Animals & Un-natural ideas of man.

[other one]

Seaworld is not just an amusement park, they do a lot of marine research there. This/These whales are also used for a lot of research, and the park park part of Seaworld raises money to keep the whole thing going.

Keep in mind that the woman who was killed was very knowledgeable and knew the whale and it's history. She knew that the whale was having a bad day and had been irritable all day....... she made a mistake by not dealing with that. I know pit bulldog owners that have made the same mistakes. It's something that goes along with the work. I personally have never understood why anyone would get into the water with a large meat eating fish.....

I'm not sure if the whales are sad or happy with their situation, but I would be careful of planting our human feelings of freedom onto these whales. While I don't know on a personal level, but they may well be very satisfied of having clean water and food and not have to worry about being eaten by something else...... when they get sick they get care, when hungry they are fed and they don't go. The one's I've seen, seem to like the people they are around.

It would be interesting to see if they were given access to the ocean whether they would just leave and not come back, or stay around the good food source.

[nebula]

Err . . . treetopflyer -

Do you realize what impression that gives for you to leave the discussion after the question that was asked you?

[nebula]

Seaworld is not just an amusement park, they do a lot of marine research there. This/These whales are also used for a lot of research, and the park park part of Seaworld raises money to keep the whole thing going.

Right, there is that.

I'm not sure if the whales are sad or happy with their situation, but I would be careful of planting our human feelings of freedom onto these whales....

Right, which is what I'm asking.

[Guest LadyC]

i'm surprised... you're wondering if these animals are capable of emotions? obviously they are, or the trainer would still be alive today. do ya'll realize that whales are highly intelligent creatures?

how can anyone even suggest that it's unreasonable to think a wild animal would be content to be captured and kept in captivity and to be made to perform to noisy crowds for the rest of its life? the only ones that might be content are the ones who've been born in captivity and know nothing else, and even they probably have instinctual longings for freedom.

and for those of you who question that maybe these animals like where they are at, have any of you even considered my plea for you to watch the film "the cove"? i bet you haven't even bothered to watch the trailer for it, which i posted. here, i'll post it again. http://thecovemovie.com but i seriously am asking you to rent it and spend 90 minutes educating yourself about what really takes place so that these animals can become entertainment.

[Guest]

Err . . . treetopflyer -

Do you realize what impression that gives for you to leave the discussion after the question that was asked you?

Nebula, I answered the question. What is your probelm with that? And as far as impressions go, do you really think I'm that worried what impression I will make? Do you? And personally, I think instead of alluding to something,...perhaps the person could of simply asked a direct question of me, I would of been happy to answer. But they didn't...they started off with quoting a couple of earlier posts and led off their question with the word..wait. Now I may not be all that smart, but to me that indicated that there was something wrong with me asking this question in my original post in the first place. I've been called a hypocrite before to my face from a brother...and I didn't handle that very well. And from how I'm feeling at this moment, the best thing would probably for me to sign out, but I'm not going to. In a way, I just don't have anything to lose anymore.

I took that question that started with the word wait, as...I shouldn't of asked anything because I have two snakes in my house. Well, you know, if they would of simply asked why i would of answered but there is more drama in the way the phrased the question, isn't there? Isn't that what yall like, drama. I've seen this in many other threads and the one thing that comes to mind is simply, love is expressed in the most unusual ways. Don't get me wrong...this is not the norm, the vast majority of threads are not only imformative but also encouraging, and if one learns something from them, then all the better.

And now that I've said this, I think I will go back and reply to this person. And by the way, I never refer to the snakes that are in my house as my pets. You will not hear that from me.

I would hope that you read my reply to this person.

[Guest]

Deepblue,

This reply is mainly for your ears but I hope that anyone who replied in this thread will see this too.

First. Next time. Try being a bit more dirert with your thoughts...rephrase your question so that I know exactly what your asking. I'm going to reply to what you asked as how I perceive what you asked. And that is I should not of ever said anything about whales in captivity becasue I have 2 snakes in captivity. That's how I perceive your question. If I'm wrong, I'm sure you will let me know.

To refresh your memory...Wait...don't you have pet snakes? Or am I thinking of someone else?

