Who is the He in Daniel 9:27?

[Bold Believer]

Jen

Oh yes it does;

Seventy sevens are decreed for your people (Daniels people,Israel) and your holy city (Jerusalem) to:.....

The seventy sevens are for Israel and Jerusalem and that is it. The issuing of the decree to rebuild Jerusalem and the Anointed One being cut off are markers. The onset of the first seven and the end of the 69th seven. That's all.

Where in Scripture did Christ make a seven year covenant. Book, chapter and verse would be nice. If one cannot provide this Scripture (your interpretation of the "he" in Daniel 9:27 is meaningless).

Matt 24:15,16 (Jesus says) So when you see standing in the holy place the A/D spoken by the prophet Daniel (this is referring to Daniel 9:27). So this is not the timing of the crucifixion and not referring to Jesus.

In Christ

Montana Marv

Whoa there Marv. Nothing in the text indicates that the covenant exists for 7 years. The covenant is an existing covenant which is confirmed. That means that covenant had to have been in place and active before the 7 began. Originally, I thought it had to be the New Covenant of the Last Supper, however in another post Retrobyter offered up the Davidic covenant, which seems to fit the bill better, having already been in place.

[douggg]

Jen

Oh yes it does;

Seventy sevens are decreed for your people (Daniels people,Israel) and your holy city (Jerusalem) to:.....

The seventy sevens are for Israel and Jerusalem and that is it. The issuing of the decree to rebuild Jerusalem and the Anointed One being cut off are markers. The onset of the first seven and the end of the 69th seven. That's all.

Where in Scripture did Christ make a seven year covenant. Book, chapter and verse would be nice. If one cannot provide this Scripture (your interpretation of the "he" in Daniel 9:27 is meaningless).

Matt 24:15,16 (Jesus says) So when you see standing in the holy place the A/D spoken by the prophet Daniel (this is referring to Daniel 9:27). So this is not the timing of the crucifixion and not referring to Jesus.

In Christ

Montana Marv

Whoa there Marv. Nothing in the text indicates that the covenant exists for 7 years. The covenant is an existing covenant which is confirmed. That means that covenant had to have been in place and active before the 7 began. Originally, I thought it had to be the New Covenant of the Last Supper, however in another post Retrobyter offered up the Davidic covenant, which seems to fit the bill better, having already been in place.

Which covenant established the daily sacrifice? It was the Mt. Sinai covenant. The Mt. Sinai covenant will be confirmed.

Here is the 7 years in the text. The Antichrist, false King Messiah, will oversee the commemorative reading of Moses's instructions, at God's direction, to go in and possess the land. The reading will be from the temple mount, which the Jews interpret as being the place of God's choosing.

Deuteronomy 31: 7And Moses called unto Joshua, and said unto him in the sight of all Israel, Be strong and of a good courage: for thou must go with this people unto the land which the LORD hath sworn unto their fathers to give them; and thou shalt cause them to inherit it.

8And the LORD, he it is that doth go before thee; he will be with thee, he will not fail thee, neither forsake thee: fear not, neither be dismayed.

9And Moses wrote this law, and delivered it unto the priests the sons of Levi, which bare the ark of the covenant of the LORD, and unto all the elders of Israel.

10And Moses commanded them, saying, At the end of every seven years, in the solemnity of the year of release, in the feast of tabernacles,

11When all Israel is come to appear before the LORD thy God in the place which he shall choose, thou shalt read this law before all Israel in their hearing.

12Gather the people together, men and women, and children, and thy stranger that is within thy gates, that they may hear, and that they may learn, and fear the LORD your God, and observe to do all the words of this law:

Edited January 24, 2012 by douggg

[JohnD]

Daniel 9:27

And HE shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week HE shall cause the sacrifce and oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations HE shal make it desolate, even until the comsummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

So I was just wondering how everyone views the HE in Daniel 9:27. Please feel free to give opinion, but if possible it would be great if you give scripture to back up your view. I was just curious because I think I'm in the minority in my view of the He given in Daniel 9:27. As from what I hear most Christians say the He is the antichrist, and I just don't see this from this verse.

In case your wondering, yes I think the HE is Jesus Christ.

Daniel 9:24-27 (NASB95)

24 “Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to make an end of sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy place.

25 “So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; it will be built again, with plaza and moat, even in times of distress.

