ParanoidAndroid Posted March 10, 2009 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 39 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 591 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 14 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/01/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/27/1979 Share Posted March 10, 2009 Me thinks people are forgetting whats in the Bible. Satan and 1/3 of Angels cast down because of pride. Gods wrath against this and all rebellion such that a place of eternal torment is reserved for such. Satan roams the earth seeking whom he can devour. Instigator at the death of Gods beloved and most cherished Son Jesus. Satans only mission is to rob, cheat, and destroy people. Christians are to engage in spiritual warfare for souls. Satan fought against Michael the Archangel who was doing the will of God. Satan is filled with wrath like a spoiled brat that has been reprimanded. Satan is a flea beside GOD, but an adversary of us and Angels, able to last 21 days in battle with GODs Elite Arch Angel. Satan has been around a long time, it is folly to think he does not increase in craftiness and heineousness with time. He was defeated at the cross but still poses a threat till God finally finishes making use of his errors to bring glory to his Son. I haven't forgotten what's in the Bible, but I think you put a lot of store in very few verses. Perhaps you are the one putting too much store into what is not there. Satan being cast out in some "war in heaven" is commented on in only three passages in all of scripture - twice in the Old Testament, once in Revelation. And both times in the Old Testament the passage is referring to a human king being cast down - a prophecy that references some unknown spiritual battle (the Morning Star being cast down to Abraham's Bosom). I don't think three scattered references are enough to justify an entire doctrine on the nature of Satan. Certainly the passages (from the top of my head, at least) do not tell us how many of these angels followed Satan (definitely nothing as specific as 1/3 - I would suggest that is Church Tradition interpreting Revelation 12 to see the "stars" as being fallen angels in the war - and I find one verse from an apocalyptic text to be very shaky ground to base an entire doctrine on). I'm also not sure about the whole Archangel Michael fighting Satan, nor am I certain anywhere states that Satan can last 21 days in battle against God's elite. Most of this comes from Revelation, which I find very difficult to interpret even under the best of circumstances. However, I totally agree with the rest of that list you chose to write. Satan does indeed roam the earth seeking those he can devour, and his power over us mere humans is immense, and rightly we should watch out for Satan's temptations. I just tend to think that this is done according to God's will and Blessing - to use an analogy, think of this world like the army's version of "Basic Training". It's tough, it's gruelling, and it all is done to create a Right relationship with God through his Son, Jesus Christ. Now, Satan is our Drill Instructor. He's mean, he wants us to wash out, because only the truly dedicated to God can become heirs to his Eternal Kingdom. So he puts up obstacles that threaten our Training, he tempts us with all manner of sin and desires. The Drill Instructor is not a nice person, and it's his job to ensure that only those God wants make it through the Training. But the Drill Instructor is still just an employee of the head of the army (God). Once we pass Basic Training (reach heaven), God is there to welcome us into his family. Just a few thoughts ~ PA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCISGD Posted March 10, 2009 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 64 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,345 Content Per Day: 0.24 Reputation: 30 Days Won: 1 Joined: 03/05/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/10/1961 Share Posted March 10, 2009 Yes i guess it is just the way we look at it, except that Rev 20:2 describes him as a dragon and the Devil. Even his name has evil in it. So it was also Rev 12:4 the dragon that drew with him a 1/3 of the (stars of heaven) Angels down to earth and then waited for the Christ to be born so as to snatch Him straight away, but we know Joseph was warned not to stay put as Herod influenced by satan tried to destroy the child King. I really dont think its good to see him in any sense other than malicious in intent and action. A drill sargent may have some malicious reasons for exacting pain, but mostly they are there with the intent to prepare for the service of many but this is not Satans intent. The 21 day battle was when Daniel prayed and fasted for an answer fron God, and Michael the Arch( Elite ) Angel states he was held up in a war with Satan. I realise i have taken some liberty with interpreting revelation, and i apologise for being cheeky in the last post i wasnt only having a dig at you. But it was a liberty not usually right amongst unknown persons i admit. please forgive my insinuation of lesser bible memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ParanoidAndroid Posted March 10, 2009 Group: Senior Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 39 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 591 Content Per Day: 0.09 Reputation: 14 Days Won: 0 Joined: 04/01/2007 Status: Offline Birthday: 11/27/1979 Share Posted March 10, 2009 Well I think we both can agree that Satan has the intent of luring us away from God, and no matter what spin you put on that, it cannot be good. As I noted, for all practical purposes on this earth, Satan is our accusing angel and is attempting to the best of his vast abilities to tempt us away from the Right Path. I do understand your point of view - in many ways, your view is what would often be considered the "typical" interpretation from most Christians. *though it has been my experience that most Christians don't even know this much and simply take it on Faith that the Bible says there was a war in heaven* Regardless, since the application of these passages into our daily lives do not really affect the way we treat sin, I personally don't think the distinction is of utmost importance. It's enough that we both agree that