you're saying. i believe that expenses associated with any kind of ministry, seminar, training session, etc., should be reimbursed, and i see absolutely no reason why, if a person or a couple, or even a group chooses to do that full time, they shouldn't also be paid enough to support themselves financially. after all, a christian mechanic isn't expected to rebuild your car's engine for free, so why should anyone else?

however, i think this particular ministry is charging exhorbitant amounts. now, to be fair, the cost of the week long training DOES include your hotel room and at least one meal per day., so i'm not even that terribly opposed to the per person fee. i AM opposed to each church having to pay nearly $2000 just to belong, and i'm also very opposed to the fact that the training sessions are offered exclusively to churches who have joined up. furthermore, there is no discount for attendees who choose not to stay in the hotel. what about those who wish to attend who live in dallas, and have no need for a hotel room? or what about, and i'll use myself as a hypothetical, what if i were to go there? i have friends and family living all over the dallas area... even though i no longer live there, it's where i was born and raised, so i would have no need for accommodations, and yet i would have to pay the same price as anyone else.

it just doesn't seem right to me.

however, the good news is i did some searching online last night, and found a much more econimical alternative. i sent the link to my pastor's wife and to my friend who is supposed to be kinda spearheading this project. for a total cost of $500, the church is provided all the training materials necessary, including everything from printed manuals, to audio, video, and powerpoint presentations... nothing to "join", no travel expenses, no fancy hotel rooms, and no "per person" fee.

that alternative seemed to have brought a huge sigh of relief to the person in charge of the project, although she will not jump into it without researching it and praying over it first, as well as discussing it with the pastor.

[OneLight]

Ok, my friends, I'm having multiple reactions here. As far as, "all it costs me is love," goes, that is a naive and uninformed statement. What good does it get me to spend three years and zillions of hours seeing clients getting a Master's degree, if all I need is love? Love may be sufficient in some cases, but does additional training not profit at all? Of course it does.

Sorry if I ruffled you feathers, but I stand firm on what I have said. You know nothing about who I am nor what I do for work, so to attack my statement in such a way is very naive and uninformed, if I may use your own words.

As far as the series goes, they can go if they wish. I said that it sounded more of a business deal where one would sell a lot of material, require classes and make a profit doing so. [sarcasm]The US has a great market on God and they are raking in millions every year, so why not more?[/sarcasm]

I still will take what God gives me free.

Be Blessed,

In His Peace,

OneLight

[Guest LadyC]

onelight, while i agree with pam in theory, i am in agreement with you regarding this particular ministry. or any money that operates in such a manner. that whole "moneychangers in the temple" thing really burns in my mind about this thing. it absolutely seems much more of a business than a ministry....

[OneLight]

I also am in agreement with Pam when it comes to an education and a college degree. What you were describing didn't sound anywhere near that. I hadn't asked, but are you then certified in a ministry upon completion?

[Guest LadyC]

i'm not sure onelight! i suppose the leaders are "certified", but the average leader only serves two years... which means the church is sending more people to that expensive training session quite frequently. oh, and the more members your church has, the more leaders they expect you to keep on staff... and of course, the more leaders, the more ministers under them.

no, this certainly isn't anything equal to a college education. they referred to it as "continuing education" i think. heck, it's a 50 hour training session... ten hours a day for five days. any certification one receives i'm sure is recognized solely by stephen ministries itself.

[GymRose]

Ok, my friends, I'm having multiple reactions here. As far as, "all it costs me is love," goes, that is a naive and uninformed statement. What good does it get me to spend three years and zillions of hours seeing clients getting a Master's degree, if all I need is love? Love may be sufficient in some cases, but does additional training not profit at all? Of course it does.

Sorry if I ruffled you feathers, but I stand firm on what I have said. You know nothing about who I am nor what I do for work, so to attack my statement in such a way is very naive and uninformed, if I may use your own words.

As far as the series goes, they can go if they wish. I said that it sounded more of a business deal where one would sell a lot of material, require classes and make a profit doing so. [sarcasm]The US has a great market on God and they are raking in millions every year, so why not more?[/sarcasm]

I still will take what God gives me free.

Be Blessed,

In His Peace,

OneLight

Onelight I have to agree with you.

I'm sorry but as a person who has been through emense personal struggles with a suicidal teen and both of us with severe depression I have turned to the "educated" as well as the uneducate, I found that NONE of the educted helped in anyway, in fact they made the situation worse. It was those that came in love that helped (the very few that did). I am not talking going to 1 or 2 I'm talking across the board christian and non christian alike. Those with the supposed training were useless because they used text book theory to try and help as opposed to heart felt understanding...... More over my son was put in the TOO HARD basket.

As far as these ministries go this is what has driven me out of church, I am so sick of programs that are supposed to equip the church to benefit the community that you have to buy books, Cds, DVDs etc for. All they do is benefit their own pockets and lifestyle. Never heard of this one and I really hope we don't in Australia.