26 “Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city AND THE SANCTUARY. And its end will come with a flood; even to the end there will be war; desolations are determined.

27 “And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate.”

The Hebrew in verse 27 says he will affirm the covenant with the rabbis. Everywhere else "the covenant" is spoken of in Daniel it refers to what it occasionally expresses as the holy covenant" the Law of Moses.

Jesus indeed lived by and fulfilled the Mosaic covenant, but he made no affirmation of it. He ushered in the New Covenant in his own blood. The "rabbis" rejected him and the New Covenant. Jesus fulfilled the Levitical sacrificial system which was prophetic of his own sacrifice, but it's end did not come for another 40 years.

Now, my friend, this "he" is the son of perdition who will purport to be the promised messiah and the Jews who reject Jesus as Messiah will accept this counterfeit as the genuine article. He will affirm the Old Covenant rebuild the temple and the Levitical sacrificial system will again be in place until the middle of the 70th week of Daniel, 1290 days from the end of human history:

Daniel 12:11-12 (NASB95)

11 “From the time that the regular sacrifice is abolished and the abomination of desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days.

12 “How blessed is he who keeps waiting and attains to the 1,335 days!

Verse 11 is counting back from the end. Verse 12 is counting forward from the beginning of the 70th Week of Daniel.

[douggg]

Now, my friend, this "he" is the son of perdition who will purport to be the promised messiah and the Jews who reject Jesus as Messiah will accept this counterfeit as the genuine article. He will affirm the Old Covenant rebuild the temple and the Levitical sacrificial system will again be in place until the middle of the 70th week of Daniel, 1290 days from the end of human history:

Daniel 12:11-12 (NASB95)

11 “From the time that the regular sacrifice is abolished and the abomination of desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days.

12 “How blessed is he who keeps waiting and attains to the 1,335 days!

Verse 11 is counting back from the end. Verse 12 is counting forward from the beginning of the 70th Week of Daniel.

Hi John, regarding your chart, the 1290 days and 1335 days, both are tied to the setting up of the AOD, in Daniel 12.

Where you have the 1290 days counting back (arrow to the left), I think you should have had as the 1335 days. That would give the day on the 7 years timeline of when the AOD will be setup to be worshiped (day 1185). You have the AOD setup to be worshiped on the first day of the 7years.

From the day on the timeline which the AOD is setup to be worshiped (day 1185), place the 1290 days arrow to the right. Which on that day (day 2475), the heavens will part and the world will see Jesus before the throne of God, sickle in hand.

The Rapture takes place on an unknown day. So we cannot put arrows pointing to it.

Doug

[Bold Believer]

Now, my friend, this "he" is the son of perdition who will purport to be the promised messiah and the Jews who reject Jesus as Messiah will accept this counterfeit as the genuine article. He will affirm the Old Covenant rebuild the temple and the Levitical sacrificial system will again be in place until the middle of the 70th week of Daniel, 1290 days from the end of human history:

Daniel 12:11-12 (NASB95)

11 “From the time that the regular sacrifice is abolished and the abomination of desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days.

12 “How blessed is he who keeps waiting and attains to the 1,335 days!

Verse 11 is counting back from the end. Verse 12 is counting forward from the beginning of the 70th Week of Daniel.

Hi John, regarding your chart, the 1290 days and 1335 days, both are tied to the setting up of the AOD, in Daniel 12.

Where you have the 1290 days counting back (arrow to the left), I think you should have had as the 1335 days. That would give the day on the 7 years timeline of when the AOD will be setup to be worshiped (day 1185). You have the AOD setup to be worshiped on the first day of the 7years.

From the day on the timeline which the AOD is setup to be worshiped (day 1185), place the 1290 days arrow to the right. Which on that day (day 2475), the heavens will part and the world will see Jesus before the throne of God, sickle in hand.

The Rapture takes place on an unknown day. So we cannot put arrows pointing to it.

Doug

We know exactly when the Rapture takes place.

Jhn 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day

Jhn 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jhn 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jhn 6:54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jhn 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

1Cr 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. (The changing of live Believers at the resurrection to glorified bodies IS the 'rapture'. It's not some secret catching away.)

If there seems to be a theme here, there is. Notice it? Last. L A S T. Not seven years before. Not three and half years before. Last. As in final. As in nothing after it.