Satan does not have our best interests at heart when he brings temptation to our lives. I didn't take offence to anything you said, I was just hoping to open the discussion to alternate viewpoints that some people probably haven't ever considered before. I understand that people will take different views, and while I do believe what I wrote, it is ultimately a non-essential doctrine, in my opinion. Whether Satan tempts us because he rebelled against God, or whether Satan tempts us because God set him that task, the point is - yep, Satan tempts us. All the best, JCISGOD ~ Paranoid Android Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCISGD Posted March 10, 2009 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 64 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,345 Content Per Day: 0.24 Reputation: 30 Days Won: 1 Joined: 03/05/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/10/1961 Share Posted March 10, 2009 Thanks P/A good tKo enjoy the company of open minded free radicals. God Bless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Believer1997 Posted March 10, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 1 Topic Count: 66 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 6,363 Content Per Day: 1.12 Reputation: 119 Days Won: 9 Joined: 11/07/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 10, 2009 As a Christian and having many Christian friends and associates - I don't know of anyone (within my scope of influence) who has 'turned Satan into a myth'..... he is quite real to those of us who love God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JCISGD Posted March 10, 2009 Group: Diamond Member Followers: 0 Topic Count: 64 Topics Per Day: 0.01 Content Count: 1,345 Content Per Day: 0.24 Reputation: 30 Days Won: 1 Joined: 03/05/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 04/10/1961 Share Posted March 10, 2009 As a Christian and having many Christian friends and associates - I don't know of anyone (within my scope of influence) who has 'turned Satan into a myth'..... he is quite real to those of us who love God. Succinct and to the point, I like it. Totally believe Satan to be a real and malovent being cast out of heaven for pride, and that he took with him 1/3 of the angels, who pressumably also were lifted up in pride choosing to follow and infected by Satan. What i dont understand is that some Christians say the demons (Satans minions who enter people and animals) are not the fallen angels. Well where did the demons come from then? and where are the fallen angels? The Bible always gives us sufficient evidence to know important details, and it is unnescessary to give exact accounts where the common powers of deduction will do. It is the glory of God to conceal a thing, that the wise can search it out. Proverbs somewhere, anyone know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sion Posted March 13, 2009 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 36 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/20/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 13, 2009 Satan is any man woman or child that loves the things of man and is not mindful of the things of God. Satan the adversary of God is busy at keeping you busy with other things rather than God. Being the adversary of God was what Peter was being when Christ called Him Satan. Matthew 16 23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bold Believer Posted March 13, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 2 Topic Count: 121 Topics Per Day: 0.02 Content Count: 1,931 Content Per Day: 0.34 Reputation: 126 Days Won: 8 Joined: 01/22/2009 Status: Offline Birthday: 07/13/1955 Share Posted March 13, 2009 Satan is any man woman or child that loves the things of man and is not mindful of the things of God. Satan the adversary of God is busy at keeping you busy with other things rather than God. Being the adversary of God was what Peter was being when Christ called Him Satan. Matthew 16 23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men. No, Satan is the great deceiver himself. Jesus simply realized who was behind what Peter had said and that he (Satan) was using Peter as a mouthpiece. Satan is an evil spirit entity, not a mere human. The term 'satan' in Hebrew means adversary at its root though, this is true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sion Posted March 13, 2009 Group: Members Followers: 0 Topic Count: 1 Topics Per Day: 0.00 Content Count: 36 Content Per Day: 0.01 Reputation: 1 Days Won: 0 Joined: 01/20/2008 Status: Offline Share Posted March 13, 2009 Satan is any man woman or child that loves the things of man and is not mindful of the things of God. Satan the adversary of God is busy at keeping you busy with other things rather than God. Being the adversary of God was what Peter was being when Christ called Him Satan. Matthew 16 23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men. No, Satan is the great deceiver himself. Jesus simply realized who was behind what Peter had said and that he (Satan) was using Peter as a mouthpiece. Satan is an evil spirit entity, not a mere human. The term 'satan' in Hebrew means adversary at its root though, this is true. If satan was a evil spirit Christ would have cast it out of peter, just like He did in all other instances. Christ was talking directly to Peter and what Peter was doing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matthitjah Posted March 14, 2009 Group: Royal Member Followers: 4 Topic Count: 1,285 Topics Per Day: 0.16 Content Count: 17,917 Content Per Day: 2.26 Reputation: 355 Days Won: 19 Joined: 10/01/2002 Status: Offline Share Posted March 14, 2009 Satan is any man woman or child that loves the things of man and is not mindful of the things of God. Satan the adversary of God is busy at keeping you busy with other things rather than God. Being the adversary of God was what Peter was being when Christ called Him Satan. Matthew 16 23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men. Grace to you, Actually, if I might for a minute, Jesus was pointing out that Peter was choosing the way of rebellious man through temptation, which is the way of satan. Rather than following God. If you follow the Scripture out in context you will get the whole story. Mt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts