Johni

Just reading this. The ones discussing the age of the earth may have stopped following this but I was wondering if they had heard of the theory of Gerald Schroeder. He is a nuclear physicist who believes in 6 literal days of creation AND that the earth is 15 billion years old (approx). I wouldn't attempt to explain his theory but if you are interested his web site is: http://www.geraldschroeder.com/ By the way, he is Jewish. Its very interesting reading but not for the mathmatically faint at heart anyway he has a really neat website.

I had also heard that this is the (supposed) day of the creation. And the other evening on tv I heard someone remark that this date is said by some to be the Messiah's coronation day. I don't know if these are from oral tradition or what...I was wondering about those things too. (OC thanks for what you shared!)

I've wondered about this too. One thought I have had is that in the MK there will still be death altho most natural peoples will live long lifespans. Apparently still animal deaths continue though the animal kingdom will be changed in some ways and it may be at this time that the lion will eat straw like the ox, not sure about that. Scripture does indicate that sacrifices of some types will continue (as discussed here by others). Certainly at the end of the MK with Satans last rebellion put down and the new heavens and new earth come (earth renovated) then death is totally done away with (my understanding) and that would apply to the animal kingdom too as far as I know. Since the very creation is groaning for this redemption it seems that the entire creation will be affected when death is destroyed. I would like to hear some others opinion on this as well.

I don't recall a scripture about the seasons being confused or not being able to tell one from the other. We are told that there will be signs in the heavens as well as drought, plagues etc in the tribulation period. But there is also this promise of God in Genesis: Gen 8:22 While the earth remaineth, seedtime and harvest, and cold and heat, and summer and winter, and day and night shall not cease

It was actually Canaan, Ham's son, who was cursed. And as far as we know he was not present. I don't even know if he was born yet. I read that Noah could not curse Ham because he was already blessed by God and could not be cursed personally but his son could carry the curse because of his Ham's sin (whatever it was). Another commentary I have read on this states that Ham's sin was more than just mocking his fathers drunken and naked state. That he acted in some very disrespectful way toward his father when the father was helpless to prevent him. I don't know but whatever he did, he certainly had Noah extremely upset. Imagine cursing your grandchild because of something your child has done... I think it would have to be something really bad.

about all the network and Fox programming is not fit to watch. However, when it comes to news, Fox news is much less slanted to the left so its the best news source on tv. Corruption is bad everywhere but we sure need to try to keep a lid on it as much as possible so that we don't become a place that openly operates on the bribe system like much of the world, especially the third world, does. I don't trust anyone in position of power, and believe even the honest ones need a good incentive to stay honest. Lots of audits, lots of undercover sting type operations, lots of looking over their shoulder.... Now days when so many do not have a moral rock to stand on imagine the temptations out there...example is the undercover detective who may make $60 to $90 thousand a year in his job, yet could be offered $100 thousand to let a drug shipment pass. In one hour he can make more than he does in the whole year! I'm thinking any human being can find a way to justify getting money under the table so we all have to beware.

The man should be the spiritual leader of his household. Otherwise couples have strengths and weaknesses. Each should recognize that and be willing to use that to the good of the familiy. for instance, whichever is the best at dealing with bills and figuring the budget should do it---whether its the husband or the wife. I personally don't know or care to know much about the upkeep of the car but glad my husband takes care of our vehicles! Husband and wife should be a team.

I enjoyed this a lot, thanks for sharing!

female type here

Interesting read. I think this is something that should be considered when the country debates things like universal health care and other entitlements. (of course that is just one narrow application of this overall idea)

Ann Coulter is so right on all the issues and so able to spear her opponants verbally that the only the defense they can usually mount is personal attack on her. SHe has literally been physically attacked on more than one college campus because they mostly can't stand conservatives and have no rebuttal to her arguements and so resort to attack. If you bothered to read her book "Godless, the church of liberalism" you might get a better clue of what she stands for. Yes, she has a sharp wit and sharp tongue and uses it. She is unabashedly conservative and does not mince words. You may not like her personally but if you disagree with her political stance that you are pro-abortion, pro homosexual special rights, pro evolution being taught as fact, pro bowing and scraping to our terrorist enemies and the whole liberal agenda. She stands for everything patriotic and the kind of conservatism that stands up for its-self....and for this she is attacked to the nth degree. I get her column by e-mail so even think its okay to copy and paste. Here is a sample of Ann. PARTY OF RAPIST PROUD TO BE GODLESS June 15, 2006 Ann Coulter I thought I'd put off that column on ethanol subsidies I'd been planning to write this week and instead address the topic that has so riveted the nation