Incidently, just where does this son of perdition EVER claim to be Messiah? The man of sin/lawlessness claims to be a god. Not Messiah, but a god. As they say in court, you assume facts not in evidence. I call this Franken-versing. Take a verse from A and a verse from K and a verse from Q and throw in Y and come up with something that supports your theory, but makes no sense in the overall scheme.

[douggg]

We know exactly when the Rapture takes place.

Exactly? Not exactly, because if so we could mark that day on our calendar.

Jhn 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day

Jhn 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jhn 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jhn 6:54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jhn 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

1Cr 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. (The changing of live Believers at the resurrection to glorified bodies IS the 'rapture'. It's not some secret catching away.)

If there seems to be a theme here, there is. Notice it? Last. L A S T. Not seven years before. Not three and half years before. Last. As in final. As in nothing after it.

Incidently, just where does this son of perdition EVER claim to be Messiah? The man of sin/lawlessness claims to be a god. Not Messiah, but a god. As they say in court, you assume facts not in evidence. I call this Franken-versing. Take a verse from A and a verse from K and a verse from Q and throw in Y and come up with something that supports your theory, but makes no sense in the overall scheme.

The question becomes what is meant by last day?. On the 6 days = 6000 years theory, each 1000 years being a day. At the last day would be right before the last day, the 1000 year reign of Christ begins. That is a general timeframe. Since the rapture has not taken place, the window is between now and the day that Jesus returns.

Messiah has it roots in "anointed". The person we call the Antichrist goes through 4 major stages in his career as it progresses.

Little horn politician stage; then false King Messiah to the Jews stage; then man of sin stage; then Antichrist-beast stage. So what he professes to be depends upon what stage he is in.

During his man of sin stage - he is not claiming to be a messiah, but God. When as the man of sin, he is killed, comes back to life to his Antichrist-beast stage, then it is very likely that he will claim to be a eternal life messiah. That is, if people believe in him as God, and that he overcame death - they would have eternal life.

Doug

Edited January 25, 2012 by douggg

[Retrobyter]

Shalom, JohnDB.

Daniel 9:27

And HE shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week HE shall cause the sacrifce and oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations HE shal make it desolate, even until the comsummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

So I was just wondering how everyone views the HE in Daniel 9:27. Please feel free to give opinion, but if possible it would be great if you give scripture to back up your view. I was just curious because I think I'm in the minority in my view of the He given in Daniel 9:27. As from what I hear most Christians say the He is the antichrist, and I just don't see this from this verse.

In case your wondering, yes I think the HE is Jesus Christ.

Daniel 9:24-27 (NASB95)

24 “Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to make an end of sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy place.

25 “So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; it will be built again, with plaza and moat, even in times of distress.

26 “Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city AND THE SANCTUARY. And its end will come with a flood; even to the end there will be war; desolations are determined.

27 “And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate.”

The Hebrew in verse 27 says he will affirm the covenant with the rabbis. Everywhere else "the covenant" is spoken of in Daniel it refers to what it occasionally expresses as the holy covenant" the Law of Moses.

Jesus indeed lived by and fulfilled the Mosaic covenant, but he made no affirmation of it. He ushered in the New Covenant in his own blood. The "rabbis" rejected him and the New Covenant. Jesus fulfilled the Levitical sacrificial system which was prophetic of his own sacrifice, but it's end did not come for another 40 years.

Now, my friend, this "he" is the son of perdition who will purport to be the promised messiah and the Jews who reject Jesus as Messiah will accept this counterfeit as the genuine article. He will affirm the Old Covenant rebuild the temple and the Levitical sacrificial system will again be in place until the middle of the 70th week of Daniel, 1290 days from the end of human history:

Daniel 12:11-12 (NASB95)

11 “From the time that the regular sacrifice is abolished and the abomination of desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days.

12 “How blessed is he who keeps waiting and attains to the 1,335 days!

Verse 11 is counting back from the end. Verse 12 is counting forward from the beginning of the 70th Week of Daniel.

For all your cutesy chart's beauty, the numbers are WRONG! The first thing you must come to realize is that, on the Jewish calendar, there's no such thing as a 12-month year. Secondly, the length of time in days per month averages to 29.5 days / month.

