Forgiveness and Trust

[Guest lovinghim4ever]

Yes, we are to forgive people,

but that doesn't mean we have to trust them.

Someone has hurt me terribly, and I forgive them.

However, I don't trust them anymore and probably never will.

[nebula]

I understand what you are saying.

If a parent gives money to their child to purchase groceries for the household, but the child spends the money on selfish pleasure, does forgiveness mean no consequences? That the parent gives money to the child again without evidence that the child won't repeat the action?

(Maybe a crude analogy, but it's the best I could come up with . . . unless I were to refer to the thread about a sex offender being ordained as a pastor - now there's an issue of forgiveness vs. trust!)

Anyway, I've been in this debate before - most people seem to disagree.

But I hear what you are saying. Trust has to be earned back. Forgiveness allows them the grace to regain the trust should they decide to make the effort. Now if the person works to regain the trust, but you don't budge, then it could be argued you haven't forgiven.

But I know what it's like to have a trust broken in such a way that I had to cut off a friendship for my own safety. The guy said he was sorry "if I did anything that hurt you" - but until he shows he understand how his actions hurt me and acknowledges that he had acted foolishly, admitting to his actions (which he had been confronted about) I had to stay apart from him. Else the injury could be repeated. . . again. And I even told him this, but he still wouldn't acknowledge that he acted wrong.

So I hear you.

Forgiveness in cases like this - love and pray for them as we are told to do ("love your enemies"), don't throw them in jail to repay the denaria...but you might not want to lend them money again unless they show for sure they can repay it.

[ellarose]

Yes, we are to forgive people,

but that doesn't mean we have to trust them.

Someone has hurt me terribly, and I forgive them.

However, I don't trust them anymore and probably never will.

I completely agree with you! This is how I felt when I found out my boyfriend was very addicted to pornography for the first 2 years of our relationship and was also a false convert. It's been another 2 years and I am learning to trust him again but forgiveness is DEFINATELY very different to trust. i had forgiven him the day he told me

[~candice~]

Yes, we are to forgive people,

but that doesn't mean we have to trust them.

Someone has hurt me terribly, and I forgive them.

However, I don't trust them anymore and probably never will.

I am so sorry that you are feeling hurt right now . I also believe that forgiveness is different to trust. It can be a long and slow process to rebuild trust once it has been broken, even though forgiveness was given a long time ago. Trust says - I have faith that you will not willingly offend against me again, forgiveness says - I no longer hold past offenses against you.

On this earth, in these sinful bodies, we are going to be hurt and cause hurt. Makes me even more thankful for the forgiveness we have in Christ.

[ellarose]

Yes, we are to forgive people,

but that doesn't mean we have to trust them.

Someone has hurt me terribly, and I forgive them.

However, I don't trust them anymore and probably never will.

I am so sorry that you are feeling hurt right now . I also believe that forgiveness is different to trust. It can be a long and slow process to rebuild trust once it has been broken, even though forgiveness was given a long time ago. Trust says - I have faith that you will not willingly offend against me again, forgiveness says - I no longer hold past offenses against you.

On this earth, in these sinful bodies, we are going to be hurt and cause hurt. Makes me even more thankful for the forgiveness we have in Christ.

Yes Andy

[Believer1997]

I understand what you are saying.

If a parent gives money to their child to purchase groceries for the household, but the child spends the money on selfish pleasure, does forgiveness mean no consequences? That the parent gives money to the child again without evidence that the child won't repeat the action?

(Maybe a crude analogy, but it's the best I could come up with . . . unless I were to refer to the thread about a sex offender being ordained as a pastor - now there's an issue of forgiveness vs. trust!)

Anyway, I've been in this debate before - most people seem to disagree.

But I hear what you are saying. Trust has to be earned back. Forgiveness allows them the grace to regain the trust should they decide to make the effort. Now if the person works to regain the trust, but you don't budge, then it could be argued you haven't forgiven.

But I know what it's like to have a trust broken in such a way that I had to cut off a friendship for my own safety. The guy said he was sorry "if I did anything that hurt you" - but until he shows he understand how his actions hurt me and acknowledges that he had acted foolishly, admitting to his actions (which he had been confronted about) I had to stay apart from him. Else the injury could be repeated. . . again. And I even told him this, but he still wouldn't acknowledge that he acted wrong.

So I hear you.

Forgiveness in cases like this - love and pray for them as we are told to do ("love your enemies"), don't throw them in jail to repay the denaria...but you might not want to lend them money again unless they show for sure they can repay it.

I agree - Trust in another is earned.

[south]

yes, they are not the same...

south

[OneLight]

Forgiveness should be given as the Lord forgives, since we no longer belong to ourselves, but to Him who paid the price for us.

Trust is a different issue all together. Trust, in it's basic meaning, is what you give someone you do not know, also seen as hope. After that, you have confidence in what a person will do through knowledge on their past actions, where this knowledge changes the meaning of trust.

[Fez]

I agree that Jesus taught us to forgive, as difficult as it may sometimes be to do so when we have been hurt

Mat 6:14 For if you forgive others their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you,

Mat 6:15 but if you do not forgive others their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

And I also agree that trust is a thing earned, and once lost is doubly hard to find again. And although slightly out of context, when Paul wrote to the church in Corinth:-

1Co 2:9 But, as it is written, "What no eye has seen, nor ear heard, nor the heart of man imagined, what God has prepared for those who love him"--

1Co 2:10 these things God has revealed to us through the Spirit. For the Spirit searches everything, even the depths of God.

His advice was that the Holy Spirit will reveal God through the Spirit, and thing also a persons heart in the long run. Sometimes I have been guilty of not listening to the Spirit, and have seen people as I want to see them, or hope them to be, and this is usually when I have been hurt and have had to forgive the person, and more often as not, ask for forgiveness myself for not listening when the Holy Spirit spoke.

I tried an exercise in home group one night and asked people to close their eyes and say nothing until I spoke. When I said OK, I asked how long we had been sitting still. Some said a minute, some said two. It was 30 seconds. Everyone agreed that it seemed much longer. My question to them then was, If someone insults you, or does something to annoy you, do you think 30 seconds is long enough to forgive them? Anything over 30 seconds, and it becomes harder to do.

Of course I am not talking about major hurt against someone, that takes prayer and time to heal, and to forgive, (we are only human after all) but the small daily things that get up your nose about people. I have practiced this 30 second "rule" and it generally works.

There are still people that have done some really nasty things to me that I struggle with forgiveness for, and when I have forgiven them, wonder why the feeling of unpleasantness that I feel when meeting them still persists. Have I really forgiven them then? Or are those feelings natural, even though I have forgiven?

Guess what I am saying is what is forgiveness really? How far does one take it?

[OneLight]

Guess what I am saying is what is forgiveness really? How far does one take it?

Forgiveness frees ones heart of bitterness. Bitterness hinders the working of the Holy Spirit in one's life and is sin. We are to take forgiveness as far as Christ did. Being human, we will never be able to achieve this in this life, but we are to strive for the holiness of Him.

1 Peter 1:13-16 (New King James Version)

Therefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and rest your hope fully upon the grace that is to be brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ; as obedient children, not conforming yourselves to the former lusts, as in your ignorance; but as He who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct, because it is written,