I am Discouraged

[Axxman]

I have every authority to go to my leaders about any problem! Why is that an issue with you?

Its only an issue because its not in the scripture. If it was you'd have posted it by now. God does place leaders in our lives for a reason...and your husband is your leader.

There is the fact that men who do not lead as Christ, and so a woman is presented with a dilemma. You mustn't read into the scriptures that admonish a woman regarding submission that it was directed to every marriage--it is directed to Godly marriages.

No it wasn't. The verses I gave you SPECIFICALLY call women to remain submissive to husbands who are NOT following the word...or unsaved. How is that directed to Godly marriage? Its not. I agree it is a dilemma for women...but the dilemma is "Do you remain committed to following Gods word and remain subject to your husband, even when he is wrong"...or..."Do you take matters into your own hands, ignore biblical commands, and ignore your husbands God given authority."

Its not like God didn't know that men wouldn't be perfect husbands. God knew that men would mess up...and thats why God specifically made a point to tell women, through His Holy Word, to remain submissive in those times. Trust me...there's plenty in there for men too...because likewise, God knew wives wouldn't be perfect either.

[givennewname]

As my husband's sister in Christ, I have every authority to ask my husband's spiritual leader to speak to him. I would not be a good wife if I didn't seek correction for him, and restoration of unity. I am held accountable to God for seeing error and not attempting to right it. My family comes first UNDER God. You seem to harp on the woman's submissiveness. What about the husband's ability to hear the wife and submit to Godly wisdom? There's many a comment I could make on that common problem!

Husbands are certainly supposed to hear the wise counsel of their wives. There is absolutely nothing wrong with a husband who knows and respects the wisdom of his wife. Having a wife who knows and understands the things of God is a tremendous blessing and a man would be a fool to not listen and consider the words of his wife. However, it is still the man's job to lead his wife. The biggest problem here is that you are not providing and scripture to back up your claims here. What authority do you have to speak to another man about your spiritual problems with your husband? The quickest way to restore unity in the marriage is to submit to your husbands spiritual authority...even if you think he is wrong.

You say you want husbands to listen to their wives more..well the quickest way to undermine that is to start disrespecting his God given authority as the Head of the house. The scriptures can't be more clear on this point...I'll post it again...

Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands; that, if any obey not the word, they also may without the word be won by the conversation of the wives;" I Peter 3:1

If your hubby isn't in the word...submit to him so they may be won by the conversation of the wives. A husband is more likely to listen to a wife who is fulfilling her Godly role.

It is NOT my intent to place all the blame on women...their are plenty that men could do to be better spiritual leaders. I'm sure there are many comments you could make in that regard. However, with the OP in mind (and I'm glad she came back to clarify a bit) she simply has no scriptural authority to go against her husband in this case. If you have any scriptures that say a women doesn't have to submit to a husband who she disagree's with...I'll be glad to read them.

[OnFire4God]

[Once you find the truth, it can be presented in love. But you do not have to submit to heresy.

-Even if it DOES come from your husband!

How do you feel if the situation was just a matter of doctrinal differences? Ex. Husband believes one thing, wife believes another, both are supported with scripture. Submit then? Just wondering...

[iwbswiaihl]

[ GET YOUR husband to read this on being chosen. Jesus said that no one comes to the Father except He calls them. And many other places He states things like this John 15:5b without Me you can do nothing, so you state that you are discouraged, you too remember these things, Phil 2:13 it is God working in you to will and to do of His good pleasure. If you are wanting to come to Him in your heart then rest assured that it is the Holy Spirit who is putting this in your heart and you have to by faith claim that and rest in it. He or she that comes to Me I will in no way cast out John 6:37. Your trust and hope must be in Jesus and you are only to submit to your husband ==in the Lord(acts 5:29)

[Ningning]

[ you are only to submit to your husband ==in the Lord(acts 5:29)

What do you mean? Please make clear, submit to husband in the Lord? What kind of submission...

[Floatingaxe]

Its only an issue because its not in the scripture. If it was you'd have posted it by now. God does place leaders in our lives for a reason...and your husband is your leader.

He isn't my only leader. Sometimes I am his leader also. That's the equality that having Jesus Christ brings to a marriage. Jesus comes first, and He directs my path.

No it wasn't. The verses I gave you SPECIFICALLY call women to remain submissive to husbands who are NOT following the word...or unsaved. How is that directed to Godly marriage? Its not. I agree it is a dilemma for women...but the dilemma is "Do you remain committed to following Gods word and remain subject to your husband, even when he is wrong"...or..."Do you take matters into your own hands, ignore biblical commands, and ignore your husbands God given authority."

Its not like God didn't know that men wouldn't be perfect husbands. God knew that men would mess up...and thats why God specifically made a point to tell women, through His Holy Word, to remain submissive in those times. Trust me...there's plenty in there for men too...because likewise, God knew wives wouldn't be perfect either.

Scripture regarding marriages is directed to the believer. Women admonished to subject themselves in love toward their spouses who rehect Jesus Christ are believing wives.

[LadyRaven]

the T in the Tulip is ''Total depravity'', that is the teaching that man is so irreconcilably depraved that he cannot accept Christ on his own and needs the I in tulip ''Irresistable Grace'' to force him into salvation whether he likes it or not to be saved. This is where draydon's husband gets his beliefs whether you believe they have been stretch by him is one thing but the root of his beliefs are calvinistic.

Hypercalvinism is not Calvinism, it is heresy and it also has no basis even in the reformed faith, although those who are not Calvinist have stuck the label there and it stuck for some reason. I do know know why you insist on misrepresenting the teachings of the reformed faith, but I'll spell it out once again.