There's a REASON why the time periods are said three different ways! Forty-two months, which are literally "moonths" in the sense that they are based on the lunar cycle, would work out to 42 months x 29.5 days / month = 1,239 days! (The Jewish calendar basically has alternating months of 29 days and 30 days.) A time, times, and half a time working on the yearly average of 365.2422 days / year (and assuming that a "time" is a yearly "cycle") would be 365.2422 days / year * 3.5 years = 1,278 days! And of course, both of these are different than the 1,260 days (or the 1,290 days or the 1,335 days). I believe that these values are given PRECISELY as they should be understood, and that they do NOT automatically mean the same time period!

It's not as clear-cut as you would like.

[douggg]

Shalom, JohnDB.

Daniel 9:27

And HE shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week HE shall cause the sacrifce and oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations HE shal make it desolate, even until the comsummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

So I was just wondering how everyone views the HE in Daniel 9:27. Please feel free to give opinion, but if possible it would be great if you give scripture to back up your view. I was just curious because I think I'm in the minority in my view of the He given in Daniel 9:27. As from what I hear most Christians say the He is the antichrist, and I just don't see this from this verse.

In case your wondering, yes I think the HE is Jesus Christ.

Daniel 9:24-27 (NASB95)

24 “Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to make an end of sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy place.

25 “So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; it will be built again, with plaza and moat, even in times of distress.

26 “Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city AND THE SANCTUARY. And its end will come with a flood; even to the end there will be war; desolations are determined.

27 “And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate.”

The Hebrew in verse 27 says he will affirm the covenant with the rabbis. Everywhere else "the covenant" is spoken of in Daniel it refers to what it occasionally expresses as the holy covenant" the Law of Moses.

Jesus indeed lived by and fulfilled the Mosaic covenant, but he made no affirmation of it. He ushered in the New Covenant in his own blood. The "rabbis" rejected him and the New Covenant. Jesus fulfilled the Levitical sacrificial system which was prophetic of his own sacrifice, but it's end did not come for another 40 years.

Now, my friend, this "he" is the son of perdition who will purport to be the promised messiah and the Jews who reject Jesus as Messiah will accept this counterfeit as the genuine article. He will affirm the Old Covenant rebuild the temple and the Levitical sacrificial system will again be in place until the middle of the 70th week of Daniel, 1290 days from the end of human history:

Daniel 12:11-12 (NASB95)

11 “From the time that the regular sacrifice is abolished and the abomination of desolation is set up, there will be 1,290 days.

12 “How blessed is he who keeps waiting and attains to the 1,335 days!

Verse 11 is counting back from the end. Verse 12 is counting forward from the beginning of the 70th Week of Daniel.

For all your cutesy chart's beauty, the numbers are WRONG! The first thing you must come to realize is that, on the Jewish calendar, there's no such thing as a 12-month year. Secondly, the length of time in days per month averages to 29.5 days / month.

There's a REASON why the time periods are said three different ways! Forty-two months, which are literally "moonths" in the sense that they are based on the lunar cycle, would work out to 42 months x 29.5 days / month = 1,239 days! (The Jewish calendar basically has alternating months of 29 days and 30 days.) A time, times, and half a time working on the yearly average of 365.2422 days / year (and assuming that a "time" is a yearly "cycle") would be 365.2422 days / year * 3.5 years = 1,278 days! And of course, both of these are different than the 1,260 days (or the 1,290 days or the 1,335 days). I believe that these values are given PRECISELY as they should be understood, and that they do NOT automatically mean the same time period!

It's not as clear-cut as you would like.

Hi Roy, I don't think the current Jewish calendar reflects the calendar used back at the time of the Mt. Sinai covenant. A lunar cycle means that they actually went out and observed the moon.

Within the system of numbering the days prophecy wise, the year is made up of two half's of 1260 days each. The 42 months and the time times and half times are not as precise compared to 1260 days. The 42 months and the time times and half times, both end the day that Jesus returns. So those periods are both in the second half of the 7 years. So John's nice chart should only show the 42 months and time times and half times on the right side of the exact mid point.

Doug

[Bold Believer]

We know exactly when the Rapture takes place.

Exactly? Not exactly, because if so we could mark that day on our calendar.

Jhn 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day

Jhn 6:40 And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jhn 6:44 No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jhn 6:54 Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day.

Jhn 12:48 He that rejecteth me, and receiveth not my words, hath one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall judge him in the last day.

