Ark of the Covenant

[lekh l'kha]

Ishmael and his mother were godless heathens. The inheritance did not get stolen away from Issac, God planned for Issac to have it all along.

I'm talking about from Ishmael's perspective, the way it must have made him feel to have been sent away. The Biblical account shows that he must have loved his father, and his father loved him, even petitioning God that Ishmael be the one through whom the promise would come, but God said no, and for good reason - because the hand of man cannot force the work of God, and Ishmael was born as a result of the hand of man trying to force the work of God.

But that wasn't Ishmael's fault. And I doubt that Hagar, though a born of heathen people, was a Godless woman - she cried out to God in her distress, and God heard her. Also, Ishmael would have been brought up by his father Abraham to believe in God, not in the gods of the heathen - and God blessed Ishmael also as a result of Abraham's request.

And regardless of what Abraham's and Jacob's failings were, God used them for his purpose. They were mighty men of God. No, I do not hate muslims, I just hate the lies they believe and propogate.

Exactly - they were as human as we are, but despite their failings, God used them for His purpose.

[nebula]

I agree that the current conflict is really about's Islam and its thirst for domination, but Muslims are taught that it was Ishmael Abraham was going to sacrifice on the mountain, not Isaac, and they are taught that they are descended from Ishmael, and that's maybe why so many Muslims are given that name.

I think we are talking apples and oranges.

The conventional thought is that the Ishmael/Isaac conflict never went away, that what we see now is the direct bloodline of conflict.

But in reality, that is long gone. What we see now is pure Islam - yes they used the old conflict to build and fan the fires, but it isn't truly the original fire.

[other one]

I agree that the current conflict is really about's Islam and its thirst for domination, but Muslims are taught that it was Ishmael Abraham was going to sacrifice on the mountain, not Isaac, and they are taught that they are descended from Ishmael, and that's maybe why so many Muslims are given that name.

I think we are talking apples and oranges.

The conventional thought is that the Ishmael/Isaac conflict never went away, that what we see now is the direct bloodline of conflict.

But in reality, that is long gone. What we see now is pure Islam - yes they used the old conflict to build and fan the fires, but it isn't truly the original fire.

I think you're right Neb. From all I've read about Ismael outside the Bible, it was not Allah that Ishmael worshiped.

[Arthur Durnan]

Some writers think it's in Ethiopia, but most of the evangelical commentators I've perused seem to think the Ark of the Covenant remains hidden under the Temple Mount ready to be revealed by God (through men) at the appropriate time, a period many feel is right about now in these end-times. Anything Islam says about anything biblical should be taken with a ton of salt as Islam is dead-set against Israel & its adventures with Jehovah God, the One True God.