I have 2 snakes. The first(a ball python), I bought amost 6 years ago when I was very much alone. I won't get into the reason why I was alone, it's none of your business. At this time in my life, God was non-existent. And anything that concerned God, well, I did not care. It was through a friend that I first held a ball python in my hands. The next week I went and bought her, all of 3 months old and about 16 inches long and very skinny. Today she is 4'4" long, beautiful colours, and a very nice temperament. She is not stressed. Even though I wasn't concerned with anything about God, when I would hold her in my hands or just watch her run around the house...I would think of God. I better say this before I go on, I'm not making any excuse of a spiritual nature to justify her being in my house. I'm just saying these thoughts would come when I would handle her. And even when I would just watch her.

These past few months, well, things are changing in my life concerning God and my relationship with Him. Whether you believe it or not, things change, beliefs change, over time my thoughts about buying her have definately changed. What is done is done. Oh, and I have tried to see what I could do to get her back home, but it seems that she would only end up in another's house. My responsibility to make sure she is cared for in the proper manner is my first concern. So, I decided that I will keep her here. Oh, and everyday, yes, I see her as an inmate. That does not sit well but I do the best I can with this situation.

The second snake(an Albino Red Rat Snake) was given to me, the person was not caring for it properly. So I took her in. This was about six months ago. Even then, there was thought put into taking her or not, but the condition of her environment cemented my decision, without a doubt.

So there it is. I hope I answered the question that I think you really were asking. Oh, and by the way, I know my own life is not living up, making the grade, however you want to say it...the witness my life is for God, well, it's not good. I am doing something about it though. And I think it's becasue I am doing something now, that I didn't reply the way I first wanted to. I would of been banned. I gave it a day to think about this. And even though I wasn't going to reply, it seems I was sort of put under the spotlight by another in this thread and I felt there was no other choice but to respond.

I'm being matter of fact about this,...letting my emotions sit over there for a bit while I get all this out. I do hope that I haven't come accross as sounding angry, or bitter, or resentful, or saying things I would regret. That's what I did the last time. I really don't want to continue to do those things. Anyway, I think there is nothing more I can say to you about this. Take it and come to your own conclussions and impression of my sincerety. I don't have anything else to say.

[nebula]

Err . . . treetopflyer -

Do you realize what impression that gives for you to leave the discussion after the question that was asked you?

Nebula, I answered the question. What is your probelm with that? And as far as impressions go, do you really think I'm that worried what impression I will make? Do you? And personally, I think instead of alluding to something,...perhaps the person could of simply asked a direct question of me, I would of been happy to answer. But they didn't...they started off with quoting a couple of earlier posts and led off their question with the word..wait. Now I may not be all that smart, but to me that indicated that there was something wrong with me asking this question in my original post in the first place. I've been called a hypocrite before to my face from a brother...and I didn't handle that very well. And from how I'm feeling at this moment, the best thing would probably for me to sign out, but I'm not going to. In a way, I just don't have anything to lose anymore.

I took that question that started with the word wait, as...I shouldn't of asked anything because I have two snakes in my house. Well, you know, if they would of simply asked why i would of answered but there is more drama in the way the phrased the question, isn't there? Isn't that what yall like, drama. I've seen this in many other threads and the one thing that comes to mind is simply, love is expressed in the most unusual ways. Don't get me wrong...this is not the norm, the vast majority of threads are not only imformative but also encouraging, and if one learns something from them, then all the better.

And now that I've said this, I think I will go back and reply to this person. And by the way, I never refer to the snakes that are in my house as my pets. You will not hear that from me.

I would hope that you read my reply to this person.

Hey Treetop -

I apologize for my having a problem of being blunt rather than diplomatic. But I hope you can understand a few things?

This isn't meant to be criticism, as communication on a message board is a lot more tricky than communication in person - we can't read body language or hear voice fluctuation here.

In a debate, it's often hard to discern when a person is arguing to prove a point verses pushing a point in order to learn more from the opposing side.

And often in debates, people will ask a question and then give the point of the question after the answer is given. It's done this way in the court of law, too.

