Apostles....or gamblers with Apostleship?

[Mudcat]

Act 1:26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles

Hopefully, the folks here will recognize the context behind this verse.

The Apostles prayed after picking two men and then cast lots on the matter, expecting God to answer in the lots that were cast.

I want us to remember, that lots were mentioned 70 or so times in the OT. Anyone wishing to take the tack that they were justified in their actions, can find it there I suppose.

However, Christ had told them.....

Act 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

Many, as I do, feel this promise of the Father was none other than the Holy Ghost himself.

Yet instead of waiting, it seems to me, they moved of their own volition to cast lots, between two men for Judas' place.

My question to you is....

Was God in this decision or was it man alone?

[ayin jade]

Didnt He chose Paul?

[Mudcat]

Didnt He chose Paul?

Excellent point and a thought worth exploring.

However, I am curious as to this compunction for the need to fulfill Judas place.

Was this an 'out of line' decision? Was it a mistake of Apostolic proportions?

[Larry 2]

Act 1:26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles

Hopefully, the folks here will recognize the context behind this verse.

The Apostles prayed after picking two men and then cast lots on the matter, expecting God to answer in the lots that were cast.

I want us to remember, that lots were mentioned 70 or so times in the OT. Anyone wishing to take the tack that they were justified in their actions, can find it there I suppose.

However, Christ had told them.....

Act 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

Many, as I do, feel this promise of the Father was none other than the Holy Ghost himself.

Yet instead of waiting, it seems to me, they moved of their own volition to cast lots, between two men for Judas' place.

My question to you is....

Was God in this decision or was it man alone?

Possibly a little unbelief on their part, but God honored them in their method much like He did with Gideon's fleece. God allowed Samuel come from Abraham's bosom show Saul that to come, and I'm sure if I get to thinking about it there were many instances like that.

[ColleenLovesMischief]

No one is perfect. The apostles made their human mistakes the same way we do. by nature humans are impatient.

[ayin jade]

Acts 1

24 And they prayed and said, You, Lord, knower of all hearts, show which one You chose from these two,

25 to take the share of this ministry and apostleship from which Judas fell, to go to his own place.

26 And they gave forth their lots. And the lot fell upon Matthias. And he was numbered with the eleven apostles.

The Lord chose Matthias. He could have nullified the casting of lots so neither one was chosen. He didnt. He allowed one to be chosen. Nothing bad came of it. The Lord likely used Matthias to spread the gospel too.

[KC02]

Interesting question. I see no parallel between waiting on the promise and replacing Judas.

They had faith in God... see my tagline We should all try it more often!

Once my grandfather was staring out a window watching a windmill turning. He asked God to stop the windmill from turning if He waned him to start a church. The windmill stopped. My grandfather said, "Ok, now make it start again."

With that, he started a church.

God is in the little things when we put our faith in him.

Act 1:26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles

Hopefully, the folks here will recognize the context behind this verse.

The Apostles prayed after picking two men and then cast lots on the matter, expecting God to answer in the lots that were cast.

I want us to remember, that lots were mentioned 70 or so times in the OT. Anyone wishing to take the tack that they were justified in their actions, can find it there I suppose.

However, Christ had told them.....

Act 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

Many, as I do, feel this promise of the Father was none other than the Holy Ghost himself.

Yet instead of waiting, it seems to me, they moved of their own volition to cast lots, between two men for Judas' place.

My question to you is....

Was God in this decision or was it man alone?

[Botz]

Act 1:26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles

Hopefully, the folks here will recognize the context behind this verse.

The Apostles prayed after picking two men and then cast lots on the matter, expecting God to answer in the lots that were cast.

I want us to remember, that lots were mentioned 70 or so times in the OT. Anyone wishing to take the tack that they were justified in their actions, can find it there I suppose.

However, Christ had told them.....

Act 1:4 And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.

Many, as I do, feel this promise of the Father was none other than the Holy Ghost himself.

Yet instead of waiting, it seems to me, they moved of their own volition to cast lots, between two men for Judas' place.

My question to you is....

Was God in this decision or was it man alone?

Hi Mudcat, I think there is a certain amount of confusion in your speculation for it is clear that the disciples were waiting for the promise of the Holy Ghost, as instructed by the risen L-rd, but it was not a 'passive' waiting, and they devoted themselves to prayer, during which time Peter arose and presumably was guided by G-d to recommend selecting a replacement for Judas Iscariot, and ultimately they did so through the traditional method of casting lots believing the 'hand of G-d' was in the final verdict. There is no way they did this out of their own presumption.

Further more it was necesssary to choose a replacement, as it was the Jewish 'Minyan' or 'Quorum' of twelve, that the L-rd Himself had chosen to work with,(nowadays a minyan consists of at least 10) and that in some way was representative of the twelve tribes of Israel. We are not told of Jesus discussing this with the disciples after His ressurection, but it is eminently possible.

Matt. 19:28 Jesus said to them, "I tell you with certainty, when the Son of Man sits on his glorious throne in the renewed creation, you who have followed me will also sit on twelve thrones, governing the twelve tribes of Israel.

[nebula]

Didnt He chose Paul?

Excellent point and a thought worth exploring.

My thought on that is this:

Acts 12

1 Now about that time Herod the king stretched out his hand to harass some from the church.

2 Then he killed James the brother of John with the sword.

Acts 13

1 Now in the church that was at Antioch there were certain prophets and teachers: Barnabas, Simeon who was called Niger, Lucius of Cyrene, Manaen who had been brought up with Herod the tetrarch, and Saul.

2 As they ministered to the Lord and fasted, the Holy Spirit said, "Now separate to Me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them."

3 Then, having fasted and prayed, and laid hands on them, they sent them away.

The commission of Barnabas and Saul came after the death of James. So, if Saul (Paul) was to "replace" anyone, it would have been James.

But then who did Barnabas "replace"? (For Barnabas was an apostle, too . . . Acts 14:4 - But when the apostles Barnabas and Paul....)

[nebula]

I am not so sure that Matthias was the choice of the Lord. I think it is telling that after he is chosen, he is never spoken of again.

If that is so, what does that say about the other Apostles who are not mentioned even once in the book of Acts?