1Cr 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. (The changing of live Believers at the resurrection to glorified bodies IS the 'rapture'. It's not some secret catching away.)

If there seems to be a theme here, there is. Notice it? Last. L A S T. Not seven years before. Not three and half years before. Last. As in final. As in nothing after it.

Incidently, just where does this son of perdition EVER claim to be Messiah? The man of sin/lawlessness claims to be a god. Not Messiah, but a god. As they say in court, you assume facts not in evidence. I call this Franken-versing. Take a verse from A and a verse from K and a verse from Q and throw in Y and come up with something that supports your theory, but makes no sense in the overall scheme.

The question becomes what is meant by last day?. On the 6 days = 6000 years theory, each 1000 years being a day. At the last day would be right before the last day, the 1000 year reign of Christ begins. That is a general timeframe. Since the rapture has not taken place, the window is between now and the day that Jesus returns.

Messiah has it roots in "anointed". The person we call the Antichrist goes through 4 major stages in his career as it progresses.

Little horn politician stage; then false King Messiah to the Jews stage; then man of sin stage; then Antichrist-beast stage. So what he professes to be depends upon what stage he is in.

During his man of sin stage - he is not claiming to be a messiah, but God. When as the man of sin, he is killed, comes back to life to his Antichrist-beast stage, then it is very likely that he will claim to be a eternal life messiah. That is, if people believe in him as God, and that he overcame death - they would have eternal life.

Doug

Sorry Douggy, last means last. And the 1000 years =one day statement is merely a metaphor for the way God sees time through eternal perspective since He is outside of time.

Nero is the little horn. The one who makes with and overcomes the saints for 42 months. This is a historical fact that he did so within the prophetic timeframe John outlines. Nero suffers the fatal head wound and the Empire nearly crumbles. But the beast (Rome) makes it through the political turmoil (wars and rumors of wars spoken of by Jesus).

Antichrist...Revelation was written by John, but he never mentions antichrist(s), because they hadn't yet come on the stage. Nero is not the antichrist, he is the 6th head of Rome. He is called the Beast because he personifies what Rome had become. Rome is Daniel's dreaded 4th Beast-nation. John defines what an antichrist is. This little horn doesn't qualify. Oh...not only that, but John doesn't mention antichrists until I John 2, and that was written after Revelation's events, so antichrist is outside the timeframe of what John was writing of.

[douggg]

Sorry Douggy, last means last.

uh, when was the "last" time you were wrong? Was it truly the "last" ?

And the 1000 years =one day statement is merely a metaphor for the way God sees time through eternal perspective since He is outside of time.

Sure it is metaphoric, but there is also a basis for the 7 day, 7000 year theory. Adam and Eve were told that in they day they ate of the forbidden tree, they would die. Well, Adam died 930 years later, so that could only mean that day is 1000 years long in that particular case. In the 7 day/7000 year theory, there are 4000 years from Adam to Jesus, then 2000 years have passed, leaving the last day as the 1000 year millenium.

Nero is the little horn. The one who makes with and overcomes the saints for 42 months. This is a historical fact that he did so within the prophetic timeframe John outlines. Nero suffers the fatal head wound and the Empire nearly crumbles. But the beast (Rome) makes it through the political turmoil (wars and rumors of wars spoken of by Jesus).

Antichrist...Revelation was written by John, but he never mentions antichrist(s), because they hadn't yet come on the stage. Nero is not the antichrist, he is the 6th head of Rome. He is called the Beast because he personifies what Rome had become. Rome is Daniel's dreaded 4th Beast-nation. John defines what an antichrist is. This little horn doesn't qualify. Oh...not only that, but John doesn't mention antichrists until I John 2, and that was written after Revelation's events, so antichrist is outside the timeframe of what John was writing of.

Nero didn't live after being mortally wounded. And Domitian, neither one was cast alive into the lake of fire. The 42 months of the Antichrist beast in Revelation 13 end when Jesus returns, so that period of time is still future.

The little horn is the person who will eventually become the Antichrist, in his first stage of four stages of his career. So, he is not an antichrist, nor the Antichrist, at that time. The persons John was speaking of were antichrists; John was not defining the Antichrist.

I don't have any disagreement that the 4th empire is the Roman Empire of the past. But I believe that it is also end-times.

Doug