As concerns what we would do if we had to choose between taking the mark or being unable to buy or sell, this reminds me of something that happened recently. (I would like to add in parenthesis that I do believe in the pre-trib rapture although can see the possibility that it might be pre-wrath). If you remember when the Fox news correspondant and his camera man were captured by (I think) Hamas in the Gaza strip. These two guys were released after a fairly short time. Later they were interviewed and I listened with interest but the part I wanted to hear more about was hardly mentioned. Just the very first news after their release seemed to even relate this and then it was like it was pushed under a rug, but they were made to convert to Islam. The Camera man, who is Swedish, I believe, was interrogated by the captors first. When he came back he was able to talk briefly to the captured reporter and told him. They are prepared to kill you so do exactly as they say. This will mean saying you convert to Islam but you better do it or else. (something to that effect). The Fox news guy indicated that he did not want to do that but the camera man told him to just do it---as it means nothing to you---just to satisfy them. The Fox news guy, was asked about Islam and did receive the demand to say that he accepted Islam as the only true religion yada yada yada... It was obvious from the first report that he did not like having to do that. But the later interview talked about a lot of what they went through but did not talk about the forced conversion. The thing that came to my mind was how much easier it is to say to yourself "well, I don't really mean it, and I will just say this to save my life, or my family". I don't think the camera man had much of any kind of religious belief anyway, but from what was originally said, that the news guy did not want to do this, I think he might have been (at least nominally) Christian. When I think of how God's children in the past were killed because they would not do things like bow to Ceasar or such as that, I would really be fearful for the eternal consequences of taking this easier path. Wasn't it Polycarp at over 90 years of age was martyred because he refused to throw incense on a fire, or some such thing that acknowledged Ceasar as a god? Did anyone else see the news on this and hear about this forced conversion?? We do not get told the complete truth a lot of times. I guess its not politically correct to accuse the peaceful religion of Islam with forced conversion but it is happening all over the place even in our present day and time. As far as people not being willing to take the mark.... one of my pastors used to say "If you won't give your heart now, you won't give your head then".

Sherman said "Anyhow, since the fall of mankind, various cultures have found polygamy to be helpful, even necessary, particularly when war killed off many of the men. Not only that, but men naturally do not loose the biological drive/desire to procreate until very late in life, if ever. Whereas women loose the biological drive/desire to procreate mid-life. (Of course I'm speaking in broad generalities.) " You can bet a man wrote that In fact, sexual relations are not just for procreation. You cannot support that thought with scripture! Man and wife are meant to support and complement each other physically but also spiritually and mentally. There is much more to the marriage relationship (and the marriage bed) than procreation. Women cannot become mothers as late into their life cycle as men can become fathers (thank God for that!) but that has nothing to do with desires, drives etc...

Thanks EricH... You are right I quit looking back at that post to see if anyone had answered. I had given up. I appreciate you link. I still have questions but I am getting an idea of how it might be that some are left out. As one person pointed out, the book of Matthew was written fairly early on and there were still many Jewish people around with access to the geneological record at that time, if this had not been correctly understood by Jews of this day there would have been challanges, and it does not seem that there were. Ad Seriatim: 1. The differences between the two geneological lines is that one traces Joseph, and one Mary. One lists all the kings--even those who only reigned a very short times--whereas Matthew's is clearly using the mnemonic device of the number 14 for purposes of memorization. 2. It matters ULTIMATELY that Jesus was God's Son, and not Joseph's! 3. Quirineas was Governor of Syria ca 10 BC to 2 BC, if I remember correctly, but not in 6 AD. And when speaking of "all the world" it was quite common that the 1st century Jews in the Middle East used the term to describe Palestine; they're 'whole world!' 4. Recent discoveries at the Sorbonne, and in Toledo have given a copy of Matthew's Gospel (perhaps even the very AUTOGRAPH!), dating from A.D. 62-65. Most scholars believe Mark was written prior to Mattew, so Mark clearly predates A.D. 62-65, many scholars leaning toward a date of around 45 for Mark. For Luke and John, the guess work is still a little more complicated, and most scholars feel 65-85 for Luke, and somewhere around A.D. 90 for John is probably fair. Interesting, for some reason I thought Matthew was the earliest written. But the fact that they were all written relatively soon after the events really supports their validity. Luke's writings contain the most intimate as far as Mary is concerned. Like he had spoken with her personally (or with someone who had known some of her most personal thoughts). Yet he was not one of the twelve.