The T in tulip means that the human being is dead in sin that he cannot accept Christ on his own and needs the regeneration of the Holy Spirit (not the *I* in tulip as you insist) in order to then accept Christ. The *I* means that once that regeneration occurs, it is impossible for them not to accept Christ because it will be what they WANT, it will make NO SENSE to NOT do it, just like he was UNABLE to believe beforehand because he did not WANT TO and it made NO SENSE to him. There is no "like it or not" you will be saved. Nobody is saved against their will. Nobody is dragged kicking and screaming into heaven, nobody is forced to reject Christ who wanted to accept him.

I'm a Calvinist, I should know what I believe, and if you dont understand, then stop acting like you do. If you do understand then stop deliberately misrepresenting them.

[Xan]

the T in the Tulip is ''Total depravity'', that is the teaching that man is so irreconcilably depraved that he cannot accept Christ on his own and needs the I in tulip ''Irresistable Grace'' to force him into salvation whether he likes it or not to be saved. This is where draydon's husband gets his beliefs whether you believe they have been stretch by him is one thing but the root of his beliefs are calvinistic.

Hypercalvinism is not Calvinism, it is heresy and it also has no basis even in the reformed faith, although those who are not Calvinist have stuck the label there and it stuck for some reason. I do know know why you insist on misrepresenting the teachings of the reformed faith, but I'll spell it out once again.

The T in tulip means that the human being is dead in sin that he cannot accept Christ on his own and needs the regeneration of the Holy Spirit (not the *I* in tulip as you insist) in order to then accept Christ. The *I* means that once that regeneration occurs, it is impossible for them not to accept Christ

How is the different than what I said, it sounds Identical to me yet you say I have some how misrepresented you belief.

There is no "like it or not" you will be saved. Nobody is saved against their will. Nobody is dragged kicking and screaming into heaven, nobody is forced to reject Christ who wanted to accept him.

I'm a Calvinist, I should know what I believe, and if you dont understand, then stop acting like you do. If you do understand then stop deliberately misrepresenting them.

So you are saying we can choose to resist God's grace if we wanted to? And you are saying all men are giving opportunity to be saved? If not, then you believe exactly as I believe you believe. If you do not believe as I think you do, then explain to me what it is you do believe about limited atonement and Irresistable grace

Ezekiel33, I responded to you concerning this issue back on page 4, and all you did was quote me but not respond, yet now you have re-opened the discussion. I believe the answer you're looking for can be answered with that post:

"No sinner ever makes himself choose God and His holiness. It is God who chooses us. Calvinists believe God's election is unconditional and sovereign. John 15:16 "Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain." Here is an example of God's election; Romans 9:11-13: "For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth; It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger. As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated;" and verse 16: "So then, it is not of him that: willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy."

It is not the Calvinist viewpoint that we make no decisions or that we cannot accept Christ. Although, it is true that no one can accept Christ on our own, and even non-Calvinists believe that."

[iwbswiaihl]

What do you mean? Please make clear, submit to husband in the Lord? What kind of submission...

[Xan]

the T in the Tulip is ''Total depravity'', that is the teaching that man is so irreconcilably depraved that he cannot accept Christ on his own and needs the I in tulip ''Irresistable Grace'' to force him into salvation whether he likes it or not to be saved. This is where draydon's husband gets his beliefs whether you believe they have been stretch by him is one thing but the root of his beliefs are calvinistic.

Hypercalvinism is not Calvinism, it is heresy and it also has no basis even in the reformed faith, although those who are not Calvinist have stuck the label there and it stuck for some reason. I do know know why you insist on misrepresenting the teachings of the reformed faith, but I'll spell it out once again.

The T in tulip means that the human being is dead in sin that he cannot accept Christ on his own and needs the regeneration of the Holy Spirit (not the *I* in tulip as you insist) in order to then accept Christ. The *I* means that once that regeneration occurs, it is impossible for them not to accept Christ

How is the different than what I said, it sounds Identical to me yet you say I have some how misrepresented you belief.

There is no "like it or not" you will be saved. Nobody is saved against their will. Nobody is dragged kicking and screaming into heaven, nobody is forced to reject Christ who wanted to accept him.

I'm a Calvinist, I should know what I believe, and if you dont understand, then stop acting like you do. If you do understand then stop deliberately misrepresenting them.

So you are saying we can choose to resist God's grace if we wanted to? And you are saying all men are giving opportunity to be saved? If not, then you believe exactly as I believe you believe. If you do not believe as I think you do, then explain to me what it is you do believe about limited atonement and Irresistable grace

Ezekiel33, I responded to you concerning this issue back on page 4, and all you did was quote me but not respond, yet now you have re-opened the discussion. I believe the answer you're looking for can be answered with that post:

"No sinner ever makes himself choose God and His holiness. It is God who chooses us. Calvinists believe God's election is unconditional and sovereign. John 15:16 "Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain." Here is an example of God's election; Romans 9:11-13: "For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth; It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger. As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated;" and verse 16: "So then, it is not of him that: willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy."

It is not the Calvinist viewpoint that we make no decisions or that we cannot accept Christ. Although, it is true that no one can accept Christ on our own, and even non-Calvinists believe that."

you can claim this teaching is not what the calvinist teach but the reality is even you believe he has carried the teaching to far, his beliefs stem from a calvinistic view of the gospel.

If someone misinterprets a belief and carries it the extreme, how is that the fault of the actual teachings?