So when the question was asked if you have snakes, then you said you did, but then you said you're bowing out of the debate, that did give the impression that you got caught arguing against animals in captivity while you have some in captivity yourself, and were thus running away. Thus, it strengthened the opposing side - not just for those who disagree with you, but for those who have uncertain thoughts and feelings over this debate and may have been seeking to learn.

So when I posted what I did, it wasn't to condemn you or judge you, it was to inform you that you just nullified yourself. So although I am saddened I angered you, I am glad that I did provoke you enough to come back and explain yourself. It's what we needed to hear.

So I thank you for responding and clarifying how your actions do not negate you OP.

OK?

[Believer1997]

I read an article today that said SeaWorld was going to continue it's show schedule and continue using the whale involved in 3 deaths in future shows. I am amazed at this - I can't imagine what trainer would get in the water with this creature - it's not the fault of the whale - it is, after all, a wild creature in captivity... too many trainers and people who work with wild animals in captivity forget that very basic fact... they are wild.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/02/26/florida.s...dex.html?hpt=T2

[Guest]

Err . . . treetopflyer -

Do you realize what impression that gives for you to leave the discussion after the question that was asked you?

Nebula, I answered the question. What is your probelm with that? And as far as impressions go, do you really think I'm that worried what impression I will make? Do you? And personally, I think instead of alluding to something,...perhaps the person could of simply asked a direct question of me, I would of been happy to answer. But they didn't...they started off with quoting a couple of earlier posts and led off their question with the word..wait. Now I may not be all that smart, but to me that indicated that there was something wrong with me asking this question in my original post in the first place. I've been called a hypocrite before to my face from a brother...and I didn't handle that very well. And from how I'm feeling at this moment, the best thing would probably for me to sign out, but I'm not going to. In a way, I just don't have anything to lose anymore.

I took that question that started with the word wait, as...I shouldn't of asked anything because I have two snakes in my house. Well, you know, if they would of simply asked why i would of answered but there is more drama in the way the phrased the question, isn't there? Isn't that what yall like, drama. I've seen this in many other threads and the one thing that comes to mind is simply, love is expressed in the most unusual ways. Don't get me wrong...this is not the norm, the vast majority of threads are not only imformative but also encouraging, and if one learns something from them, then all the better.

And now that I've said this, I think I will go back and reply to this person. And by the way, I never refer to the snakes that are in my house as my pets. You will not hear that from me.

I would hope that you read my reply to this person.

Hey Treetop -

I apologize for my having a problem of being blunt rather than diplomatic. But I hope you can understand a few things?

This isn't meant to be criticism, as communication on a message board is a lot more tricky than communication in person - we can't read body language or hear voice fluctuation here.

In a debate, it's often hard to discern when a person is arguing to prove a point verses pushing a point in order to learn more from the opposing side.

And often in debates, people will ask a question and then give the point of the question after the answer is given. It's done this way in the court of law, too.

So when the question was asked if you have snakes, then you said you did, but then you said you're bowing out of the debate, that did give the impression that you got caught arguing against animals in captivity while you have some in captivity yourself, and were thus running away. Thus, it strengthened the opposing side - not just for those who disagree with you, but for those who have uncertain thoughts and feelings over this debate and may have been seeking to learn.

So when I posted what I did, it wasn't to condemn you or judge you, it was to inform you that you just nullified yourself. So although I am saddened I angered you, I am glad that I did provoke you enough to come back and explain yourself. It's what we needed to hear.

So I thank you for responding and clarifying how your actions do not negate you OP.

OK?

I'm sitting thinking that I've learned a bit about what a debate is. I found your reply interesting and I will admitt...I am not good at communicating at times...most times. My not understanding how this goes...well, that's on me. Perhaps there is something I missed reading concerning the "ways" of posting. I'll check on that.

Hey, if anyone got me angry, it was just myself. This is what I mean by not communicating well. I tried that bowing out thing becasue I did not want to reply in anger. And I felt that I was close to that happening. I know this is something serious I've to sort out. I'll do my best to remember the ways of debate in the future.

Thank you.

God Bless you.

[Guest LadyC]

i'm surprised... you're wondering if these animals are capable of emotions? obviously they are, or the trainer would still be alive today. do ya'll realize that whales are highly intelligent creatures?

what emotion was the whale showing when it killed this trainer?

it darn sure wasn't happiness, now was it?