Eric, thankyou so much for that link!! I had asked about the missing kings in the Matthew account previous to this (in the Hebrew roots section) and never got an answer.

I'm not good at links but try this article. There is a picture of a chupacabras. Unless the photo is altered it looks like something OTHER than anything else I can think of. Whatever it is....I don't want to meet it in person. www.crystalinks.com/chupacabras.html

I am also surprised that the "no" has the majority. I don't understand the reasoning behind some of the opinions. Take the same argument into another area such as...certain number of people will use drugs anyway so lets give them the free sterile needles, certain number of teens will have sex anyway so lets supply all the condoms and maybe even allow it home so its safer for them. I live near a town that (after many years) went from dry to wet. Alcohol was already available at certain resturants so folk who wanted wine with a meal, or beer with pizza could get it without dealing with bootleggers. The difference now is that we have package liquor stores sprung up and now finding all the cartons and beer cans along side my country road. I wonder why it is that beer drinkers (more than anybody else) throw their cartons and cans out on the road? Also more "clubs" springing up and I believe our police dept can attest to the fact that there is more drunk driving going on. Licensing a vice never controls it better. (it does bring in more revenue and taxes to certain people).

I heard him interviewed and it was very interesting, but I have not yet read the book.

What Christopher_John said!

It is necessary to take the Bible literally in the aspect of Adam and Eve being the parents of all humanity since the scripture tells us that by one man's sin we all became sinners (because we were all 'in Adam' when he sinned). It is no problem for me to imagine how the family basically "exploded" in number. I only have to look at my mothers family. Nine children (which I'm sure Adam and Eve had many more than that) and now the family tree is huge

Revel and many others who have more fully explained this subject, great job! I'm not very eloquent in this area and generally just avoid these kinds of discussions. Fortunately I received the baptism in the Holy Spirit when I was 12 and before I even knew that there were people who thought it was gift that had been rescinded. I would say that I don't have the "gift" of speaking in tongues because I don't have a prayer language that I can use at any time but I have had a number of re-fillings. One thing (among many!) that this has done for me...when I was an older teenager, at the age when kids start having doubts about their beliefs etc... I never had any serious doubts about God. Any time I heard someone express that doubt I would remember the miracle of my infilling with the Holy Spirit and just KNOW that whatever else I did not understand, this much I knew for sure----God is real. Later in a Christian college I attended one of my instructors was a former missionary. She told of how she and her husband worked at a boys orphanage in India in the 1940's. They were in an area where the people spoke the dialect of Malialam. One evening during a prayer meeting the boys began to praise the Lord and she and her husband were amazed to hear them begin to praise the Lord in very good English. These were boys who did not know English at all. I remember her saying that she hoped some day to hear someone (who did not know the language) to be praising the Lord in Malialam. I hope that happened for her!

technically we don't have a democracy, we have a republic. Ann Coulter is the BEST!

In reading this I'm wondering if these Christians moved into Gaza when the Israelis were forced to more out?? The article does not say.....

I hear that most tv viewing is pretty bad but honestly I never watch the network stuff. On dish network (satallite) we get way too many choices but the only ones we routinely watch are Daystar, Skyangel, TBN and Primetime (all Christian stations) and plus HGV, Discovery Health, History Channel, Fox News, and The Weather Channel. Thats plenty of viewing. Still rather read! By the way, they say there is a direct correlation between your age and how much time you spend watching the Weather Channel!

I am a bit disappointed that no one has responded about the 3 missing names. If the Matthew passage makes a point of saying there are 14 generations from David to the carrying away to Babylon and yet the OT shows 17 I believe there must be some reason and was hoping some one who had an understanding of Hebrew roots and background would have the answer to this. I do think there IS a reason but I don't know what it is and was hoping someone here would know.